Scion Fr-S vs Toyota's FT-HS
 

Which concept do you like better? I personally like the FR-S but with 3.5l 400hp in the FT-HS.

http://www.toyota.com/concept-vehicles/fths.html

My point is not so much an electric propulsion engine as it is hosepower. It sure would be nice to have the option say a gt frs model with more hp than a 2.0 boxer can give. After all the the Ford Focus 2.0 echo boost puts out 250 hp. Do you really want a car that looks like a Ford "Focus" to be faster that an FR-S? That would be embarressing in my view.

Mk II.

Don't like electric cars or hybrids besides the Porsche 918

Aesthetically: the FR-S is much sexier and doesn't have the awkward stealth-fighter-esque chamfers and angles.

Powertrain: the FT-HS has two big negatives; V-6 engine and mild electric propulsion.

Reality: The FR-S is at least slightly indicative of a real production car for not too much money.


FR-S = 3, FT-HS = 0

While I agree with your reality, I want to talk about the other 2.
Hybrid and electric is the future. As long as they can make it drives like conventional gasoline car, I'm ok. Hybrid also adds more power without sacrificing the MPG. There are also words about GT-R getting hybrid for next generation and SLS get pure electric. That's the direction we're heading. You can take it or walk out( yes, and walk to work too or ride gay schooter:bellyroll::bellyroll:).

FT-HS has unique roof and radical design. I know they won't make it into production that way, but the styling is really unique.

I could see the FT-HS as a Lexus, like a brother to the CT hybrid.

Unique design does not mean it's good or timeless design.

Regarding electric propulsion; it's simply still not ready for primetime again. Back in the 1890's it had a foothold because IC engines just weren't reliable, and nobody really cared about cross-country or otherwise long-distance commuting ability. Until electric energy storage [batteries] matures significantly, internal combustion is still going to be the norm primarily because it's easy and cheap.

Consider the only production electric sports car; the Tesla. For >$125k I can't even drive it to the Dragon w/out taking 3 extra days. Not on my watch or dime.

Mild Hybrids like the big manufacturers offerings are popular and "green", however they're very complicated for very little actual long term financial or environmental gain, if any. Sure, they have short term "MPG" gain, but with a huge bump in sticker price vs. a slightly less efficient and way cheaper base-model. Stuffing a hybrid drivetrain in the FR-S would easily add $5k to the price, which virtually nobody would want to pay.

Down the road as technology matures and it's financial feasible, then I'm sure we'll be in agreement. Until then, it's just political posturing, which I'm not interested in.

You nailed it. The Prius has a significant impact on the environment when you consider all the manufacturing and processing involved during the stages. According to TG it does more environment damage than a Land Rover Discovery.

[u2b]xqY8FUDcATE[/u2b]

Do you think FT-HS ugly? bland? dull? boring? if so, to each of his own.

I didn't talk about putting hybrid motor in FR-S. What I'm talking about here is, hybrid in some models are NOT SO MUCH environment friendly. I didn't really talk about financial or fuel efficiency either, I just said it adds power without sacrificing MPG. Car companies are starting horsepower war again, and they can't make their motors more powerful and meet the restriction at the same time. Hybrid and electric are the only way to solve it now. Maybe make the car lighter, so the cars can go faster without bumping up the power, but this will cost a lot more. Again, my previous post has nothing to do with environment.

I see where people are going now. When I start talking about hybrid and electric motor, they ONLY think about environment. Do we really need to think about environment when we already screw it up?

Not to go too far off topic, but why screw it up more than it already is. Not sure we can reverse things back to how they were in the 1700s, but hopefully we can lessen our impact as much as we can. Notice you are from Seattle, should you be a treehugger and wear hemp clothing or something. ;) jk

I moved in WA 2 year ago.;)
That "screwing up thing" comment is not serious.:bellyroll::bellyroll:
You can make a time machine and go back, but be careful, you might go to far to Flintstones's age. LOL I think you like to drive this
http://uploads.neatorama.com/wp-cont...Rubble-Car.jpg

^ Great mpg!

My point is not so much an electric propulsion engine as it is hosepower. It sure would be nice to have the option say a gt frs model with more hp than a 2.0 boxer can give. After all the the Ford Focus 2.0 echo boost puts out 250 hp. Do you really want a car that looks like a Ford "Focus" to be faster that an FR-S? That would be embarressing in my view.

Just a random note... hybrids are not the future.

They are a joke, and meant to bridge the gap to the real future, which is all electric. Or maybe even something else.

Nuclear powered motor?

Hell yeah! I'm all for that.

There was also some research done on hydrogen cars or something. Cars running off water, etc...

lol I think we need a dedicated alternative energy/fuel efficiency discussion somewhere, this pops up fairly often.

I want something can run 100 MPG on urine.:bellyroll::bellyroll::bellyroll:

If you're looking for a big power number, the FR-S/FT-86 is already off your radar. If you want power-per-dollar, you're likely drooling over getting a new Mustang 5.0 GT. $30,105 for 412HP is impressive @ $73/HP, with the V-6 Mustang and both engine Camaro's not far behind at about $75/HP.

There are plenty of cars out there that will be much quicker than the FR-S. Personally I'm not interested; let them be quicker. We're not buying a Bugatti Veyron here, we're buying a sexy coupe' version of a Miata. It's all about momentum, not power.

Now, if Toyota had the balls to come out with a turbo-Diesel FR-S, I'd be all over it! Ever since VW cancelled the Bluesport Roadster and Audi R4, I'm still waiting for someone to belly up and make a proper Diesel sports car. That's the current recipe for have-your-cake-and-eat-it-too.

This!!!

I would LOVE turbo diesel sports car.

Beer prices would SKYROCKET from the demand!!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

:bellyroll::bellyroll::bellyroll::bellyroll::belly roll:

"Sir have you been drinking tonight?"
"well YEAH, I'm trying to make it to California on one 12 pack sir!"


Here's my take on the future

http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum...ean_40_153.jpg

This, so this. If VW brought the Golf GTD I would be all over that.

Mazda is supposedly coming out with a TD in the new Sky engine lineup. Wasn't there rumors Subaru would bring a turbo diesel to the States?

LOL Beer price skyrocket is not as scary as rice price goes up. I will be eating bread for breakfast. :(

I'm not a big fan of Ford,the Camaro is okay but I like the FRS better and hope later Toyobaru comes up with something a little more than 158hp. If not I'll look elsewhere. Probably the Nissan 370Z. If there is a demand they will make it and who knows maybe that is in the works in a year or two.

+1

TopGear! Seriously? You know that show is 100% entertainment right? There is nothing serious or academic about it.

Next thing you'll be quoting that "Public Television" study about the Hummer vs the Prius!

And like xantonin said about hybrids, I will add to that by saying that most of the alternate energy tech is just to bridge the gap until better sources can be opened up.

Cause I'm sure you have something more intelligent to provide? :bellyroll:

Yes. TV is for entertainment and is not educational!

Other than that don't get me started unless you want to start a lengthy new topic! :bellyroll:

It really does sound like you're looking for a Grand Turismo car more than anything. The Z would be a good compromise if you don't mind the engine/exhaust sound and Tupperware interior. Also, a Corvette might be on your shopping list as a powerful GT. The Toyobaru isn't intended to be a GT but a simple stripped down sports car. Think it of a Triumph GT6 for the 21st century.


No love for Carl Sagan? :paddle: