Toronto: new noise by-laws in effect October
 

It's all over the news and apparently police have been handing out tickets left and right over the last couple of weeks. So behave

Makes me think twice about getting headers. I'm not exactly a tool and don't make noise for the sake of making noise, but I bet they'll be on the over-zealous side, at least for a bit. Most of the emphasis is on downtown streets and I don't blame them. Just last week me and my wife were sitting on a patio and an AMG with one of those generic every-german-car-has-it, ugly, industrial, blaring exhausts just absolutely shatters the air 6 feet from my ears and I just wanted to throw my plate at him. And I'm a car guy!

Yep.
Tell me about it.
Those laws are for idiots that love to make noises.
I'm in California so I'm guess our noise levels are about the same.
Eh you have to be a full retard to get busted for exhaust noise.

Same sort of thing happened to me... some dumbass chode driving around in his PoS VW sees me drive by and decides he has to do some ear bleeding popping from his junk ass car..

I’m just hoping there will be some concrete decibel figure to stay under rather than the very vague “at the officer’s discretion” type of ticket

The press conference John Tory did on this, he said there would be a DB figure, and it would be tested at idle. Although, no DB figure was actually mentioned. I think they are still trying to determine what's reasonable, and what's too loud.

This stuff gets complicated fast. Having a limit is fine but they need to have very clear instructions in how to go about it.
The Federal number for new cars is 80 (82-2)
https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/...lText.html#s-5

(iii) SAE Standard J1470, Measurement of Noise Emitted by Accelerating Highway Vehicles (June 1998), the sound level does not exceed 80 dBA when a value of 2 dBA is subtracted from the final reported value referred to in section 6.3 of that Standard, in the case of a passenger car regardless of its GVWR or any other vehicle with a GVWR of 2 722 kg or less

This measure is obtained through a very complex and difficult measurement standard but translates to around 95bd in "real world" levels.
The city of Calgary ran up against this issue a few years ago and I doubt that Toronto will have much better luck sorting it out.
http://www.beyond.ca/calgarys-excess...ion/15447.html


Now... All that said keep in mind that the law says:

Muffler

(1) No person shall operate a motor vehicle or motor assisted bicycle unless it is equipped with a muffler that is,

(a) operating;

(b) in good working order; and

(c) sufficient to prevent excessive or unusual sound and excessive or unusual smoke.

Same

(1.1) No person shall operate a motor vehicle or motor assisted bicycle equipped with a muffler cut-out, straight exhaust, gutted muffler, hollywood muffler, by-pass or similar device.


(1.2) No person shall modify a muffler to increase the sound output of a motor vehicle or motor assisted bicycle.

Unless your exhaust is 100% stock they can nail you no matter what the noise levels are. Even just having pops or "unusual" noises is a violation.

Engine revving and exhaust noise are part of summer. I put up with most of it except those morons who decides to do this after 1am. I heard cars squealing their tires at the stop sign periodically at 2-3am. They should nail those idiots.

Well let’s hope it’ll be more reasonable than this and more about noise levels rather than what you’ve done to your car. Good thing I kept my OEM catback. Sounds like I might still need it. I mean my Corsa is loud but not disturbingly so and has a briefcase type muffler just like the OEM catback.

Anyway, cars are under assault periodically so looks like this is another one of those storms we’ll have to weather.

Yep. It really isn't anything new. They have hopped on this bandwagon now and again as far back as I can remember. Just lay of the WOT if there are cops around and about 95% of the cars, trucks and bikes out there will never be even noticed. The only ones that really need to worry are the guys with machine gun pops or such that are just designed to say "HEY look at me" in the first place. They will indeed get looked at.

The loud exhaust is fine if you're not hooning.

I have a neighbor with a 2010 3 series BMW, straight pipe with no cats. Every night before he moves the car inside his driveways. He would spend 10 minutes revving the car to show off his stock 3 series with black plasti-dipped wheels before ACTUALLY moving the car. I totally support this law if it stops people like this guy from doing that kind of shit every night.

Idunno, I got eyeballed pretty hard while driving normally in traffic yesterday. Maybe the cop had no idea what my car was, but he did full head turn watching me drive by.

That is not my interpretation. The law references modifying a MUFFLER not an EXHAUST SYSTEM. To me, that means hollowing out a muffler or otherwise modifying the muffler that came on the car. Installing an aftermarket exhaust system is fair game.


As for "pops" LOTS of cars do it - many from the factory, nowadays including every AMG and Sport Mercedes model. That makes those types of noises ROUTINE, not unusual. At least, that's how I see it.

I just know that they will be unnecessarily targeting cars that "look" modified, just like every time they do this, and I'm sure they will nail quite a few of the idiots highlighted above (the people who deserve it). I'm also 100% confident that lots of us "normal" car enthusiasts who happen to have a louder-than-stock car will inevitably get caught in the cross-fire.

My car is louder than stock, yes, but not wildly so, and I try to be responsible about it (shift low after 11pm, no unnecessary revving etc.). But now I'm worried shitless while driving because it's yet another thing that I have to worry about, and why? Simply because I'm an enthusiast who enjoys the sound of my car?

What about all these fucking Harleys that rip around with straight-pipes so loud that you literally have to pause your conversation until they pass by? What about the exotic cars that are loud AF from the factory and pop/burble/spittle with every slight touch of the throttle? What about the bro-dozers that sound like chewbacca screaming as they roll coal down the 401? I doubt any of these will be targeted as much as the tuner community, even though they are some of the worst offenders.

No doubt there are lots of people who deserve this. But also no doubt, lots of people who DON'T deserve it will get caught up in this BS, all said and done.

It's a sad time to be a car enthusiast in Ontario.

If you remove the original and replace it with an aftermarket you have modified the muffler. Any change from the stock version is a modification. A play on words will not change a cop nor a judges mind.


As far of the rest of the exhaust goes the laws covering the cats cover headers and pipes. It is illegal to do ANY modifications to the emissions system so this leaves very little that can be changed in an exhaust system that you could not get dinged for.


Noises that come from a stock car can be proven to be "normal". If they are not part of the stock setup they are indeed unusual and subject to the law. Saying that other cars do it does not make it usual for all.


You can try to twist things around all you want but they have heard all of that rationalization before and will hear it again. Everybody just needs to ride this blitz out and things will go back to "normal" soon. I went through this sort of crackdown in the at least twice in the 70s, once in the 80s and several times in the 90s and they always eventually just said "screw it it ain't worth the hassle".

No doubt


https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/.../625/myers.jpg

Tbh, I feel like modded trucks will be the main targets, at least in the hick town cities.. unless of course your car is heavily modded and looks like it could be on the set of F&F.

Just like the safety blitz on trucks, until they found that 99% of the trucks they checked fail the test. Then they realize that pulling all these unsafe trucks off the road would kill the Ontario economy. The politicians cave in to big businesses and turned a blind eye to the whole things. Last I heard, people are still getting injured or killed by flying truck wheels.


When they catch those 86 drivers with modified muffler, this is what they will do to you! be warned and book an appointment with your proctologist in advance if you have UEL headers or aftermarket exhaust!

maybe that's cause youse a fine young man :drool:

Or a shoe!


https://stockx.imgix.net/Air-Jordan-..._at=1544632276

This is a very real possibility. I have on many occasion gathered lots of positive attention from the gay community.

But it's not a play on words. REPLACING a muffler is not MODIFYING it. It's replacing it. 2 different verbs with 2 different meanings.


The backup argument I would make is that any other interpretation of this law is effectively making it illegal to manufacture aftermarket exhaust parts - whether OEM replacement or performance. No way that would EVER fly in a court of law, and there is no way industry would let it.

To do otherwise would single handedly put all Meineke & Midas franchises out of business.

Yes two different verbs. If you remove the muffler and put the same thing back you have replaced it. If you remove it and put something different in it's place you have modified it.

They are not stopping anyone from manufacturing aftermarket parts but you just have to manufacture parts that are road legal? Its never ok to make parts that are not road legal as defined in the HTA. You will be humiliated in court by the district attorney and get a good lecture from the JP:bonk: And manufacturers are not going to get entangled in lawsuits, they just want to make money and this is not the way to go. They will simply manufacture parts that are within the regulations or slap a "for off road use only" disclaimer on it.

The law doesn't even want to go down the manufacturing road. That is why it is written as to "modify" or "operate" but not to supply or manufacture performance equipment.
I would love to see the judge's reaction to somebody walking in court and saying "but I didn't modify the muffler I just changed it to something else so it is a replacement". Like going in and saying "I didn't steal that candy bar I just moved it from the store's possession to mine without paying" They have heard all the "interpretation" and attempted wording rationalizations before and will not fall for it.

No.

In that case you have modified THE EXHAUST not modified THE MUFFLER.


Words matter when it comes to laws and legislation. Very much so.

Sounds like you know zero lawyers and have never been involved in a legal dispute in your life.


I deal with legislation every day at work. Your take on this is not correct.

Ya I bet you do.


Not going to argue it anymore since your theory is just simply dumb.

Whatever the arguments maybe in principle, the reality is that legal action is expensive. The city has a whole department of lawyers on staff. You will have to pay for your lawyer for each minute. And the bills will soon add up to hundreds of thousands because this is not a simple case. There will be appealed all the way up the higher courts. You can represent yourself but how many days can you take off from work? And i dont' believe you can represent yourself in higher courts. Toronto city council has shown themselves to be tenacious when it comes to legal battles. Hell, they are taking the province all the way up to the supreme court so they wont give up easily. Again it comes down to $$$. By the time you are done, assuming you win, you could have use all that wasted money to buy a Porsche with an OEM lould exhaust. Going to court battles for matter of principle is a luxury for billionaires.

LOUD NOISES.

You can buy the Porsche with an OEM exhaust but you will still get a ticket if you rev it or hoon about downtown. They can charge you with all kinds of things. I think one of them is called “demonstration of speed”, or basically showboating. I often blast through the first couple of gears while staying under the limit, but now I’ll get a ticket for it lol

Wow, show off. I hope you get a ticket for 5km over.

Only god can judge me, OG for lyf

Who will inforce this?
All Toronto cops are parking in construction sites with their lights flashing. Officers are standing about chatting with workies.
Gotta wonder how they can cry for more staff when most are wasting their days away.
Oh well, at least they're not running the mileage up on the cruisers.

The officers are off duty and being paid by the General Contractor....

What a waste of money no matter who is paying for it. It always astonishes me as to why they don't put a cop in to direct traffic at accident scenes, instead they just leave motorists to find their way around and cause havoc to have people merging into one lane. just idiotic.

You probably wouldn’t feel the same if you did road construction. It’s very effective at keeping motorists in line (not killing anyone)

You know, I had questioned this a bit ago.. How come the officers in construction zones are armed if they are off duty? I was under the impression an off duty officer cannot be armed.

No idea. It’s written right into some contracts they need to be present. Could be they can be armed in uniform. Or, have to be armed in uniform. I wouldn’t doubt it these days. Things have likely changed.