buzz / rattles between certain RPMs during quick acceleration
 

Hi all :)

I purchased a used gts86 with automatic transmission from a dealer a week ago and I notice this light rattle between 2500 - 3000 RPM consistently during quick acceleration.It sounds like the rattle comes from the driver side. Also, there is NO rattle if I put the P mode and hand brake on and just revv the engine.

The rattle is pretty much identical to the sound produced from this video:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uTUaCBhGiQ&index=153&list=WL"]FRS engine rattle. at @00:03 and 00:24s - YouTube[/ame]

I have booked an appointment with Toyota this Thursday but I would much prefer to get some opinions from your guys about the nature of the rattle.

Thanks in advance!

P.S. Its a fantastic car but the rattle takes away the joy from riding it, since it can be consistently produced.

I'm taking my car in for a transmission inspection this saturday based on almost the same noise. I'm expecting it to be a "normal" thing but want it checked out before my BRZ goes OOW.

I suspect its my flywheel that rattles. its odd though because its most noticeable at lower rpms, clutch not pressed. When the fans kick in, its more audible too.

Thanks for your input and please excuse me for the lacking of knowledge in cars, but does the automatic transmission come with a flywheel as well? Either way,I don't think it's a normal behaviour right? I only hope my dealership will be able to hear the rattle and fix it.

Sounds like someone forgot to bolt down the bottom engine covers.

Thanks for the input :) Just wondering though, wouldn't the rattle be heard even the car is not in gears while revving the engine, if the bottom cover of engine goes loose?

Well if that's the case it could be the motor/tranny mounts that are lose

It could be that when the engine torques over a bit, that a heat shield is hitting on something ...... I suggest you get it up on a rack and poke around, looking for things that are close together and could rattle.


humfrz

I will make sure to hint the dealership tomorrow if he fails to hear the rattle. thanks.

Well, let's hope they find and fix it.

Please keep us posted.


humfrz

UPDATE 1: the inspection took place few hours ago. The technician went on a test drive with me after I verbally depicted the issue to him. He heard the rattle during the test drive and afterwards he said a further diagnose of the vehicle was needed, including driving another 86 with a similar manufactured date and communicating with Toyota to ensure if the rattle was the characteristic of the car or not. However, he did mention a thing or two about the rattles perhaps had something to do with the exhaust, engine and flywheel and didn't think it was merely interior rattles. On a side note, he also mentioned my car had a rougher handling than previous 86 he had driven, as he felt vibration from the steering wheel or something was not levelled <= can't remember exactly what he said for this part.

Currently the car is with Toyota and I will update you guys once I have my updates from them. Thanks !

P.S. this is my first car and I bought it used from a dealer. Based on the previous owner of the car and a thorough service record, I only thought the car would only have some cosmetic issues, such as scratches or dents, and it would not have any mechanical problems. I guess I thought wrong. Also, I don't think the rattles are the nature characteristic of the car --- rattles during certain rpm under load but they are non existed when the car is not in gear? nah..

The rattling is definitely not normal behavior, and like others have said is probably from a loose panel or something else vibrating against something else. The reason you may not hear it when not in a driving gear is because in park or neutral there is no load on the engine. Things behave a little differently when the engine is loaded, whether it be that they move/vibrate a little differently/more, or sound different.

Ever notice how when you go from Park or Neutral into Drive that the rpms drop a little bit as the car goes into gear? That's putting a load on the engine, giving it something to do...in this case move the car forward. Without that load all it has to do is spin, which is pretty effortless. In gear, now it's got more machinery to move, and you'd be surprised how much things you'd expect to be rigid do move under the hood and under the car. Vibrations and frequencies are strange things.

Anyway, point being, something is probably loose, maybe missing a few bolts, like a heat shield or one of the underbody panels, or an exhaust bushing may have fallen off or not even be there, letting the pipes move around a lot more than they should. That's my guess, and hopefully that tech will start with those simple things before trying to deep dive into some exotic possibility.

Also, yes, your automatic car does have a flywheel, it's just usually a slightly different design than what is in a manual car, but still performs the same function. I do not suspect that is your issue, though.

Keep us posted.

Thanks for your insights :) I only hope Toyota won't deem it as a normal behaviour due to business practices and I also hope the tech can pinpoint the exact issue and fix it. I was gonna get an Audi A4 but then the appeal of the 86 won my heart....and the car is only 1 week old to me..despite its a used model.

In general sports cars are noisy, an Audi A4 is more a luxury vehicle.
I wouldn't be too concerned but let us know what Toyota say ;)

UPDATE 2: can't believe Toyota tech got back to me just then and I was told on the phone that my tech guy tried out another 86 and it made an exact same noise and it came from the exhaust. so they wanted me to ride with them tomorrow on another 86 and showed it to me.

Me: I was speechless when I heard it over the phone. so the exhaust is supposed to rattle and the noise can't be quiet down by stabilising the exhaust? also how come I don't see any posts from 86 forum where this kind of symptom was asked.

You're lugging the engine in too high of a gear, the car isn't very happy under 1,500 rpm. There is nothing wrong with the car. Keep the car above 2k rpm and you'll never hear that nose again.

Edit: video is engine lugging, your issue must be different since you state you're in the higher rev range, idk, good luck.

The OP says he has an auto ...... :iono:


humfrz

Well, to be fair (to a point), humfrz, it is possible to still kinda lug the engine even in the auto, but the car does force itself down a gear even if you have it in manual mode once your speed drops below a set minimum for whatever gear, so you can do it, but only a bit and briefly. You'd have to speed up, force the next gear, and then drop speed and try to put your foot down again. Kinda silly to do intentionally, and not possible to sustain for the several seconds shown in the video.

And strat also edited his post once he realized that wasn't the OPs vid, so I'm sure he realized that difference as well.

Edit: also, to the OP, just because they found another car doing the same thing doesn't mean it is a normal thing. Both cars could have similar issues. There are plenty of bushings, fasteners, mounts, and some heat shields they ought to be looking at to see if any are loose or missing. If anyone has worked under that car or removed panels to inspect before selling it used, it's a very real possibility and an easy fix.

Hi thanks for the input. Yeah I know there is a possibility that the other car suffers a similar issue or have some other problems; however, considering my car is a used model and it have factory warranty no more, I don't think they will be happy once I tell them " I think the other car is broken as well". Let's see what's gonna happen tomorrow.

Well, no need to say anything like that to them, I just feel like before even trying to drive another car to see if it makes similar noises, they could've just checked everything under your car and make sure nothing is loose or unhinged because those are the easiest culprits for vibrations and rattles. If they find something like that, they can fix it for next to nothing and have you in and out quickly instead of all this full-bore troubleshooting that may not be necessary.

UPDATE 3: just got back from test driving the new Toyota 86 with an automatic transmission and it has the same noise during the same rpm range. The tech explained the noise is common as it comes from the engine. Also, on rough surfaces, the new 86 has interior rattles as well. In conclusion, i have sought comfort from the fact that another new 86 has basically a similar characteristic in terms of nosies and I am much happier that there is nothing wrong with my car. I guess I can start enjoying my ride now. It's in red:) last but not the least, I would like to thank everyone for their attention of either simply viewing or replying to my post. I wish you all have a nice week!

Good to know it wasn't an actual problem. Maybe the sound wasn't quite as loud as what was in that video, because that sounded pretty bad. I can't say I've noticed any rattling or vibration in that rev range on my 2016 automatic, and I spend plenty of time there in my daily driving, but if the car isn't showing any bad behavior, just go drive it and enjoy what it does.

Since you picked the car up used, it can't hurt to do some preventative maintenance over the next few months and change out all of the important fluids (oil, trans fluid, brake fluid, power steering fluid, differential fluid) just to be sure you've got fresh fluids in there. Who knows the last time they may have been changed (if at all) before you bought it. In the long run it's cheap insurance against any potential problems and you can confidently throw the car around on some back roads.

Thanks for the heads up will do !

I knew this wasn't an issue but its great to have piece of mind right :)

Sometimes problems like this is very quick to resolve by meeting up with a fellow twin owner. 😂 that’s how I solved most of my problems along with helping my friends.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yep, the power steering fluid is known to go bad easily in this car :lol:

:bonk: combination of habit listing maintenance stuff and typing while tired. I'll take my licks.

OP, do be aware that there is no power steering fluid on this car since the car has electronic power steering, so you can remove that from your list.

I think they do right ? since they are the Toyota dealer and according to my tech he had driven several 86s before. Anyway I will book my car in for a full check up soon before moving to another state in Australia. thanks again :)

All my fluid leaked before it left the factory... is that a problem? Hahaha

Lemon Law :mad0260:

UPDATE 4: Hi guys I think I am paranoid..so basically I walk pass the dealership every day after work and When I was passing the dealership today, I did not see the car that I test drove and I started wondering is it POSSIBLE that they somehow realised it was indeed a problem, instead of being a vehicle characteristic and they decide to check the demo car (the one I test drove), hence its gone, and not mine, since its a used model and I did not purchase from them.

In other words, is it possible that tried to comfort me and ultimately get rid of me by letting me test drive a demo car that has the same noise, but they realised its a problem and took away the demo car and fixed it

Anything is possible, best not to get that paranoid and worried about it. If you're concerned about something like that, bring it to a different dealer.

Or maybe they just sold it? Car dealers tend to sell the cars on the lot.


https://media1.tenor.com/images/7d4a...e201/tenor.gif

Yeah thats what I thought as well. it would be a hot sale if thats the case, since I test drove the car on a Friday and the dealership only opened till 1:00pm on Saturday and it closed on Sunday. And the car was gone on Monday...

Sorry for being irritating at this point but after doing some further readings on multiple forums tonight, I have found a video linked to a post, where it showcased my exact problem. It almost looked like I was the one who videotaped the issue myself ! unfortunately the person who started the post & video did not seem to find a solution from either youtube or the forum.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcvI-anyCX4&list=WL&index=155"]Frs engine problem - YouTube[/ame]

engine pining perhaps? I would also like to meet up with my local 86 group asap and see if I have the chance of test driving one of their 86's with AT. Either way I am pretty keen on finding out the cause of the rattles, whether its an abnormal behaviour with this car or not..I think I suffer from OCD syndrome.... :bonk:

Vacuum pump.


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...=107577&page=3

Well, I'll go back to my first thoughts that something is vibrating when the engine is under load that is causing that vibration sound.

What I would do is to take my car up to the local automotive shop and request the oldest mechanic they have to take a ride with me and let him hear the noise.

Then suggest he put it on a rack and pound around the undercover panels with a rubber mallet to see if he can duplicate the noise. If not, take off the front under panel and bang around the exhaust heat shield with the rubber mallet ..... then do the same with the rest of the exhaust system.

Betcha he can find out what is making the sound ......... then take a crowbar to that piece and push it over.

WOW! ....... how hi tech ........:thumbsup:


humfrz

thats what I thought as before test driving a demo car, perhaps a 2016 or 2017 demo model, at the Toyota dealership and it was making the same rattle under the same conditions. I am confused. this rattling noise is harder to solve than my engineering exams in university. :iono:

Ahhh .......haaaaa ......... NOW, we are getting the ....... rest of the story ......:rolleyes:

I'm ah feared you are over engineering the problem ......... it's a simple rattle ....... NOT a complex piece of rocket engineering ....... :D


humfrz

lol even with engineering I had survived the course aka graduated.

How did your case go? :)

:thumbsup:


humfrz