Weight penalty with meaty wheel look
 

I run 225/40/18 size wheels on my car. My rims weigh 21 lb according to Enkei and I am very tempted by the reduced weight of a wheel like RPF1 for example. Almost 5 lb, IIRC. However, wheels are highly individual and subjective, and I would still want to fill out the wheelarch. I really don't like the tiny wheel look. Having said that, I checked out tire rack for tire weights and used a Michelin Pilot Sport 4S for this comparison. I specced it in 225/40/18 and got 21 lb. Then changed it to 245/45/17 (sufficiently meaty?) and got 24 lb. That would almost negate the weight savings. Are people aware of this? Are these weights provided by tire rack correct? Cause that would take a 5 lb per corner advantage and cut it down to 2 lb...

A 225/40/18 is a little taller than stock. A 245/45/17 is much taller. Not really comparable.

245 40 17 4s weighs 22lbs 8.3" tread width 24.7" (stock diameter)
225 40 18 4s weighs 21lbs 7.7" tread width 25.1" diameter


Compare to a Advan Neova ad08R 225/45/17
24.8" diameter 24lbs 8.5 tread width. 180utqg.

Which is a tire that would go on a 17x9 rpf1. So in some cases, lightweight wheels are for heavy racing tires.

Gotta pay to play! My next set will be 17x9 +25 to +35. , possibly 17x9.25. I plan on getting 225/45 or 235/40s.

Are they aware, probably. Do they care, probably not. It's usually either performance or the look here and seldom but sometimes you get lucky and get both.
If you are going to a 245 width, it usually for looks so the penalty will be less performance or not enough to justify going wider. You have to drive pretty hard core on a stock car to
need more tire width when you can just get a stickier tire. If you have the extra power that the 245 would take advantage of, then I'd go for it but no reason to do unless you are needing
the extra grip but again that's just a tire change. You can just push the wheels out with spacers if you want it to look wider. Saves a ton of money that way and is much less of an increase in weight.
I consistently hear in here, with close to stock power, we are fine on 225s so when I wanted more of a flush look but bump in performance, I bought lighter(and even .5" wider) wheels with less offset and even added
a small spacer to push it out even more to make it perfect. I still dropped 5 lbs with a lighter wheel/spacer combo and it definitely looks much wider from the side and in my opinion even the rear too.
It really all depends on where your start point is. If it's a reasonably light wheel/tire to begin with then purchasing a whole new combo will not make much sense to gain 2 lbs a corner unless you are just doing it for the look
which sounds like where you are at. Really comes down to how much money you have to have fun with. People buy carbon fiber hoods in here that are actually heavier that the aluminum stock hood for the look.


:thumbsup: Yeah, that pretty much sums this whole question.

Well I mean the MAIN reason I would consider doing it is weight reduction, BUT it would still have to be aesthetically pleasing to me. But if the result is 2lb per corner for 2K, I'd rather just stick to 18". Was just shocked to find out. Maybe this is the reason why some people swear by lighter wheels and some can't tell the difference?

People are nutty...how about spending $3-4k in heavy rare custom wheels on a $26k car. It's shocking to see how much people spend on wheels just to get a certain look.
There are sure a lot of them always in the classifieds though trying to get close to what they paid new even with dents/scratches too.
If you can sell the current wheels and tires that will offset the cost some but you are right $2k to lose 2 lbs per corner isn't worth it. In my case I kept the still new sticky tires but spent a total
of $600 after buying new wheels, selling off the old, and buying spacers. In the end I lost 20 lbs of weight total and got the exact wheels I wanted though for a fair price.

If you're going for weight get 17x7 to 17x8 wheels that are inherently light and stick with 215 or 225. You will save more weight than 2lbs.




To be honest, $2000 (wheels + tire cost combined) isn't bad if you lose 2lbs/corner, because you can get stickier 245s in case you autocross.


yes you pay to play.
Dry carbon parts, light batteries, carbon driveshaft. If you want the maximum weight reduction that you can get, you will eventually have to spend on wheels. What's more important to you, looks or weight?

Looks, to a reasonable extent. For example, I wouldn't go widebody because of the extra weight of the kit and wider wheels, but I do love the look.

As for going to 17x7-17x8 wheels, would that be sufficiently wide if I went FI, or does that depend solely on the tires?

OE setup is 41.4 lbs. My setup is 41.8 lbs with 17x9 rims and 245/40ZR17 tires. I think the extra grip is worth the 0.4 lbs lol

245 40 17s on properly sized wheels look awesome.... that's my contribution.

it depends on how much boost you are thinking about, and what your final power goals are. And then what you are going to do with the car.

What wheels and tires do you run? Do you have the separate weights?

Just an edelbrock sc. Apparently gas around these parts isn't so hot, so I'm looking at 250-270 whp

i have gramslight 57DR in 17x9 which weights 20.2 lbs... and i went with Toyo Proxes Sport in 245/40R17 which weights 21.6 lbs

As you stated in your post, wheels are very subjective, but for the love of God, don't get the RPF1. IMHO they are ugly.

If you want a lighter wheel, that still looks decent, check out the PF01. It's only 18.25 lbs in 18x8.5.

I weighed my wheels and tires unmounted and added them up, and got 40.4 lbs. I think after wheel weights and tpms sensors and being filled with air, they'd probably be around 41 lbs. I have 17x9+35 RPF1s and 245/40/17 Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Specs. I could have cut a little bit more weight if I had gone with RE71Rs I think.

These wheels were around 1200 for a set of 4, and each wheel weighed 15.6 lbs. I don't think you can do much better in terms of weight unless you step up to a much more expensive forged wheel.

I agree the RPF1s do look a little dinky and the PF01 is a good looking wheel. Maybe I'll buy them as my summer wheels and keep the Raijins as my winter wheels.

I have been looking at Forged XXR 527F 18x9 +35 wheels @ 18lb each.




IMO, Sexy and fairly light.
https://i.imgflip.com/2fnaob.jpgvia Imgflip Meme Generator




They also have a 18x10 +40 @ 20.2lbs

Are you comparing a 225/18 setup to a 245/17 setup based only on weight? The reason for a wider wheel and tire is to provide more mechanical grip (all else being equal) for cornering. If you don't care about cornering and you only care about looks, then why would you care about weight in the first place? I think this one just comes down to whatever you care about the most, but if we're talking performance around a track, 17's are generally known to have the advantage.

It's a combination of surprise on my part at discovering that light 17s with a fat tire weigh almost as much as not-so-light-but-not-heavy 18s with a skinny tire, and wanting to have the same overall diameter. Cause my winters were OEM wheels with a 215 section winter tire that isn't meaty at all, so I could feel the difference in overall diameter. I want to maintain consistency and not have to get used to something new every winter/spring, so I thought with a light 17 wheel and a meaty tire I could maintain the same overall diameter. But if the weight is gonna be almost as much as an 18 anyway, there is no point. Gonna buy another set of 18s and call it a day.

Personally I don't care so much about wheel weights for a street car. Yeah, don't want anything that is super heavy, but used to have XXR 530's, and now have a set of XXR 527's, both cast, both 18's. Swapped stock rims and these and honestly don't notice much difference in acceleration in street driving. Ideally, get a light set of 17" x 8" rims, throw on some good track rubber 225 width and use those for track days. They can be ugly, they can be cheap, they can have road rash etc. Then get a nice set of 17" or 18" rims for the street, with wider tires and correct offsets to fill the wheel wells, don't worry too much about weight. Especially if you're adding an Edelbrock SC. my 2c

lol no. I run a 255/35 RS4 (265 would be exactly square) on a 18x9.5 wheel and I still break traction upon acceleration if I wanted to and I'm at about 350whp.

If I were you I would get 17x9 with some stick tires, get a 255/40 for max grip. If you want a slightly stretched look get a 245/40.

17x8 is an NA autox setup imo.

Are you turbo'd or sc'd?

Unless you track, stick with 17x7 wheels and 215, with a light wheel and keep the car playful.

No one will confuse your car with big wide tires with a Porsche.

If only going for looks, it’s your car do what you want, it’s all good.

I admit those meaty tire threads always look cool.

17x7? nah, even if you stick to 215 width tires, a 17x8 will accomadate the range in width available for 215 tires better, especially if you choose utqg lower than 200. Which tend to run wider.

Two companies that make lightweight wheels & tires at good prices:

-Look at Konig Flowformed wheels
-Tires look at Hankook Ventus Evo ii's

I wasn't sure by your post if you wanted to stay 18's or 17
245/35/18's wider and the right outside diameter at 22lbs https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...omCompare1=yes
245/40/17's are actually a pound heavier at 23lbs

I went with stock size 215/45/17 and got 19lbs on my scales so tirerack #'s are right

Also went with konig Hypergrams listed at 16.3lbs I got ~16.5lbs so their weights are correct as well. They don't look they great as they look small but they have a few new styles.

I like their new Dekagram wheels you can get a 17x9 at 17.3lbs
or at 18 x9.5 with concave face at 19.8lbs
https://konigwheels.com/wheels/flow-...eels/dekagram/

Thanks! Yeah when it's time to replace the MPSS, I'll pay closer attention to tire weights. I might get the Konigs as winter wheels. They're fairly priced. Don't think I'll be going down to 17s. I want to maintain the same overall diameter, which means heavier tires and it's no longer worth it.

I replaced MPSS with hankook evo v12. I wish I had just got another set of michelins. I do not like them. They have a soft side wall, squeel eaisly, and squirm on corners compared to MPSS.

if I ever decide to go forced induction those would be at the top of my list Staggered!

245/40R17 for most tires are square on 17x9. It's the popular setup for SCCA STX autox class, and most competitive cars in that class also happen to look pretty good too.

You may get a slightly larger contact patch with 255/40, but it's a taller tire than 245/40R17 and 215/45R17 so you'll lose some acceleration due to effectively taller gearing.

Even though I have a set of 245/40 on 17x9 because it's optimal for my autox class, I prefer the steering feel and quicker-feeling acceleration of a narrower 215/45 or 225/45 on 17x7.5 or 17x8 for daily street use. It also feels more fun.

FWIW, I think you're putting in way more thought than what's needed in saving a few pounds in your street-driven car's wheel and tire setup. If you're not trying to find tenths and hundredths of a second on a track or autocross, pick a wheel with a size and offset that looks good (to you) with your desired ride height and camber settings, get a tire that's suitable for what you're doing with your car, and just enjoy driving it.

Can't enjoy heavy twin.

I find the gearing thing not very enjoyable. The MY17 86 already has shorter gearing so I have to shuffle through the gears fast to get up to speed. It's this frantic pacing that gets tiring as hordes of crossovers and sedans with CVTs are on my ass immediately. I live in a big city and people have no patience so I have to get up to 20 over the speed limit asap lol. Smaller diameter tires make that harder, which is what I noticed when I had the OEM rims with a 215 section tire. I much prefer the 18" with a 225 section tire. It may impact acceleration but not to a degree I'd notice. But I do notice that I don't have to shift as frantically now due to an increase in the overall diameter. This is why I said that if I were to switch to a 17" wheel to save weight, I'd still want to maintain the same overall diameter. BUT since that compromises the weight savings and makes it not really worth it in the end, I'll stick with the 18s

And that's the gist of my presentation. The post was also partially like a PSA cause I noticed a lot of people here bragged about lighter 17" wheels but then they have fat heavy tires and may not know.

Aside from just looks vs performance, I have meaty tires mainly to help with the shitty roads in NYC lol. Running 17x9 RFP1s with 255/40 tires. Absolutely not for performance because honestly, I don't track my car and I'm not gonna pretend I do.

Does it improve ride quality? Cause that's one of my problems as well. I have coilovers and have to play with tire pressures to make the ride tolerable.

I went from stock suspension + wheels to Tein Monosports + RPF1 on 255/40. This was like two years ago so I can't be sure, but I don't remember the car feeling any worse in terms of ride comfort. I think the two balanced each other out.

Impossible to compare the two directly in terms of going over potholes and whatnot since I'd have to find the exact same potholes. But I really do think it helps with that. Between the thicker walls with more air to absorb impact and the wider tires to help me just drive over some potholes or at least avoid enough of the pothole so that I dont fall into it.

I was supercharged with a c38 running on e85. I'm now turbo'd with a gtx2860r and making more power than the supercharger.

reason I'm asking is an sc has a more linear power delivery, so I'm assuming traction shouldn't be as much of an issue as it would be with a turbo. Could be wrong. Could depend on what kind of sc and the tune of course

It's actually the other way around. the supercharger had so much power down low I couldn't really floor it from the start. The turbo does take a second or so to actually get going. I actually prefer the turbo setup too over the supercharger. It's more efficient (comparing the compressor maps). On 14psi on the supercharger I am no where near as fast as I am now with 10psi on my turbo.

18x9.5
 

Will 18x9.5+35 offset work on stock Scion FR-S. Mainly I’m thinking the front of it will work. I have some people say not unless you have coil overs and some say that it can work without them. Has there anyone that has tried to do this

Yeah I hear you. I had a turbocharged car before though, and for various reasons, would prefer to try an sc this time. Hear a lot of good things about edelbrock. Just waiting for them to release the updated MY17 version. If that doesn't work out, I'll go JDL turbo :thumbsup:

FWIW, I just went from stock wheels and tires to Apex 17x9's with Firestone 245's and lost .6lb per corner.