Car not starting, no crank. ABS Light and Engine Light On
 

Hey everyone! I’m kinda new here so it’s awesome to be on the forum. I had a quick question.

So recently I changed my clutch out on my 2013 Scion FR-S and of course changed the gear oil. I used Royal Blue. I know some people have said that it’s crap but I read that after I threw it into the car. I think I might have overfilled it because my car is running a bit sluggish. Is that maybe the new clutch getting broken in or is that a common issue with too much oil? When I plugged it the car was still weeping a steady stream of oil, but I couldn’t feel a pool of oil when my finger went in so I assumed it was below the line. I’m a bit confused. This is my second clutch job, the first being on a manual Jeep, so any advice would be appreciated.

Also, my shifter falls into gear without needing the clutch. I’m assuming that means my clutch pedal needs adjusting, but any reassurance on that? :burnrubber:
Thanks a bunch

Assuming the battery was disconnected, the ECU has to re-learn some parameters after having lost power. Give it a few cycles to sort out your throttle pedal and such.

You would have to try really hard to overfill the transmission. I'm sure it's fine.

Clutch mechanism is self-adjusting. It's possible to improperly adjust the pedal throw but the worst outcome is a slipping clutch. Did you adjust the pedal?

I haven’t adjusted the pedal at all I just left it stock. I went ahead and drained the transmission even further and waited til it stopped weeping. But now the car won’t start. I took it to a dealership a while ago and they suspected a wiring issue but I’m not even sure where to start with that. I changed the throw out bearing because I thought it was getting stuck on the retainer cover (which ended up not even being that worn) but my bearing was pretty whooped so I made the change. Whenever it does this I pop the clutch in 1st while the car was rolling I managed to get it started.

Any idea? I might just post in another forum bc I feel this is a deeper issue.

Respect for bump starting old school. Not starting is a separate issue. I dunno. You could just edit the thread title. There are, like, 20 people who get into troubleshooting topics here. All the right folks will see this.

Does the starter motor even click when it quits working? Ever try tapping it? Worn motor brushes show up as dead spots in the motor's arcs of rotation. For a while, tapping the motor can get them to make contact enough to start.

Check that the ground strap to the bell housing is attached/clean/tight.

THAT is SOOOOO old school - :rolleyes:

Fess up, Ultramaroon, you ARE related to Bubba - :confused0068:

The starter doesn’t even make a sound. I checked my battery and it reads 12.63 volts. Too a whack at the starter and solenoid and still nothing. I checked the ground bolted to the bell housing and it’s tight. Here are some photos. I saw that the solenoid was a bit scratched up so maybe it’s been banged on in the past. Oriellys will test it tomorrow once I’m home from school. To add, the ABS and Engine lights are on when I turn the key to power the car (not starting) but there are no codes so I’m guessing it’s like that before the car is running. I literally started it this morning after the clutch job, twice, and drove it around. Only when it sat did it not want to turn on. And that’s been the case for the last two months. Sometimes I used to (I know this is stupid but it wassss fun every now and then) rock the car while inside it and occasionally that would get it started. But eventually it stopped working.

I’m wondering, how to I test how much voltage is reaching the starter? Is it the little white wire going to the solenoid plus the ground, or the thick one next to that tiny one that’s bolted on + the ground?

check your clutch switch, they're prone for going out, and will cause a no-start condition as well.

if you're not getting any click at all out of the starter/relay, i don't believe the starter is the problem

Put a multimeter on the battery and check voltage while someone else cranks the car over and tell us what it reads.

i bet it's 12.63v

If it’s the clutch switch.

The clutch switches tend to burn out with the keyless systems. With keyed ignition switches, one would have to be in the habit of letting go of the clutch before releasing the key to the "run" position. Nobody does that.


Get someone to (try to) crank the starter while you're testing voltage between chassis ground and the thin wire to the solenoid. If there's juice, everything inside the cabin is good. If not, it gets complicated.

Okay so did a thing. I tested the voltage of my battery again yet this time (about two hours later and using my light inside my car to crank while checking starter) it was 12.53v, and dropped to 12.34v when trying to start the car. Still nothing other than the typical humming, no sound coming from starter. I haven’t tested the little wire yet so I’m gonna do that tomorrow and get back to you guys. Would that indicate a wiring issue inside the car? Like to the radio or something? Because whenever I try to start it everything shuts off for a moment then turns back on but it’s been like that since I got it. Also, is the clutch switch for only the car starting? I live in LA and traffic can be buttcheeks, pushing the clutch in and out frequently. Maybe that could burn it out faster? And is the starter relay in ze box?

Really appreciate the help with diagnostics btw. Y’all are awesome and hella funny lol

Take the battery in for a load test. Pretty much any larger parts store can do it. If it is dropping out then coming back on you may have a battery issue even though the voltage looks fine.

Nobody has asked yet but is the car all stock? No headlight, taillight, HU etc swaps?

The relay is #45 in the attached diagram. There are also a couple of fuses. #21 under hood and #14 under dash. If it is so intermittent it could be the relay.

https://www.autogenius.info/scion-fr...e-box-diagram/

lol I just realized this is a no crank situation. There are so many of these threads right now, 4 by the same guy, I got confused.

Somebody merged all those others and now it looks like we are all just repeating ourselves.

When you say bounce around inside the car did it inch forward and then it started normally? I had a car that I always backed in places so that if the flywheel came to rest on the dead spot it had, I had to get it to rotate some by moving the car forward a few inches. Eventually I replaced flywheel but that was my work around for months.

That would make sense if the starter was at least spinning. He isn't even getting a click.

Jiggle the steering wheel off the column locks. If the wheel is on the locks it will not start.

I don't care. The right people know what's up. Links still work.

some of us just know what's down.

Back with another update. I’m planning on taking both the starter and battery to the store tomorrow to check if they’re good. Car is completely stock, no modifications.

I checked the fuses and none were popped. Swapped #14 for a horn fuse with the same voltage, and it started! Turned it off, and then it didn’t want to start again. Swapped the fuse again (other horn fuse), it starts! Turn the car off, it doesn’t start AGAIN. Swapped the fuse for a third time with another good fuse (AC)…it starts. I drive it around after draining the transmission fluid a bit, that fixed the sluggishness. I park the car, turn it off…it doesn’t turn on AGAIN. I can hear a clicking around the location of the fuse box under the dash so I’m thinking that at least works. Swapped the relay with the dimmer relay and nothing. Tested the original starter relay (only the two vertical pegs, as I don’t have the tools to change them and test the horizontal ones for continuity) using Ohms, and the reading dropped to 0 or some lower numbers, fluctuating.

Lastly I tested the starter wire like explained earlier using the chassis as a ground. Absolutely no reading when turning over the car. I did that before swapping all the fuses around, before I got the car running. Every time it didn’t want to turn back on I tested it and found no reading.

Clutch switch, starter wiring harness, or relay? Take a guess lol or maybe something worse?

Here’s a photo of the starter #14 fuse before swapping it for the horn fuse for the first time.

You should ohm out the fuses that you swapped out after it didn't start. Since you didn't do that I'm guessing you're blowing fuses and you have a short somewhere.

Starter and battery will both be fine. You have a multimeter. Use it to check the fuses you've been swapping but it would be obvious from just looking at them. Something doesn't add up.

If they’re slightly pink does that mean they’re burnt? They aren’t broken. Also, will a missing/bad turn signal cause a short? Or would it be more likely that it’s along the starter harness?

Dunno for sure. Use the continuity or resistance mode on the multimeter, or use the horn socket as your fuse tester. I don't know what you mean by missing/bad. Which is it?

Turn signal bulb went out and I haven’t replaced it.

That's nothing. Test the fuses to be sure of those before moving on to investigate other causes.

Another update.

So first things first, I checked all the fuses I swapped out for continuity and they were all okay. I was able to start the car three times back to back this morning, that of which happened after I forgot where the stop light fuse went, yet the only issue was that the ABS light was still on. I left it for an hour, put the fuse back in, and the car didn’t start again. Took the same fuse out, no start. I installed a new battery, and still no start. I did this DC Amp test (saw on Chrisfix YT channel) to check for parasitic draw where I disconnected the negative terminal, set my multimeter to DCA and put the positive lead on the negative terminal on the battery, and the negative lead on the negative terminal going to the car. Here’s a photo for an idea. The meter read -.20 but fell off to -.05, then 0.00 after prolonged contact. When I took breaks in between eventually it dropped all the way to 0.00 with no change. I replaced the left turning signal for peace of mind. I put in the replacement fuses for the ABS, the #13 under the dash and #13 in the box up top.

Brake pedal is hard after turning the car off. I’m wondering if it’s the stupid clutch switch or the starter harness, but that would contradict my parasitic draw test. Is it possible the ABS will trigger if I need new brakes? That doesn’t make sense to me bc the brake fluid will compensate but at this point I’m running out of ideas.

Fuck me... Try this.


Take out the stop light fuse again and disconnect the battery for a few secs. Then reconnect the battery with the stop light fuse still removed. Does it start?

are we sure this isn't the immobilizer circuit?

it's starting to be the only thing that makes sense anymore. i don't know if the key-type immobilizer on these cars just controls the fuel pump or if it prevents the starter from turning over...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3K0ntbc024

Boys…we might have done it.

So in a drunken rage, I snipped off a part of the little wire that slides onto the solenoid and pried it open. Gunk everywhere, so cleaned that out. I looked up how to bypass the relay with a wire and tried that to make sure the solenoid was okay which it was. I clamped the end of the wire to the solenoid back on, and tried it. Nothing. Went to the relay, swapped with the large horn relay. Nothing. I then said fuck it, had my cousin start the car while I used the wire to turn on the starter, and we just let it sit. I drive it to Oriellys and tested the alternator which was good. Bought a continuity bulb tester and tried it out on the now restored end to the solenoid, and we now have continuity. PLUS, I don’t know wtf happened, but it seems the relay we swapped is now working like a charm. Don’t know why it didn’t work before and don’t care. I can at least get around and to work. Once I get paid, I’m going to take it to the dealer and ask for a new main harness. What I have now looks so damn Mickey Mouse I won’t trust it running with the car for the next couple months.

Thank you guys so much for all your help. I learned so much from this, and I almost had to pay $1100 at the dealership to “fix” this, which I doubt they would have because last time they gave me a battery that was too big and was probably the reason why my fuses were all burnt like that.

Now onto the next issue. My clutch is practically useless bc I can just push my shifter into any gear without engaging the clutch pedal.

Thanks a lot boys!

i used to have a ford ranger that the turn signal would go wonky every few weeks. the fix? take it out, drop it on the ground a few times, and then reinstall. it'd start working again for a while...

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