How much Camber?
 

If I'm adding camber for the first time to my car should I add it to just the front wheels or do all four wheels off the bat? How much camber in front and rear would you suggest for a first-timer? (I want camber strictly for track performance, not for any aesthetics)

All you can use. You will need to experiment a bit with tire temp probe to nail what is ideal for your car/track. -3.4F/-2.4 rear works for my setup and local tracks. It took about 3 tries to get it to were I was happy with it.

The cars have about a degree and a half in the rear in stock form. If you lower that goes up. Beyond that, in my book it depends on what you want from the car. My car runs at stock ride height. I installed camber bolts and get one and a half negative at the front to match the rear. It works well for me as a DD / GT car spec.

If I autocrossed or tracked it I'm sure I'd want more, but I wouldn't take a 3000 mile road trip in it with a track alignment.

Step 1: Add too much camber
Step 2: Add a little more camber
There, now you almost have enough camber.
Glad I could help. :D

But seriously, if you want the best track performance, shoot for 4* or a little more up front. Maybe 2.5* to 3* or so in the back, depending on many other variables we don't know about your situation.

If you also street drive your car you have to find a good balance so you chew up your tires as little as possible in either scenario. Different tires also respond\wear differently to camber degrees so a few things to consider.

Also depends on suspension stiffness, a stiffer setup would require more static camber.

I think the opposite is true. A softer suspension is going to lose a lot more camber relative to the ground and should require more static camber.

Fortunately beyond a point, car balance and ultimate grip isn't as strongly tied to camber as you might think. But you *definitely* want a lot more camber up front vs. stock for track work. At least -2.5, but every little bit you can get vs. stock is gonna help.

Just lowering the car a bit will likely get you in the ballpark for rear camber, up front you'll want either camber plates or a combination of camber bolts and offset (Pedders?) top mounts.

Be aware that if you get lowering springs and camber plates with the stock struts, you might run into bump travel issues (I did!). So for stock struts and lower springs I'd definitely go with camber bolts and offset upper mounts.

My setup is camber plates (Raceseng), Swift Spec-R springs (-1.25" lower), and Bilstein struts/shocks. -3.4 front and -2.7 rear camber. Great street/track setup! IMO...

How much street driving do you do and how do your front tires wear with that much front camber?

I've put over 20k street miles on a set up with around -3.1 degrees up front, -2.2 degrees in the rear and no real adverse wear. Zero toe up front, a bit of toe in out back.

I haven't been able to travel much because of Covid, but I've put maybe 2k street miles on a setup with around -4 up front this season, with no noticeable adverse wear. My plan was to drive to several events in the 1k to 2k round trip range.

Not a whole lot of street driving these days, probably averaging 1500 miles between track events (including to/from travel). But in my experience with running -3+ front -2+ rear camber for years on various cars, one track day is gonna pretty much even out ~5k street miles worth of "camber wear". I.e., for street/track, give it all the camber... But keep toe minimized! I run zero front/rear

This is a very good point. Really the only handling difference I notice on more camber is turn in. Otherwise we are just evening out wear.

Thanks all.


If adding -3 up front and -2 in the rear, what do I need? Camber bolts in front and control arms in the back? Any recommendations or cautions? How much ballpark range does that cost?


Best.

You won't get a lot in the front with bolts you really need plates to do it right. If your car is lowered you'll have about -2 in the back which is fine. I got about -1.8 in the front I think it was with bolts then went to plates to get more

Couple of thoughts on this.

1. The true answer here is that every car is different. The real way to find what camber you should have is done by pyrometer readings and well the lap timer results. Here's a great "how-to" on using a pyrometer. It may be a little over the head of a beginner going to the track, but it's a good skill to have for later. (https://supermiata.com/using-a-tire-...49-racing.aspx)

2. That being said, I can pretty confidently say that even a new driver will want more camber than stock. When I got the car, I baselined it with zero mods and left halfway through the day because the understeer was that bad. I'd recommend at the least, grabbing a set of camber bolts and maxing them out. In my case, doing this did not change my toe a noticeable amount so there was no alignment needed. I would do this after your first track day at the very least.

3. Otherwise, if you are looking for a good set point I would aim for -3 front, -2.5 rear as a starting point. From there use a pyrometer to dial it in. Likely it will need more camber than that. In most cases, lightweight underpowered cars like a ton of camber. I'm around -4 degrees and I could even go further based on my pyrometer readings. I think 949 racing runs more than that on their project car "Blub" too.