Durable Wheels !
 

As much as I hate starting new topic, I couldn't find a clear answer for what I'm looking for.

I was about to get the Enkei RPF1 until I saw a lot of ppl online complaining about the durability of the wheels mostly the barrel getting bent easily.

I daily drive my 86 and will be taking it to the drift track later on this year. I wanna get the most durable wheels without breaking the bank.

I'm looking into Gram lights 57CR or Weds TC105N, but the TC105N are about 400$ more expensive.
My question is are the TC105N 400$ more durable than the 57CR or it's not that big of a difference in durability?

Sorry for the long ass post.

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I only see a ~$200 price difference, but hey. Both are, by all accounts, really good wheels. I believe the 57CR are heavier, which may be a good thing for your goal. Either are excellent.



The other thing to remember is that, when you get into racing, wheels become a wear item. You hit curbs, rumble strips, etc. and over time they wear out. Sometimes less time. Bending a wheel means it's not garbage; the cheap stuff cracks or shatters. Another wheel to consider on a bit more of a budget is the 949 6ul. A bit heavier build than the RPF1. You'll still bend it on a hard curb hit (honestly, you're likely to bend any wheel if it's hard enough).


I run TC105n (note, the TC105x is the new version of this... anything 'n' is old stock, if it's actually even in stock...) and 6ul. Prefer the look of the Weds, but from inside the car I can't see that...

I'm not thinking about racing coz we don't have racing tracks where I live which sucks. I'm just afraid to fuck my wheels in a potholes the most. Coz we have some shitty potholes where I live.

I got a deal on the 57CR in ceramic white for 1400$ in the other hand the Weds cost about 1780$. I'm trying to get the price for the Weds to match the 57CR.

I live in Saudi Arabia and the shipping will cost me so much money that's why I wanna be sure whichever wheel I get will be durable coz I can't afford to ship a fucked up wheel that is under warranty back to the US to get it replaced.

Never thought picking a wheel will be so damn hard lol.


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This is the first time I have read about this issue. I am curious as to where you saw these complaints.

A few things come to mind.
1/ I was under the impression that RPF1s were very good value for their weight and strength.
2/ Any wheel will deform/break given sufficient impact.
3/ I went searching for stories about these wheels' poor performance and admittedly I did not spend much time looking but the only stories I found was about cracking/bending after they had had a heavy impact with a kerb or pothole.


Would @CSG Mike share his opinion?

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...rpf1-weak.html

Is post along side the comments is that one made me think about not getting the RPF1.

I just want something that won't get bent/cracked so easily and trying to ask ppl in here coz I know so many ppl have a lot of experience not like myself.

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Glitchy86: then again upon those few posts where they bent wheels, imho there are at very least 10x times more that keep happily using them just fine. And i see nothing to point to rpf1 wheels as being weaker then many others, that for that specific (ab)use won't bend other wheels too.
Also given popularity of rpf1, imho they are in many places easier to source if need for replacement arrives.
Given that they are overall imho of good compromise of strength/weight/cost, i see no reasons to not get them, unless one knows that will do gravel rallying :)

That makes sense.

So out of the three that I listed is any of them are significantly more durable than the other or are they pretty close to each other durability wise.

Thanks again.

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Ummm, is this one thread is the "lot of ppl complaining"?


The second post says "I know a few local Time Attack teams who used to run RPF1's and they would bend quite a few of the wheels after a seasons use due to various berms or track off's."
My bold.
As I said, any wheel will deform/break given sufficient impact.


I'm guessing you've seen the RPF1 thread?
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58908

Yes I'm aware of that. Just wanted to make sure that I'm not burning money in here. Again these are my first set of aftermarket wheels.

I'm a noob and that's why I'm asking the guys like yourself who bought aftermarket wheels many times.

Just want to make sure I'm getting a good set of wheels.

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CSG Mike hasn't chimed in as yet but he and his shop (Counter Space Garage) is extremely well regarded on this forum. CSG sells RPF1s and he doesn't sell crap.

RPF1s are a great value for money for AutoX. They would still be a great product even if they completely melted after just one lap at the track.

A friend of a friend recently switched from PP wheels to RPF1s and managed to bend one on a pothole within weeks. Now he hates them 💁*♂️
Some of the folks I've met at AutoX and track say that RPF1s are great, but are also based on outdated tech and modern lightweight wheels are stronger.

To the OP: having said that, if you plan to keep the car for at least a few years, you should think about what you optimize for. It seems like RPF1s are great if one optimizes for weight at the least amount of money that's reasonable. IIRC, the next lighter wheel in the same size would be TC105N, which is basically twice as expensive.
What you should probably optimize for however is lifetime per dollar. You might literally be better off buying rally wheels for an STI. Another possible solution is just to accept the fact that you'll bend a wheel every once in a while, and save on shipping costs by buying them 6 or even 8 per order.

Buy forged wheels, they are totally worth it. I had a set of Volk Ce28n on my Yaris that I use to daily. After a decade of use $2000 or so isn't a big deal. I didn't have to worry about anything, they were awesome.

Not so sure on "worth it". If buying new, i'd strongly disagree. Well, in one way is - if you buy those forged wheels used, at fraction of price. Though choices of specific sizings might be limited.

Check out Konig's Flowformed wheels

I do have TC105N and use it for autox and trackx for... over 5yrs (give or take) and haven't had a single issue.

With that said, Weds or Grams aren't cheap. If you gonna use it for daily I would recommend Enkei wheels. Enkei Performance & Tuning are cheap, but pretty well made. I have Enkei Raijin for summer and Enkei VR5 for winter. I've hit the fence & scraped one of Raijin and had to replace it, but it wasn't that expensive to hurt my wallet. Raijin I've scraped still hold the air perfectly fine, but visually doesn't look good... so replaced it. My wife have Enkei T6S and daily and don't have any single issue. Raijin, VR5 & T6S might not be lightest wheels out there, but light enough to race and strong enough to daily.

My concept for daily wheels, if you need to replace one wheel, can you replace it asap without kill your bank.

That's my 2 yen.

6 years on my RPF1's, daily street use and tons of track time. Toronto area roads have lots of pot holes, wheels are still dead straight.

I agree with Vital. If you want solid wheels without paying the price of forged ones, flowformed are your best bet. Nothing against the RPF1 but technology does better wheels now.

I had some Konig's on my previous car and they stayed straight throught dozens of big potholes over the years. I've even had a serious one that popped a bubble on the side the tire (Toyo tires, never again), but the rim didn't bent.

I went with the flowformed Superspeed RF03RR on my 86, but they are plenty of brands doing flowforned now.

You should also check those 720form GTF2 wheels. They were my second choice.

Anyway, keep us updated when you're done choosing.

Enkei RPF1 are flow formed wheels. That's the Enkei's MAT process.

RPF1s are not what I'd call "the most durable wheels" but they're fine. I run them in the winter in Baltimore. There are plenty more durable wheels out there that are of course heavier.

- Andrew

I really appreciate everyone's comment. But man never thought picking a wheel will be this hard.

Sadly can't get Konig wheels coz FT86speedfactory don't have them.

I guess I'll just roll the dice and pick one of the 3 wheels I listed and hope for the best.

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Why does that matter? Why can't you get them elsewhere, like America's Tire?

Coz I have 300$ as a gift card with them. That's why I can only get the wheels from them

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I previously ran a set of 17x8 Enkei RPF1's on my FRS. They felt great to drive with Michelin PSS tires, super light compared to stock, but 6 months after buying them, two of them broke. I was driving onto the freeway and the entrance had two lanes. The truck to my left turned into my lane and I turned to the right to avoid getting hit. Both wheels on the passenger side hit the same pothole on the side of the road at around 50mph, and both the front and rear wheels were damaged beyond repair.

They aren't a bad wheel at all, I loved them. But they are flow-formed and aren't the strongest out there.

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...1a&oe=5DEEC684

Now I'm running Speedwell forged wheels and you can pick up a set of four Speedwell RS-R wheels in 18x9.5 +40 for under $350/wheel with our special forum pricing. They are fully forged, lightweight, and are backed with a lifetime structural warranty, and hub centric! Load rating on these wheels is at 690kg per wheel, and you won't get a better price out there for fully forged wheels! If you're looking for something durable and won't break the bank, these are your best option for under $1,400/set. They weigh in at 18.9lbs each.

We do ship to Saudi Arabia. We also take out these wheels on the track almost every other weekend in our shop IS-F, and I've been driving on Speedwell wheels for the last 20k + miles.

-Sam

https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...f8&oe=5DDBE743

Ouch that pic of the RPF1's hurts. Those Speedwell wheels looks great btw.

Sadly I can't make a purchase from you guys this time, as I have a gift card with FT86speedfactory and have to make the purchase through them.

But hey I'll consider your website for future purchases.

Thanks.

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it totally depends on you you mean by worth it. Having wheels you never have to worry about is worth it to me. Now if you are going to always change wheels or not keep the car long term, that might be a different story. But for my piece of mind, have wheels that I most likely would never ever damage was great.

Call them. Use skype or something like that to make it less expensive. I am sure they can get a ton more stuff than is on their webpage.

why?: forged wheels are NOT of "never worry". AFAIK they are on average ~20-25% stronger vs cast wheels of same weight. But it's no magic bullet, and forged wheels also can be damaged (and in such case not only initial purchase cost matter, but also how much replacement wheel will cost). Even more so that often forged wheel manufacturers target customers that prioritize wheel weight, thus they more often make/sell not wheels of same weight but stronger, but rather instead of same strength but lighter.
I'd say that if one worries that much about wheel damage, just get any rally wheel. Yes heavy, but stong AF. Yes, at expense of extra weight, but they will be even stronger then most forged wheels, made with lightness in mind. Due being cast, cost will be reasonable. And there are several known manufacturers of such on both side of pond, simplifying/cheapening costs further, by making expensive overseas shipment redundant. My own choice was .. forged wheels :), that i bought for 1/4th the price of new, due them being used :). But i wouldn't bet that eg. my current 6.2kg forged wheels are stronger then for example OE 9.1kg wheels, i'd rather think that they might be comparably strong.

its not just cast vs flow formed vs forged, but also wheel design. generally more material/bracing out near the barrel is going to mean a stronger wheel. RPF1s have a little more gap between spokes than most wheels because of the emphasis on lightness. RPF1s came from Formula 1 where the tires have massive sidewalls - wheel rigidity is still obviously very important from a performance standpoint at those speeds but the barrel integrity is not the primary goal. in addition, the offset and concavity is going to be important. Generally more aggressive offsets and greater concavity give up something in terms of wheel strength - maybe doesn't matter as much on forged wheels that are already stronger, but on a car like ours where you can choose between a moderate offset 18x8 vs an aggressive offset in the same size you are giving up something.

i haven't done too much research on this but these are the types of wheel designs i expect to be strongest just by virtue of design (assuming we are all talking wheels of a similar construction method). They are common in motorsport and some of them even come from rally designs: BBS CH-R, RS, Enkei RS05RR, NT03+m or NT03RR, RCT4, PF05, obviously Volk TE37 and CE28, OZ ultraleggera, Work MC0 and D9R, Weds tc105, etc.

If i was going to rank the wheels on ft86speedfactory on my own perceived strength and rigidity i would do something like this (someone feel free to correct me):

1. top tier forged wheels - TE37s, ZE40s, CE28s, Advan GT
2. racing focused flow-formed wheels - Enkei RR line, Work MC0, Advan RG and RZ
3. weds tc105s, work d9rs, SSR gtx01, nt03+m
4. heavier cast and flow formed wheels - Gramlights 57xtreme, 57dr/cr, work cr kai or t7r
5. lighter or non-racing focused flow formed wheels - RPF1s, enkei raijin or t6s, tsw nurburgring, 949 6ul,
6. office swivel chair wheels
7. xxr, cosmis, etc


If you are in the RPF1 type price range i think the strongest wheels you are going to get for the similar money are going to be either NT03+Ms (which have 12 spokes and the bracing ring near the perimeter and come in enkei's conservative offsets). the cast gramlights look strong too but they tend to run heavier and the offsets are more aggressive (mimicing a forged wheel). I have been riding on enkei raijins for years and have been very pleased with how strong they are - they are considerably heavier than RPF1s but have the same flow forming process and cost about the same - i've run autox and have also hit some potholes at speed that i thought would be game over but so far they are still perfectly straight.

The fact that they bent like that and didn't crack proves they're a much better option than A LOT of wheels out there. The cheap pure cast ones would've shattered on a hit like that. I'll bet even a purely forged wheel still would've had a lot of damage, and you'd be out a lot more money in replacements.

I would not rank wheels based on perceived strength, and I certainly wouldn't post it on here because you are definitely going to piss someone off. :lol:

- Andrew

They are a great option. I'm glad that they didn't crack and at the time, one RPF1 in 17x8 +35 was about $225/each.

We can get forum members a set of Speedwell Fully Forged RS-R wheels in 18x9.5 +40 for less than a set of Enkei RPF1's in 18x9.5. Speedwell also offers a LIFETIME structural warranty on each set. OP asked looking for durability and affordable pricing, and these are a good option for both.

https://www.speedwellind.com/pages/warranty-information

20" forged BMW wheel vs rock on Angeles Crest highway. The wheel was repairable by a local shop.
https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...48&oe=5DE63690

17" flow formed wheel vs another rock on Angeles Crest highway, lol. This 17x9 TC105N wheel was on our Asphalt shop FRS:
https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net...4f&oe=5DAAD596

Get some rally rims if it's about strength.
Method, Speedline, and in a smaller size, 16, 15" and a larger wall tire, if you're afraid of potholes.

Thanks a lot guys u have been an amazing help. I really appreciate you responding to my post. You guys are awesome.

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Use case matters. Every wheel can and has broken. It depends what you are doing with it.

Rally wheels are great for their strength, but for normal daily driving a lightweight low power vehicle, forged wheels are pretty hard to beat. Yes lightweight is the most important thing to me. So is longevity. So I used a lightweight wheel and made sure I used a tire that was lighter but also has enough of a sidewall it would absorb almost all impacts. That combo worked great for me for over a decade.

It helps to not drive over a crater at like 100km/h like it seems majority of these people do on the forum. That, or everyone is legit driving into curbs and calling it a pothole to save face.

I can tell you from personal experience that ANY wheel can be damaged if you hit something hard enough. Go off track drifting and you'll soon find out exactly what I mean. But good wheels are worth the money and they will really affect how the car drives. I'd definitely recommend you avoid getting any wheel heavier than the OE wheel, and lighter is always a boon. For durability I think the suggestion to get a rally wheel is your best bet. As an aside to your original post, the RPF1s are great wheels, and the fact they bend rather than shattering is a testament to that.

I'm with others that think forged wheels are best for a daily driver because they are light and strong. The Volk ZE40s are the strongest of the Volk line-up, and are still quite light (although not as light as CE28s for instance). These are my daily wheels and I think a great choice. But they are also quite expensive.

Another option would be to look at lighter weight options designed for rally. A little bit of money, but should be incredibly durable without being heavier than OE. I think a set of Braid Fullrace A might be perfect for your use case. They're ~2 pounds lighter than the OE wheels and are VERY strong (comparatively the ZE40s are ~5.5 pounds lighter than the OE wheels, but more than 2x the price new).

I doubt you can get them through FT86SpeedFactory, but I'd definitely take a look at the BRAID Fullrace A:

https://braidusa.com/collections/whe...14601260367914


Hope this helps.

I love my Braid Fullrace A wheels.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...542e6117_z.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/4834/4...12ebae5d_h.jpg
https://live.staticflickr.com/1925/3...258f61f9_h.jpg

- Andrew