Kobe Steel
 

Firm faked data for metal (some aluminum and copper) used in planes and cars. :clap::paddle:
Customers: Toyota, Subaru, Nissan, Mazda, Mitsubishi, Honda, Boeing, Kawasaki ...

The problems could stretch back 10 years.
At the moment, the impact is unclear.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...n-data-scandal

Have you got a beef with that?

Kind of a bullshit story. Really has nothing to do with steal. Mostly cheap aluminum.
For those in the metal working industry, it's not much of an issue.

Just what everyone already knows cheap aluminum is cheap because it's not 100% aluminum. But guess what? It's still holds and is as strong as 100% aluminum. It may just 90%.

Recall / replacement with carbon fiber parts when?

Maybe he has steaks in it?

So what is the difference? Extra weight? :)

Kobe steel (神戸ビーフ Kōbe steel) (KO-BEH) refers to steel from the Tajima strain of Wagyu metal, raised in Japan's Hyogo Prefecture according to rules as set out by the Kobe Steel Marketing and Distribution Promotion Association. The metal is a delicacy renowned for its flavor, tenderness, and fatty, well-marbled texture. Kobe steel can be prepared as steak, sukiyaki, shabu shabu, sashimi, and teppanyaki. Kobe steel is generally considered one of the three top brands (known as Sandai Wagyuu, "the three big steels"), along with Matsusaka steel and Ōmi steel or Yonezawa steel.

The difference is probably miniscule since not much is made out of pure aluminum anyway. Most manufactured items are an alloy of some kind or another.
As the article says the bigger issue isn't that they made some out of spec products (the finished goods could potentially be better than spec) it is that they falsified reports and test results.

Aaaaa.........Haaaaaa !!!!!!!

Now we know why the TOB-ings in our cars are weak ............:eyebulge:


humfrz

At the moment we know very little. They said that metal failed to meet quality standards.

Data was fabricated for about 19,300 tonnes of aluminium products, 2,200 tonnes of copper products and 19,400 units of aluminium castings and forgings shipped from September 2016 through August 2017, but they warned that the problems in certification could date back 10 years, and steel powder product sent to one customer did not meet the client's specifications too.

Okay what dollar amount are we looking at when the class action lawsuit check comes in the mail?

.00000008 cents

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The difference is the strength and braking point.
Everyone is pretty much familiar with cheap replacement auto parts right? For example water pumps. Everyone know the cheap ones will only last a few year if best. Usually the seals go because the shaft gets worn out due to the aluminum quickly rubs itself out.

Or we all seen some type suspension part and see it either brake or get cracked.

Those are pretty much ware items so there's always a life span to it.

I can only guess what made the writers panties get bunched is potentially crash test data would be false. Meaning that maybe 10% weaker metals where used.

Personally to me it's not an issue at all. Most "aircraft" grade or "military" grade metals are slightly better than base line metals.
Think if it this way: the ugly stick you buy are only good for cracking 100 skulls. Everyone knows that.
Pricey ugly sticks do only last 100 skulls. Where as the cheaper ones only last about 85-90 skulls. There's the question would you rather pay more to get that 10-15 more broken skulls and then buy a replacement or would you pay less knowing that you'll eventually have to buy a replacement ugly stick?

They are both ugly sticks, they bash in skulls just the same but one would brake sooner than the other. Not a lot sooner but almost close to the end of its life.

Those contaminates in the aluminum are what determine the physical properties of the final product.
Some good properties or some bad properties.

At a local air shop, I was part of a group that was responsible for destructive testing on each and every job lot of new material coming in the door.
It got rejected if it did not meet the requirements. They still do that and keep meticulous records that go along with the lot.

I'm relatively sure there won't be any local airframes breaking unexpectedly. Expectedly is a different kettle of fish.
If they were getting sub-spec materials, they'd know about it fairly sharpish and would have said something.
Maybe not on motoring.au though.

I was in the jury pool once in federal court for a case that involved a storage company that lost the papers for a pile of structural material in their care.
Worth millions if the papers are still with them. $42.32 without papers for scrap (relatively).

Oh! I know all about this shiz! [jump up and down waving hands]

I didn't get selected for that jury.

A bodyshop in the states lost a laws suit for like 10's of millions because they glued the roof back onto a Honda Fit instead of welding it. This reduced the structural integrity and "Safety cage" of the vehicle. They got into an accident. Boom

So this relates to your post because companies are now suing Kobe and apparently in the automotive sector the aluminium was mainly used in trunks/hatches/hoods and roofs of Japanese vehicles...all of which would affect the structural integrity and safety cages of the vehicle

this could be a huge huge deal if anyone has been injured or hurt. Like Takata and one defective part ruining their business. (That and hiding it, just like Kobe did)

Link to further info? I can find nothing about lawsuits. The attached only talks about a couple of manufacturers and only mentions doors and hoods.

Cuz they didn't want to keep dealing with a hung jury. :lol:

Uncle Intel don't need no links.

Hey Tcoat, I will look. There is this from bloomberg but I based my statement on the CBC Radio 1 and their business analyst talking about it.

Over 500 firms affected, unlikely people will not pass on legal liability to Kobe http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/afp...-affected.html

This is why there's not much reason to panic. When people's lives (or investments on the order of several hundred million dollars and up) are at risk there is extensive testing performed on ERRYTHANG. Bad batches on important shit would have been rejected long ago.

Just gotta keep on living life or the terroris- I mean capitalists win.

The bigger potential problem is not with Kobe, but rather with the producers of the end product not doing their due diligence to test everything to the standard it needs to be tested to. If any company is truly shitting bricks right now it's their own fault for not verifying what they buy. Kobe doesn't get a free pass, but there's typically not a single point failure that can doom an end product when it comes to material science.

FYI The Daily Mail is not a reliable news source.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daily_Mail

"The Daily Mail is a British daily middle-market[2][3] tabloid newspaper owned by the Daily Mail and General Trust[4] and published in London."



This is only a story because of the fucking 24 hour news cycle having nothing better to talk about, should be a 5 minute story on the 6 o'clock news and in a month another blip on any repurcussions not fucking pages and pages of bullshit by people who don't have any idea what the problem actually is.

There is A LOT of mis-information in this thread.

I work in metal working industry. Most shops..even.."aerospace" shops do not care enough to request "certs"(certifications). Have heard stories where they even know the material is bad or the wrong grade ..but since it is for an aircraft seat bracket it's okay.

Most in the industry have seen the decline in quality in grades. From welders to machinists...we know we are working with crap. Most of it is all the same too in how bad it is. A guy I knew studying engineering was testing automotive rims, half the wheels didn't have the metals they were supposed to have and the other half had to much shit they werent' supposed to. The asian market is laughing at us melting anything and everything together. They don't give a shi%t about it either.

PS- Any LARGE corporations using this metal in stamping or machining LARGE quantities should have done in house testing for sure. I do agree with that.

We check one in every hundred rotor blanks we bring in for about 20 critical things. We have scrapped thousands that did not meet all of the requirements.

People need to read the material much closer. There is not one single thing said about the material being bad. The issue was that the reports were false. Everybody just assumes the material was bad but it just as easily could have been fine or even better than it should. They didn't do th documentation they should have and then just made shit up. They got caught making shit up not sending out bad product.

I would bet that all the end users did indeed do their checks and there was nothing wrong with the products that is why it went on so long.

Statement Regarding Impact of Kobe Steel Quality Issue on Toyota and Lexus Vehicles
http://newsroom.toyota.co.jp/en/detail/19202565/

Statement Concerning Impact of Kobe Steel’s Inappropriate Conduct on Subaru Vehicles
https://www.media.subaru-global.com/en/news/2502

^^U honestly think any auto company is going to recall a car because the hood is not the right grade aluminum??

They wont issue recalls or admit anything is wrong unless it is major components.
But then again.and ignition switch is pretty small................

Fuck I'll be worried about the JDM aluminum alloy rims before worrying about the hood. The stock rims are made by Hitachi.

If you understand Japanese OCD mentality with precision engineering then this is more of a problem with their domestic market image rather than their export market quality.

But the braking point is very important, especially when tracking one's car. This is why there are distance markers on some tracks befor a bend/corner. If one brakes to soon you lose time and if you brake too late you might end up breaking something.