Water pump driven by the accessory belt?
 

This is pretty new to me. All my older cars have crank-driven water pumps. I am wondering whether there is the possibility that the accessory belt is broken, but engine keeps running, overheat and RIP? Is there any mechanism to prevent this from happening? Thanks for the advice!

You'll get the check engine light with several different codes, the car will go into limp mode and the coolant temp gauge will be pegged. If you don't see all that and pull over and turn off the engine, what happens after is on you LOL.

Also that serpentine belt drives a lot of other accessories so you'll see many other issues before you even get that far. You'll have so many other warning lights, driveability issues and problems going on, you'll be on the side of the road long before the engine cooks itself.

no alternator = no power steering

:slap: ........ quit worrying about stuff like that...... you will live longer.


:D


humfrz

Broken drive belt = no alternator = vehicle shuts off

Your smoking the good stuff, and why are you not sharing?

nope. Thanks for playing.

Well, now, actually he is correct ....... the drive belt breaks - the alternator quits working - the battery runs out of electrons - the spark plugs won't fire - the engine quits running ........ :D


humfrz

Hey! I spent years cultivating a relationship with the Chief, down at the Pot Shop (previously known as the Smoke Shop) down on the reservation, by sharing my agronomic expertise, so he would supply me with "the good stuff" ..... and I ain't sharing .......... :D

oh, you weren't talken to me ..??


humfrz

Oh, come on. Which happens first by a long shot, boilover, or dead battery?

Quit yanking my chain, old man.

Hey, old man, I was just checking to see if you had put too much rum in the egg nog ..... :D

I'm having a challenging day ....... Santa brought mrs humfrz an Echo Dot thing ...... now, I can't tell if she is talking to me or that thing ...... :(

In addition, I just got my new drone charged up and ready to fly and since it cold and snowy outside ........ I was going to do a test flight inside the house. mrs humfrz is not real wild about that idea. I've never flown one before ....... but I used to be pretty good with the Microsoft flight simulator ........ :eyebulge:


sorry OP :offtopic: (but he started it ......:mad0259:)


humfrz

Hey! I did not! Now quit jacking the thread with your Christmas frustration. :bs:

Duh, usually when I partake in such mind altering activities, my mind does wonder about how we humans are such fragile creatures. I mean we put our very lives on a 4 3x5 pads (mostly) to stop 2 tons of rolling steel and aluminum from crashing or making us into human pancakes.

With electric power steering, fuel pump, ECU that only works within a certain voltage, DLRs always on, and all the other electric powered parts of a modern car? My money is on dead enough battery to not run before boil over. The battery doesn't have to be completely drained to shut down the car.

No EPS without alternator. Current-limited DRL? Returnless fuel system? I'll take that bet any day.

That's exactly the reason why I always thought we should have rubber roads and concrete tires ......... :cheers:


humfrz

Thanks @humfrz @Tcoat

It depends on the driving condition too. Whether it's at the track pushing the engine to redline with extreme temperature, or regular city driving with bumper to bumper traffic. Either way though, the vehicle will shut off ;)

What are you talking about? On what facts are basing this horse shit?

OK, this calls for an easy experiment.

We will need 4 participants.

Each with a twin.

Remove the serpentine belt.

Start the car.

Drive the cars at 45 MPH till they quit running.

Read the temperature gauge ....... read the voltage of the battery.

Charge the battery and start (or try to start) the car.

If it starts and runs OK, @Tcoat , @n0thing and humfrz are correct ..... @Ultramaroon is wrong.

OK, @n0thing ...... you go first and report back.

humfrz - retired scienteeeeeest ........... :D

Watch out folks ol Ultramaroon is getten grumpy tonight ........ his stocking hanging from the fireplace must have been a bit light this year ...... :iono:


:D



humfrz

Been there, done that. I don't talk shit. I talk from experience.

OK, let's see the raw data from your experiment ...... let's see if will stand up to a pier review ....... :popcorn:


;)


humfrz

I'm not enjoying this. After you have disabled your alternator and driven around for a spell, let's compare notes.

I'm sorry to hear you had a failed alternator experience ...... :(

I feel badly that I was rubbing salt in the wound ...... :bonk:

Please forgive me ........ :sigh:


humfrz

One day months ago I removed the accessory belt to prove to myself the car would start and run on battery only. I know Tcoat was in the thread where we discussed it. I just figured you had followed along.

I know enough about the power requirements of this car, and have enough experience limping home with failed alternators on previous cars, to state with confidence that without an accessory belt, this thing will run on battery waaaaaaaaaaaaay longer than it will take to overheat.

I'm happy to discuss the topic in earnest, and admit my pu55y hurt a little when you assigned me homework. :cheers:

Well, after doing some research on several batteries, it appears the average RC (Reserve Capacity) is about 60 minutes.

So, even if the FR-S battery was half that, the engine would overheat, due to the water pump not running, before the battery would run out of juice.

So, there ........ @Tcoat was WRONG !......... :D


humfrz

Did you actually think about what you wrote before you posted?

What did you think was driving the accessory belt, some random motor? It's all connected to the crank.

I gave him that. I scratched my head until I worked my way back to the timing belt. I think that's what he meant.

I would like to keep stirring, and ask the OP what older cars had a direct crank driven water pump that worked with out a belt.

Apparently I did not express myself very well. By driven by crank, I mean timing belt. If water pump is driven by t-belt and t-belt breaks, suppose engine is non-interference, everything stops. No danger of overheat.

If it is driven by accessory belt, there seems to be this weird possibility that an engine can work itself to death. I think this is what I was trying to ask. Just some clarification.

99% of the half-decent engine designs out there puts the alternator and the water pump on the same belt.

So unless you are a truly ignorant driver to the various lights that will come on after the alternator stops charging, the chances of you blowing up the engine from a belt failure + overheat is next to none.

-alex

For fear of inflaming this thread any further, I will comment on the original question.

Yes, there is a sensor and a mechanism ....... the sensor is called a temperature gauge and the mechanism is the driver shutting down the engine.

Now, who wants to debate that ...... :popcorn:


:D


humfrz

That is not good enough. A lot of people would keep driving it till home to avoid a tow truck. They might get lucky on some other stuff, but not this one. Of course, they have no clue.

Oh, I'm glad you said 99% ........ :thumbsup:

My grandfather's older Ford Model T, was a fine machine ....... and it didn't have a water pump or an alternator ...... :)

I remember well that my grandfather would put me "behind the wheel" when I was about 3-4 years old (to keep me out of the way, no doubt), and I would "drive" for hours (never leaving the barn) ........ oh, the questions I would have ..... what does this do ...... how does this work ....... why ........:confused0068:


humfrz

Most car owners fall into this category. What saves the unwashed masses is that modern accessory belts can last practically the life of the car.

Usually something else pukes before the belt.

Maybe those folks would have benefitted from a temperature gauge like this as a constant reminder ....... :iono:

:D


humfrz

Then those people deserve to be stranded on the side of the road.

...... and so, you would just leave her there .......??


humfrz

Temperature gauges are going the way of the dodo. My wife's mazda only has a light for when the temp is low and a light for high temp. Most likely won't even notice the temp light came on. Hell her tire pressure was low and the car beeps when a warning light comes on. We both looked at the cluster for 30-45 seconds before we found the light. So much other stuff on the cluster that warning lights just blend in.

Seems like we are moving further from the idea that people are capable of monitoring their own vehicles. You won't have to see a light or figure out what it means. The car will just speak to you, set up a service appointment, drive itself to the appointment if it can or call a tow truck itself. Then you will get a service bill in the mail and just won't care what was actually wrong. Its fixed now and you didn't have to lift a finger. Not looking forward to this. Hopefully not in my lifetime.

True, except for the bolded part. The service cost will just be direct deducted from your checking account ....... :D


humfrz