Anyone not buying to avoid early issues like 1st gen FRS?
 

Just wondering. But I think a lot of the car is from the 1st gen?

The 1st year issues are always exaggerated. you're still buying a car with a warranty after all. Yes the early cars typically have more recalls, but on the BRZ/gt86 it was pretty much limited to tail light gaskets.

Note: The big scary valve spring recall was not a 1st year production issue, it affected other Subarus that had been in production for a while as well. Metal supplier faked the material certification reports for a batch of valve springs. Very shitty, but not exactly under Subaru's control.

I will be buying day 1 if I can. Only thing that will stop me is if they don't have the color I want or they mark up to the point I can get a WRX STI or something.

i always prefer waiting a year. makes me feel better others were the guinea pig.

People still pretend that MY13 cars were blowing up left and right from valve springs when that wasn't the case at all.. Some were even foolish enough to the sell the car for a loss after the recall and blame the car despite the faults being clearly linked to technicians.



This new car comes with a warranty and lessons learned. There's no beta version.

I am sure they will sell all the first year models with no issues. There will probably even be an MSRP premium if they can't build many due to covid production restrictions

The only part I would call into question is the engine because it is the most changed. But the Ascent's engine has been problem free, and since that is the starting point, I wouldn't worry.

The rest of the car has been tweaked and refined. Both transmissions are carry forward. The suspension seems to be as well.

There are new electronics, like the dash screen that could bug out, but that should be covered under the 5 year warranty.

You might want to wait only to find out if there is going to be a GR86 Sport or some other special addition that adds Brembos, Dampers, and a special color.

I definitely see Toyota/Subaru doing that. It would be a step backwards to ditch the "performance pack".
They're smart and will probably offer it on later years to keep interest.

I prefer to buy clearance on the facelift version (4 to 5 yrs from now). After the hype die down and dealer will offer a lot of discount ($3k to $4k CAD) here in Canada.

That's the main reason. Plus, wanting to wait and see how the car is (which I'm mostly sold on), options and what kinds of discounts after car sales peak.

Had the og 86 from dec 2012, was an incredible car till the day I sold it in 2020.

Reliability and quality control was amazing - I didn't even had a creak or a rattle, let alone something wrong with it in all those 8 years.

Did all the mandatory recalls, which just ended up saving me money to be honest because they got in and replaced the sparkplugs for me when they did the valve spring!

I did not really mod my car though, if that matters.

I have deposited on both GR86 and BRZ, after test drive I'll choose and depending on colour availability I might be lucky enough to walk away with one this year.

One thing I will say that happens in the first year is that _everyone_ wants to talk to you about the car.

From my understanding, between 75-80% of the 2013's were written off due to defects. I was in the lucky 20% and only had a few water droplets in one taillight. If that is a deterrent to you, wait it out.

Where in hell did you come up with that number? That is not even basicly realistic.

:bellyroll:

I should add that the dealer included the special order code supercharger with mine as well. I was at the eye doctor earlier in the day and he put some funny droplets in my eye. I was winking uncontrollably while placing the order so he went ahead and allowed me to order secret code ZN6HKS.

I'm not worried about early model issues since it will probably be another year or two before I can make the jump to the new model. It would be longer but I'm done with any sort of changes to my current BRZ lol

:coolpics:

Every single first model year vehicle my family has ever bought since the early 70s had some sort of issue. Most were relatively minor (the 9 trips to the dealer for HU updates due to it freezing with my wife's 17 Impreza) but some were serious enough (the seized engine two blocks from the dealership on my dad's Jeep Cherokee) that I will shy away if possible.
Now is a sample size of 6 people and may 10 vehicles so indicative of a trend? No, it isn't but it is enough for me on a personal level.
Other experiences will vary.

If I like what I see when they finally hit the dealers, wouldn't have a problem placing an order since I would be taking delivery in Spring 2022. By that time, production should have tweaked any early production issues.

I leased my 2013 - it allowed me to have the flexibility to hand it back if it proved problematic, or to buy it back if I wanted to. That said, you do have to pay for that flexibility (in the form of interest). My car was pretty much fine (no taillight issues, only issue was that the passenger-side heated seats didn't really work).

Unfortunately I'm in a situation where I'll need to wait a few years anyways (need my youngest to be able to crawl into the back and into the car seat himself), so it's moot for me - I'll just see if I like the facelift changes more than the savings on the first year cars.

Hasn't it been confirmed that the FA24D has more in common with the FA20D than it does the FA24F?

Yes, the media just jumped on the Ascent engine link because 2.4 L so it must be the same engine.

Its also so they can cry:

"WHY DOES THE FA24 IN THE TWINS HAVE NO TURBO? ITS TURBO'D ON THE ASCENT AND MAKES 260HP!!! TOYOBARU YOU FAILED EVERY SINGLE ENTHUSIASNT IN THE WORLD AND NO ONE WILL BUY THIS CAR CUZ ITS GONNA BE TOO SLOW (a little less too slow than the first gens but still too slow!)"

Also

"THE CAR HAS TO HAVE THE ONE TOUCH 3 BLINK TURN SIGNALS OR ITS A DEAL BREAKER!!!"

:iono:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_FA_engine#FA24

"Like the preceding FA20D, the FA24D uses the Toyota D-4S fuel injection system, which combines direct and port injection. It has the same displacement as the FA24F turbocharged engine with an identical 94×86 mm bore and stroke, but the compression level is increased to 12.5:1."

I'm not a tech expert, so anyone please help. They are both classified as "FA24" engines. But I understand that there are differences and it isn't just that they took off the turbo and increased the redline.

But I'm assuming there must be enough of a link to suggest that increasing the displacement won't be an issue because the larger displacement has already been tested on the Ascent and it is reliable. If the Ascent didn't exist and they were increasing the displacement for the first time, I might be more hesitant. Or at least that is what I meant. Not that this is just a non-turbo Ascent motor.

The FA24 designation is just the basic block and displacement.
Same idea (as you touched on) that there was the FA20D and FA20F engines in the FA20 series and they were very different setups.

Boy oh boy it's wonderful when people shout this shit. I've seen so many comment that Subaru could 'easily' put the FA20 from the WRX in the twins and that it would hardly cost anything to them. So you know it will happen with this motor too.

IIRC, the Toyota-involved FA20s didn't have the same carbon buildup issues as Subaru's own FA20 used in the WRX (not sure if Subaru is still using direct injection without port injection)

I would have figured Fords or Chryslers.

I lied, my low serial number April 2012 made FR-S had 2 flaws-

Water drops in taillights, needed a foam gasket but they first swapped the lights then swapped gaskets another time. Oh well. Valentis for 6 years now and good spares are tucked away.

Oil drip from rear passenger side cam plate on to overripe shield of exhaust. Very minor, it makes the vehicle smell like a sportscar lol. I resealed it myself with better sealant for shits and giggles.

What you don't get are the yearly revisions/upgrades. Off the top of my head I missed out on:
- shark fin antenna
-console knee pads
-stitched padded instrument cover
-performance package w/upgraded brakes availability

But I got the CF looking dash facing unique to the first year Toyota products. I really like it better than every other finish since including Alcantara.

On the other hand my car was $26 CDN + frt, taxes at around $31,500 total. Full MSRP as per Scion with no complaint on my end. And I was a repeat customer. That was ideal for a starting point where performance was priority (plus the body kit). I like the manual hvac, no unnecessary bells and whistles.

Jeep
Pontiac
GM
Saturn
Mitsubishi X2
Toyota
Subaru
All were early run first model year cars.

Your improvement list is missing a pile of small but important engine upgrades that occurred but were never really advertised well. This happens with all cars over their model life though.

Besides the recall debacle I haven't had 1 problem with my 13 and it sees track time. I doubt there's a car in existence that every unit will be trouble free. I bought a 911 Twin Turbo with 3,000 miles on it and I had it back to the dealer a few times to sort it out.

I believe there was only one thing shared between the two variants of FA20 (basic block i guess?) but almost all the internals were different.

I would think the FA24 setup is the same way. Its no wonder the PR speak and anyone who mentions it say its a completely new engine.

This is true but playing the odds means anything beyond the early run of a first year will probably have fewer issues. No doubt the majority of even the early ones can be issue free but just the risk is higher.
One of the very worst cars we ever had was a 2005 Sunfire. It was one of the very last ones ever made and literally fell apart in under a year. This was more a case of "we don't give a shit and just slapped it together" though. If the whole idea that everything got better as the years went on with that version then that should never happen.

Bore and stroke.

Really didn't make a difference with Jeep. Didn't have an early first run vehicle and it was the worst and only American designed car that I've owned.

His was 1 74 and one of the very first ones to come off the assembly line. They were still a pretty good vehicle back then. Well, normally at any rate.

You should of been able to order those parts in if you wanted them, nothing wrong with adding factory parts to your car. They had that nice frameless rear vision mirror on the Australian top spec 86 (GTS 86) when it released. I think half of our car club (formed in 2013!) who had Subaru's ordered them from the toyota parts bin :)

There is an image or video I remember seeing of the two pull completely open.

I recall that the NA version looked a heck of a lot more honeycombed.

Saw the leaks, didn't like the car. Saw the official launch, car grew a bit on me. Still want a Supra though.

The last time I bought a new car was shortly after gasoline was invented. My '14 Monogram edition was built in Jan 14, so I'm not sure if it's really any different than a '13. I confess I am a bit leery of it, and though I've thought abut FI, I probably won't. It has 50K now and I use 6500 as a redline and change oil at 5000. I did get lazy and go 7500 between changes once but the analysis came back fine. The TOB just started making noise so ii goes as soon as the new parts arrive.

Wow, congrats on still being able to drive at 120+ years old!

https://www.aaa.com/autorepair/artic...line-come-from