Supercharge vs Turbo
 

I'm in the market for boosting my 2017 Toyota 86.
I know both come with their own positives and negatives.
But, which is best for the 86?
Thanks in advance!

You want top end power and don't care about waiting for power? Turbo.

You want consistent torque boost off the line? Supercharger

Nothing is "best". It depends on what the driver wants.

I just want to see nicer WHP and have more fun with the car in general.

E85 + Turbo

This is what im gona do ^

Pros for Super:
- Instant throttle response
- Low maintenance (on most kits) and less need for monitoring
- Great midrange torque (on twin screw)
- Great whine noise (on some types of kits)

Pros for Turbo:
- Fuel economy off boost is going to be considerably better
- More 'feeling' of speed (during rush of acceleration) (this is also subjective)
- More options to add power
- Turbo noises

BEST advice I had (& now give) is to try drive in different cars with different options. Ask local tuners or 86 clubs, guys are normally happy to meet you and show what they’ve got. They all add power, but have a different feel when sitting in the seat.

Ended up going SC myself because I like the immediate torque.

Another pro for supercharger is you can keep your header if you already have one.

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Actually, turbo kits come with a manifold, so in my book it would be a plus to sell off your header and put that money towards the kit :)

This question is like asking this group what color is best.
Follow 86 South Africa's advice and find people in your area, and have them give you a ride to find what fits your style.

Normally EL too. I'd rather keep a UEL. Even though EL is better for boost. That UEL sound can't be beat.

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Yeah that's a good point - there are a couple kits that do UEL turbo manifolds. I personally prefer EL over UEL so I guess I'm lucky if I ever go turbo :)

With Ptuning turbo kit, you can retain header. It's OPTIONAL to get theirs.

I have JDL UEL kit

So these PROs arent limited to just SCs

To me the big catch on a stock motor is that a supercharger plus header gets you fairly close to where the turbo gets you and without the added complexity.

Best is the one you want.

Both can easily get you over 500hp, with the right supporting mods.

I was set on a supercharger. One of my biggest requirements was reliability. This ended up with me buying a turbo charger since they are a simpler design with less moving parts. (May be a little more complicated to install? Both will only take you a day.) On both if you shell you compressor you may destroy your engine. If shell the drive on a supercharger you are calling a tow truck, on a turbo you limp home.

2017

edelbrock. they run a warranty on your engine.

Oil pan tap, dedicated oil pump, radiant heat roasting wires and shortening component life, cracked manifolds, higher initial expense, no good way to turbo and keep emissions cert (yes I'm aware of the one carb turbo kit but it's gimped). Not too attractive a trade off imo for the advantage of being able to limp home a trashed turbo.

No oil pan tap? Even if I had to do that who cares it is a quick weld. Scavenge pump is no issue. Radiant head? You just have to insulate and make sure you improve air flow. Higher initial expense? Not sure where you came up with that? Even if it cost more who cares, These cars are enexpensive. Emissions cert? Who cares I do not live in CA.

Basic addition using quality parts. I did the math.

What is the parts list for this complete turbo kit that is both cheaper and more reliable than a supercharger?

Turbo is definitely a higher initial cost if you want to do it *right*.

That being said, my own car is turbocharged.

I should add that they only cover your engine during the manufacturer warranty period, not from the day you install the e-force. And only if you take it to an approved installer. If your car is already 3 years old, there is no warranty.

Mighty car mods did a Turbocharged vs Supercharged with Miata's that I enjoyed watching.


[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0NMCMcdVp4&t=647s"]Turbocharged vs. Supercharged - Part 1 - YouTube[/ame]

Not the powertrain warranty?

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3 years/36,000 miles measured from the original date of the car’s purchase, and 0 miles on the odometer.
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/...y/eforce.shtml

Turbo vs supercharger has always been a debate! I can say that there are steps into finding out witch is right for your!...
1. How much power do you want?
A. Yes a super can make good horsepower, but probably not as much as a turbo!
B. So let’s assume you have decided one under 500hp.
2. Do you want to build your engine?
A. Supercharger makes roughly 300-400 stock block
B. Turbo makes roughly 400-500 hp stock block
3. Have you ever drove a boosted car before?
A. If you like the way a turbo drives that’s something to consider
B. A supercharger is like driving a na car but with more power
1.twin screw charger is like having a bigger motor(v6-v8)
2. Centrifugal charger is like the motor is like driving this same motor but with higher pull at top end. Almost like a turbo without the abrupt hit of power
4. What are you using your car for?
A. Remember a supercharger has almost zero lag, never worry about losing power
B. A turbo if not driven right will lose power during shift, in corners, etc.
5. What about install
A. Turbo more complex install and more time and money
B. Supercharger install still not easy (who is installing??)
6. What tuning option do you have?
A. Do you live next to someone who can trouble shoot a turbo
B. ?? Trouble shoot a supercharger??
7. Finally let’s look at reliability?
A. Turbo-more heat
B. Supercharger-if something happens to belt your stuck


**************disclaimer**********************
This is just a opinion, nothing here was ment to hurt or harm the reputation of the other. This was just information ment to help one in a better choice. If anyone should take my advice seriously, they do so at there own risk. I am not responsible for any dumbass action in choosing one over the other! If you blow your engine its not my fault, you should of pick the other!! Lol

a good piece of telly but I was dissapointed they used a centrifugal blower
if they had a twin screw / eaton type on there it would have been a better comparison

For me $500 on a $5k to $6k expense is negligible. Jackson racing kit $4k, I received a ok deal on an AVO kit $4.5K.

I started this journey wanting the Sprintex. Looks like a good reliable supercharger. (Same price as the AVO). One thing for me is it has to look like it belongs. Decided I did not want to give up my 2017 red intake. This pushed me toward the HKS kit since it is the cleanest looking install out of all the kits. After reading the owners thread and not being able to get thru any page without someone complaining about a supercharger failure decided that is not a good choice for me(I am sure a lot of the failures are self induced). Then looked into the Jackson racing. That one appears to be the most reliable out of all of them. But did not like the looks with the air cleaner out in the open in the engine bay. Then if you add a cold air you end up having to take the front bumper off to clean the filter. Do not want that ether. The 2017 filter is acceptable for my requirements. Then I was looking at the Works kit. Clean install but will not fit the 2017 at this time. I stumbled across the AVO kit. Has an extremely clean looking install all the heat is generated where the original exhaust was designed to be. All the above kits will get me in the 300hp range with E85. And yes I have read all the above installation manuals plus more. and do not see that any one is more difficult than the other.

Anyway all of them would be fun they are forced induction! For me the turbo brings a more reliable platoform. To each his own this is why we have such great choices for this car. What other car do you have this many options for forced induction? It makes it hard to decide.

I think this is where our opinions diverge, because I can confidently say without looking at the parts list that I would not be getting everything that "I" would want in a turbo kit at $4.5k. When I priced the turbo option with all the accessories I'd need, it came out to ~$7500. I agree the cost difference isn't necessarily big enough to be a deal breaker, but it is more expensive.

Agreed. It's great to have so many options. I prefer a lot of things about turbos, but the stock rod weakness, along with the Edelbrock and CS400 being able to get me near where I think the safe limit is, has me leaning away from turbos. It would be another story if I was looking forward to building the engine some day.

As long as you keep the boost levels sane (i.e. 7-10 psi for a base kit), I would think a turbo would be more friendly to stock rods than a supercharger kit, unless you're absolutely lugging/loading up the turbo at low rpm in higher gears (which is just begging for problems). Consider flooring a car at 4000 rpm in 2nd gear (with sticky tires) - superchargers and their instant response could provide a much higher instant load on the stock rods than any turbo kit.

Also I'm somewhat wary of the Rotrex kits - the number of failures (regardless of kit manufacturer) of the Rotex units is not insignificant. May be due to incorrect priming or belt tension, not sure, but the failures are there. If you have warranty coverage, your car is out of commission for weeks. If you don't have warranty coverage, you're out $1500-$2000. On the other hand, take a basic SBD kit, they sell for <$3000, add $1000 in protective goodies, and if that turbo fails it's no where near as expensive to replace as a rotrex units. Maybe the Vortech units/Eaton/Sprintex units are more reliable, don't know much about their track records.

They both have their reliability issues, any FI is a risk. End of the day, I decided my car with tune & header is quick enough :)

Turbo ... but we're biased :thumbup:

Has anyone logged their fuel consumption before and after their FI swap?

SC's are friendlier to the rods; less torque at low rpm.

I don't think there's evidence to back that up as a concern, especially not with centri's that are only generating a few psi anyway at that rpm. Throttle tip in programming can control this if it's a problem.

I agree on the Rotrex units. Turbos leak and fail too though. I would not expect the turbo in a $3k kit to outlast an Eaton TVS.

At that point I'd consider the turbo (fairly easily replaced) as a maintenance item ;)

I would say that at the same PSI/temp supercharger or turbo the stress is the same on the engine. You will see less torque at the wheels of a supercharged engine but that is because some of the torque is going out the front of the engine to run the supercharger. But the engine stress is the same.

I'm still going over this, but I think I'm going with an edelbrock supercharger because I want instant torque and low maintenance. This is my summer daily and a supercharger is easy to set up and very low maintenance for the HP I want. I want to make a max of 350-400 on E85. I think over 400HP you start to break a lot of parts. To get over 400HP a turbo may be a better choice. A supercharger offer an easy set amount of power. A turbo is way easier to add boost and power but over 400 HP will probably need a engine rebuild and you are dealing with a lot of heat with a turbo and becomes higher maintenance. With turbos you also have to find a kit that makes the power where you want it.. But a turbo is great if you like to tune, change from 5,10,15lbs of boost just by changing maps. A supercharger you have to change pulleys but is only effective to a point. I'm going with a supercharger if the stock engine and car could safely hold 500HP I would get a turbo but it's personal choice you can get a turbo to almost replicate a supercharger with more available top end....

I'll be doing this! I've been using the Fuelly app since I bought my car last year, and ordered a JDL kit recently.

Since the turbo is an exhaust restriction, I think the supercharger makes slightly more power in the cylinder (at same efficiency, psi, etc). Agree the turbo should put more to the wheels.

I have the SBD and so do a few guys here in Atlanta and I know some guys personally who have driven 55-60k miles without turbo or engine failure on a "supposedly" cheap turbo.

Turbo all the way, i started off with a c38 rotrex it was nice but it wasnt all that, tbh i never felt like the car was boosted it just feels na and you have to rip it to feel the power. I then switch to Ptuning with gen 2 gtx2867r i dont think i can recommend superchargers anymore with the turbo power is still linear and still pulls all the way up to redline. All that turbo noises that low end and mid range tq is fuckin awsome. Rotrex setup i made 277whp 200wtq at 8 psi with my gtx2867r i made 323whp 271wtq at 9 psi