Racing Harness
 

Hi there,


Wanted to get some general feedback on users who installed racing harness for their 86s.
I currently have my stock seats in my 17BRZ and wanted to install a 4-point harness. Did anyone do that for their 86? Is there anything else I need to buy while keeping the stock seats?


Please advise, thank you!

A full cage

I think with stock seats your options are very limited.

You need to consider the fact that most racing harnesses require seats that will not fold in case of major accident, and I am not convinced cage or harness bar at the rear will be sufficient. I understand you will have to have sufficient flex in harness to prevent this.

You also need to consider the chance of submarining (going under the harness), which is an issue with 4 point harnesses.

After doing some research I have opted for Schroth rallye harness (see link below).

https://www.schroth.com/en/segments/...lye-3-asm.html

3 point is more flexible and can be easily detached from rear anchor points if rear seats to be used (I may consider changing attachment to C pillar though).

4 point should be good as well.

Both have asm.

And they are fairly comfortable even for 3-4 hrs drive.

Can also use regular 3-point seat belt without completely removing them.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...8bfd7f9a3d.jpg

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Well... depends what you want them for.
If you need them for racing on the track you'll need a roll bar. Most track rules go by scca rules, and they want a roll bar with all harness. Depends on the track/organization.

If just for looks, then who cares? You'll quickly find out it's a bitch in traffic, and uncomfortable as fuck.

Unless you get retractable ones. Those are often used by the Jeep off roaders. You could look into that.

Don't they make ones that are made for/safe for street/airbag cars?

Here.

Yes there retractable ones I mention.

+1 for the Schroth Rallye 3 ASM. Been using it for a couple years in the BRZ and previously had the Rallye 4 in my last car. Super convenient, allow normal use of the rear seats, and surprisingly comfortable. I wore mine for a 2 hr drive just to see what it was like and, besides not being able to reach across the passenger seat, it was trouble free. Plus they bolt in and out in 10-20 min.

Do note that Schroth themselves recommend the Rallye 3 for the BRZ because the rear seat belt anchors (in the seat bottom) are too low to provide a safe angle for the tailstrap of the Rallye 4. The correct installation uses the top seatbelt anchor (where the reel and airbag are in the C-pillar).

As most people said though, each racing series will have specific requirements for restraints and most don't allow the Rallye 3/4 setup. I use mine for occasional recreational autox/lapping so it's moot for me.

If you wanna get really technical, 4+ point harnesses are only completely safe with fixed back seats and with supplementary head/neck protection but that's really for impact protection (your front airbags do much less when you're wearing a harness, if anything at all) . All other scenarios, you're fine with something like the Schroth.

Not trying to start an argument, but is there a reason why you guys don't like to use the original belts? It is my understanding that outside of a car with a full race setup (cage, seat, etc), they are safer in almost all scenarios on the street and on track.


I lock my OEM belt in place before I get to pit out and it seems to hold me in place perfectly well for as long a session as I can handle.

race belts add 150hp;)

2nd that.
You don't want to be in a rollover with a harness on and no bar over your head. I found the seatbelt locking clip works great to keep you planted in the seat for about $5.

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I'm currently running a Takata drift 3 ASM harness with my Bride Zeta III seat. Fixed back is good to have with harnesses for the shoulder belt pass-through and for crashes so the seat doesn't collapse. That said, I know the dangers of using any harnesses without a full roll cage, HANS and other safety equipment. But that said, 4 point ASM harnesses I feel are safe enough for street use that I'm not worried about it. I know SCCA doesn't like harnesses without a cage and many HPDE groups don't like just harness bars either for track days, so take that into consideration if you're gonna track day. I know NASA at my local track allows 4 points with fixed back seats so long as the harnesses are properly mounted to the chassis and not at an unsafe angle.

I used a Schroth Rallye 3 with the stock seat for a while. It worked pretty well for me. I eventually upgraded to a racing bucket+halfcage+6 point harness with HANS.
Because the Rallye 3 is ASM, it is just as safe as the stock belt.
You can detach it if you need to use the rear seats, as well.

To more directly answer OPs question, the Schroth Rallye 3 comes with everything you need in the box. No need for a harness bar etc, it piggybacks onto existing crash tested belt mounting points.

There are different models to this harness, are they just different in colours?
https://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_...id=m5467.l1311

A 4 point harness is a compromise and only a "look at me" mod for people who know no better.

A harness without a seat and cage is stupid.

If you want a harness get a 5 or 6 point (go 6 point, your nuts will thank you), and at the same time install a good fixed seat ( installed properly), and a half cage at a minimum.

You will now most likely lose some ability to head check when changing lanes, and dependant on your countries regulations, you car may now be illegally modified, thus lossing insurance cover and other stuff that may prove important in a street car.

Thanks. But I thought the Schroth Rallye 3 still allows you to use the factory seat belt on the street if need to. It’s not completely replace the factory system. But it allows to use it on the track so I won’t get throw around in the corner on the track. Am I right about this?

That's right.

I have Rallye 3 ASM for track days and factory seat belts for daily driving. You can easily store Rallye belts under or behind stock seats.

The main benefit of Rallye belts is not being thrown around during hard cornering (saves back ache after full track day) and they are compatible with Simpson Hybrid harness.

You need to be careful with how you strap (shoulder straps last) to ensure ASM will work.

Its still a compromise though.

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Yes and no. There's always situational differences. I haven't got a harness installed in this car yet but I had a Schroth quick fit pro in my previous car (doesn't quite fit the BRZ). It's a 4 point with ASM and street legal (in my area). Once the mounts are installed it's only 1 minute to fit or remove. I don't use it on the street as it's frankly unsafe (can't shift forward at tight intersections, etc) however I did use it on the track.

I agree that a 5 or 6 point is superior on track and especially with upgraded fixed seats. Unfrotunately in the local racing leagues it would have cost me performance points or straight up bumped me a class to upgrade the seats. Additionally the modifications for the harnesses would have made me illegal on the street.

Do I think the 4 point harness was safer than the stock belts? No not really.
So why after all of that would I bother to do it at all? With the stock belt I just couldn't get myself really stuck down in the seat. I had to do a lot of bracing to stabilize myself through the corners, over bumps, etc. This distracts you from fully focussing on the track, your line, and available grip. The only real upgrade (other than looks) provided by the 4 point was to plant my ass (and torso) securely in the seat.

EDIT: IIRC the only point that doesn't connect between the BRZ and the E46 (previous car mentioned) is the rear belt buckle. I may look at swapping out this buckle with one that would fit the harness (I don't have rear passengers and I would still mount it with the proper hardware or not o it at all) but if I were to do it all over again I'd try and pick a harness that would allow me to still use the stock belt on the street but also be compatible with HANS device on the track. Due to the ASM release on the quick fit pro I don't believe it was compatible with a HANS device.

I ran these in my MX5
http://www.proquip.com.au/products/cg-lock.html

Way better than a 4 point

I've seen those before. They're definitely better than the stock 3 point on track but depending on the seat it may only keep your waist in place and not your shoulders. The schroth that I used had a tearaway plastic section on the inboard shoulder strap so in a big enough accident you'd rotate/shift forward similar to how you would with the stock 3 point, which provided the ASM protection.

To clarify because I may not have communicated it properly: DO NOT use a 4 point if it doesn't have some form of ASM (anti submarine) protection. Those are straight up dangerous.

This is the harness I used.
EDIT: Apparently Schroth says this harness was actually designed to be able to use a HANS device with stock seats.

That is a pretty acute angle from the top of the seat to the fixture point at the rear seat base.

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...acing-harness/