Going from a '19 Audi TTRS to a '22 GR86...what should I know?
 

As the title suggests, I'm looking at trading in my 2019 Audi TTRS for a 2022 (or '23) GR86 Premium. Prior to the current Audi, I had a 2018 Porsche Cayman S, and prior to that, had a 2013 Audi TTRS.

I'm looking to "downsize" and fully expect that I will be giving up some of the comforts, technology, and power of the Audi, but am hoping to maintain the "fun" factor. Of course, mod'ing the car is absolutely NOT out of the question, either.

So, with that said, what should I know about the GR86 platform, drivetrain, etc. before pulling the trigger on one?

You pretty much nailed the "must" know stuff on your own in your opening statements.
It is NOT an Audi nor a Porsche and as long as you totally get that then you will be fine with it.
It is simply an inexpensive (comparatively of course) basic sportscar that although well equipped is still not at Audi levels.
No amount of mods will bring it to Audi levels. Unless of course you end up spending so much you may as well have bought and Audi in the first place.

This covers it pretty well. All I would add is that paring away the stuff Porsche or Audi adds to their cars can create a "purer" experience.

I'm not saying that it does, since that's a very subjective thing that varies from person to person, and different people like cars to behave different ways. But on one end of the spectrum you have these gorgeous cars built with far less regard to final sticker price, and on the other end of the spectrum you have an open-wheel adult-size go-kart that has zero creature comforts and an absolute riot to drive. The GR86 is somewhere about a third of the way from the go-kart.

And if you do modify it enough that it's basically every bit as good as the Audi in every way that matters to you... sure, it'll probably cost as much as the Audi. But to me there's a big difference between a just-off-the-showroom Audi and a custom-built for-you-by-you GR86 (or similar car).

Purely my opinion: the Audis and Porsches of the world are 100% cars. The GR86 is a go-kart with enough body panels and airbags to let you register it with the DMV. It's nice enough to daily drive, but when you push it you feel more like you're driving something that shouldn't be on the street. To me, that's just more fun.

Appreciate the insight. I fully understand that it's not an Audi nor a Porsche, but I'm also looking to move away from the price tag associated with those cars, and fully appreciate that in doing so I'll be giving up some of the "conveniences" of my previous vehicles.

Very well said. While my Audi and my previous Porsche were fun cars, they offer such a disconnected driving experience (the Audi more-so than the Porsche). I have yet to test drive an 86/BRZ, but am hoping to do so within the next week or so. In "downsizing", as I mentioned, I'm really looking forward to a more pure driving experience, as I really don't need all the bells and whistles the Audi has.

You'll be getting a lot of car for the money, mpg's will not be a worry (I can't remember getting under 30), and it is a lot of fun.

However, the build quality and amenities will probably be lacking compared to your reference points, and so will the engine note. I like the sound of my flat four, but it ain't got nothing on a modern flat six or an RS five-pot.

Also, as road trip machines go, it'll be a tad noisy and rough. I went wild camping in Norway with mine and had loads of fun, but when cruising at 80mph it's not the most comfortable thing out there.

Still, it's the only car I've been able to own for over two years (five and counting).

If the Audi was more disconnected then why did you go back to the TTRS after owning a Cayman? Did you just prefer the AWD, rear seats, sound of the five cylinder, etc? I'm just interested what motivated you then and what changed, and I'm curious of your personal review of the two cars.

I'm assuming you plan on driving the GR86 before you buy it. That will probably let you know instantly. The Audi is a dual clutch, and I don't know if you had an auto Cayman, and I don't know if you plan to get a manual or auto, but if it is an auto, you may find going from a dual clutch to a torque converter to be a big downgrade. The gearing will be better in the 86 over a manual Porsche, as you may have heard. Make sure to take the car over bad roads, so you can assess whether the ride quality and interior noise is tolerable compared to your Audi and Porsche. The increase in rattles and creaks from cheaper materials and build quality is worse, yet probably won't be a deal breaker, but the road compliance and lack of sound deadening might be more of an issue.

I don't know if you modify cars, but that could be a factor. Yes, the car has less horsepower, but it also has less potential. While you can get more power with forced induction, there are limitations. With pump gas, sub-300whp is possible, but you will need E85 for more, and the engine and transmission is somewhat reliable sub-375-400whp, probably. The previous generation is sub-350whp for the engine and sub-400whp for the transmission, so expect a little more for both with this new engine. The advantage over the Porsche is there are far more aftermarket support and FI options. The disadvantage over the Audi is the motor is the FA24 is not designed for boost, so the high compression, again, requires E85 for any significant power gains.

Go for a test drive. I have a 16 BRZ auto and a 14 cayman PDK. They are both a blast. I much prefer the sound of the 2.7l in the cayman, but the BRZ is more playful with normal driving. Of course the auto is nothing compared to the PDK, buts it’s still fun. If you get a manual even more fun. And of course the interior is not as nice. But even after a spirited run in the cayman I can jump in the BRZ and it still puts a smile on my face. Probably best smiles per dollar car.

You're less likely to need a flatbed

Going to try to answer all your questions. To preface, I would probably still have my '13 TTRS had it not been totaled by an idiot driver as that car has easily been my favorite of all the vehicles I've owned (which is quite a substantial list that I won't delve into). After my '13 TTRS (which was 6MT and I had it tuned, turbo-back exhaust, intake) was totaled, I didn't spend much time looking and immediately jumped into the '18 Cayman S (also 6MT, also modded it, had turbo-back exhaust and tune). Had the Porsche for ~10 months before deciding I missed having a semi-functional back seat (don't have any kids, but I do have small dogs), and I couldn't stand the gearing in the 6MT of the Porsche. The gearing alone made it almost impossible to have fun in the car during "normal" driving. So, having absolutely LOVED my '13 TTRS, I started looking for another one and knew they were coming back as a Mk3 for the 2018+ MY. Also discovered that they would ONLY be coming State-side with the 7-speed DSG (dual-clutch auto) but I was OK with that. So, long story short, found a brand new 2019 TTRS and pulled the trigger. I've had the '19 TTRS for about 2.5 years now and have modded it a little bit (E85 stage 1 tune, intake, downpipe), and the car is a monster on the street (almost TOO fast for spirited street driving, but I digress). However, I'm getting a little bit older and don't really need/want the attention nor price tag that I have with my current Audi, hence looking into 'downsizing' and getting a back-to-basics sports car. Also, I work from home and have for years (long before COVID hit), so none of my previous Audi's/Porsche, nor will the GR86 I am eyeballing be daily drivers. To add some context, my '19 TTRS was purchased with 107 miles on it, and 2.5 years later, it just crossed over 8500 miles. I simply don't drive that much to be honest. Also, with the GR86, I would be going back to a 6MT, which I'm very much looking forward to. Hopefully that provides some insight!

Absolutely planning on a test drive ASAP! Appreciate the insight/comparison between your BRZ and Cayman!

Oh god, your post made me laugh. The struggles I've gone through when needing a tow with the Audi's still stresses me out.

Finally got word from my Toyota dealership that they have a 2023 Trueno Blue Premium 6MT coming in Friday! Will be going to test drive it on Monday and will let you know how everything turns out!

Surprising that with the demand and backlog of orders they will let anybody test drive one!

IMO the biggest downgrade will be power. I would describe the 86 as adequate.

I had a big turbo mazdaspeed 6 a few cars prior to this one making about ~380hp/~400+tq to the wheels and it was AWD. It was a very comfortable car with leather, heated seats, moon roof, keyless entry and start etc. With AWD, e85, engine mounts, and ~23lbs of boost from a 3071 coming on by ~3200 RPM the car felt violently quick in 1st and 2nd.

The 86 is still one of my favorite cars. IMO it also sounds quite good if you carefully select your exhaust set up.

As long as you aren't a roll racer on the highway, I think you'll enjoy the twin.

Not that I would 100% recommend this, but you don't actually buy a car until you sign the paperwork.

Dealerships should let you show up to "buy the car" and then do a quick test drive before you sign. Assuming all goes well, you buy. But you're not on the hook until then, so if there's something that's a deal-breaker you can back out.

It's not like they're going to have trouble finding a buyer in the next few days...

Many dealerships will not allow test drives even if you are buying that car. If the customer doesn't buy it and another comes along and wants a test drive and doesn't take it then another and another it soon becomes a demonstrator and sells for less.

The fact that they won't have trouble selling it was exactly my point as to why I was surprised they agreed.

The dealership near me had no problem with me taking a 2022 for a test drive last month. And I didn't show up in a TTRS lol.

Getting ready to post my initial impressions of the car, as I did buy it, but you are spot on. The ONLY thing I miss about the Audi is the torque, but I'll get used to it!

Ha, I do enjoy the occasional roll race, but AWD + launch control is also a riot on the street!

So, quick update, I bought the 86! Audi is gone! Initial impressions:

Car was MUCH louder/more aggressive sounding than I expected it to be... then I found out after test driving it that it had the GR Performance Exhaust optioned.. so that explains that! Car also had the auto-dimming rear-view mirror, which was weirdly a big plus for me (do all of the 86's/BRZ's have this?). Upon initial drive, I could immediately tell that the car was MUCH lighter than the Audi and felt WAAY more agile. I think the lower center of gravity plays a huge part here. Interior quality was better than I expected, although the shifter seems kinda "flimsy" compared to my previous Porsche/Audi 6-speeds. Also, brakes feel very unresponsive and kinda mushy with little feedback... any tips on how I can fix this with aftermarket upgrades? The brakes are honestly the biggest "complaint" I have about the car. The seats are WAY more comfortable than I expected, and in my opinion, the car is quite a bit more comfortable than my TTRS in terms of seats, ride quality, etc. But, keep in mind the Audi was on factory 20" wheels with 30-series tires... so a lot of that may be the wheel/tire sizing and the larger side-wall providing a level of dampening that I am simply not accustomed to. Road vibrations and cabin noise were VERY acceptable... but the car only has ~270 miles on it and as noted above, also has the GR Performance Exhaust so maybe that's drowning out some of the noise? Aside from the brakes and major step down in torque/power levels, the car is an absolute RIOT to drive and extremely compliant when letting the back-end step out (I've missed being able to do that SOO much!). I will certainly enjoy this car for however long I decide to keep it!

Have you really bedded in the brakes? Mine felt kind of soft until I really went through a nice bedding procedure with them, now they feel great.

I have not, I'll be out driving the car shortly so plan on running through a good bedding routine then and will report back!

Regarding the brakes; I have the same issue going back and forth between my 2020 BRZ (Brembo) and 2021 MINI JCW. The MINI's brakes are very grabby at the top of the pedal while the BRZ is a more linear brake pedal.

See if you don't get used to it after a spell.

If you don't, try the TRD/GR brake pads that they offered on the Gen 1 if those are still available. I loved those on my 2016 FR-S.

I didn't read through everyone's responses but having come from a 997 Porsche 911 to a 2023 BRZ I'll tell you one thing that caught me off guard at first. The BRZ is LOUD in comparison, little to no sound deadening, lots of road and tire noise. Now we know its all in the name of weight savings, but its something that made me appreciate the old 911.

Appreciate the insight! I think that is what's throwing me off, as the Audi's brakes were VERY grabby at the top of the pedal and having to apply a LOT more brake pressure in the GR86 makes them feel 'disconnected' to me... hopefully a proper bedding procedure and the good ol' fashioned "getting used to it" serve me well.

Yea, the GR86 is certainly louder than my previous Audi's and Porsche, but I happen to enjoy it!

Also, forgot to post about the sound system... going from the Bang & Olufsen setup in my Audi to the GR86 was a BIG difference. So, I'll certainly be looking to upgrade the speakers in the GR86.

You will finally get to experience oversteer lol.

I'm with you on that, I enjoyed the Bose system in the 911, I currently have the OEM Audio+ speaker upgrades sitting in the garage waiting for me to find time to be put on.

To be fair, I'd much prefer a linear pedal. Or at least not grabby at the top. And in the Audi, you're comparing fixed calipers to sliding calipers, so the feel is never going to be the same.

Not installed yet, but I've already purchased the front 6 speakers from OEM Audio+. Just waiting for the sub/amp setup to be released so I can do them all at once.

So, having had the car for a few days now and putting a few hundred miles on it, this car is an ABSOLUTE RIOT!! Holy FUN! I'll be honest, I was NOT expecting this car to be this fun coming from the TTRS... but whoever equated it to a go-kart with enough panels and airbags to be registered with the DMV, that is SO true! I'm not sure if it's the power levels, going from AWD to RWD, or stepping back into a manual... but I'm having WAY more fun with this car than I EVER had with the TTRS. Very glad I decided to pull the trigger and buy this car and get rid of the Audi!

Also, after a proper bedding procedure and just getting used to the sliding vs. fixed calipers, I no longer have an issue with the brakes.

Still going to upgrade the sound system, but I often find myself driving with NO music at all and just enjoying the sound of the car.

Also, I have already started buying parts, lol. First order of business will be the OEM/JDM clear side markers, window tint, and a professional detail and ceramic coating.

Awesome! Glad you're enjoying it!

I had the OEM Audio+ speakers, GR premium ducktail, and coilovers all here before I even picked up the car! Had it ceramic coated and the front bumper and lights and rear rockers done with PPF within a few days of picking it up.

Still need to drive it more. I've had it two months and it only has 430 miles on it.

Brake pedal: Better pads and fluid will make up some of that difference. If you still want a stiffer pedal, then a big brake kit will be the next step. If you want the audi "bite", then the pads will get the job done.

Did you turn off the fake noise?

I got the poverty level '13 FRS.
It has a bezel around the rear view and no blinkety-tech.
That year some had a rear view with glass to the edges and a garage remote adapter in the higher level trim.
My "audio system" is also the pov-spec and I never use it unless parked somewhere waiting for someone else.
It does a job, but it will never be Carnegie Hall levels of eargasm.

I like the seats too.

Glad you like your motorized roller skate.

If you do end up wanting more street stopping power down the road, a simple pad change to something life the ferodo ds2500 would be an easily and nice upgrade from stock pads imo. And now that ecutek has released tuning software, within a few months we should see solutions for headers and tune (let alone FI) which should be providing a nice bump in torque at a reasonably low cost, so the day you feel you want a bit more, there should be plenty of options to get it to be the perfect car for you… but truly this car car be enjoyed for years in stock form, as you explore and discover it more… enjoy!

Oh, this is definitely not my first RWD sports car, so I'm very familiar with oversteer.

Where did you snag the OEM Audio+ speakers if you don't mind my asking? Have started buying parts for the car already, and have it scheduled for full PPF and tint next week!

Appreciate the tips! I have not turned off the active sound control yet, but will be doing so very soon!

Yea, my GR86 just rolled over 800 miles. Still absolutely LOVING this car and have already washed it twice even though it's garaged lol.

Motorized roller skate is a fantastic analogy, appreciate that one lol

Appreciate the tips sir!

Direct from them. https://oemaudioplus.com/
I too had a pile of parts waiting for the car to arrive... I've had the car a couple weeks now and am still working on it.

Appreciate the link! I'm reading that the Premium has 8 speakers and an amplifier, but looking at the OEM Audio+, it only comes with a 6-speaker upgrade? Does anyone know where the extra 2 speakers are, what size they are, and what the specs on the OEM amp are?

There are two 6.5" mid-bass drivers (one in each door), a Mid and tweeter combo on each corner of the dash, and two tiny speakers in the rear trim next to the rear passenger seats, for a total of 8 individual speakers..

The current OEM plus replaces the Door and Dash speakers (6 individual speakers), but will offer a subwoofer and amp with custom DSP tuning soon (like the first gen)..

I don't know if OEM plus will have replacements for the rear seat speakers or not, but shoot them an email, they are pretty responsive..

May want to check out these links as well:

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=148031

https://www.ft86club.com/forums/show...ight=OEM+Audio

Grabby pedal at the top normally is a characteristic of the Brake Booster, that is called jump-in. This can be adjusted with a little bit of work.

European vehicles tend to have a higher jump-in that gives a sensation of a quick brakes. Lower junp-in is good for better modulation of the braking.

Yeah, like was said, the other two are little 4s I think for the back seat. My back seat will never be used and you want the soundstage up front so I don't care about them.

Not sure about specs on the OEM amp, again don't really care since I plan on replacing it when OEM Audio+ releases their amp/sub package to go with the rest of the upgrade.