After owning it for several years - would you still buy it again?
 

I do not have BRZ/86 but considering one.

I used to own Honda Prelude as DD and autocross car - was very happy with it - fun to drive and reliable - and maybe I shouldn't have sold it. But it was front wheel drive, fairly heavy and max tire width you could install without dealing with rubbing issues was 215 (stock 205)...

So I sold it justifying I needed a 4 door 4 seat car, and I wanted it sporty, manual trans, and there was no alternative to BMW 3 series at the time. Almost at the same time I bought Mini Cooper S (manual transmission, LSD) to my wife.

Pretty soon I realized that was big mistake on my end. Mini Cooper saw two flat bead towing trucks in several years. Something that no other car did to me. Big engine carbonization issues, HPFP failure, some genius made coolant and oil flows separated by a plastic gasket inside the engine. Sure enough it cracked eventually... it also consumed 1+qt per 1000 miles and that was considered ok - everyone gets that... radiator fan would randomly turn on after the engine shut off. No engine temperature gauge.... They fix\upgrade something all the time with TSBs/recalls/extended warranties - adding shields to turbo piping of fixing oil pump that was setting cars on fire after you turn the engine off... So we were scared to drive the car too far from the service center. I sold it with great relief.

BMW didn't have this many small things, but got the engine replaced out of warranty. BMW partially accepted their fault and covered 70% of the replacement. So I thought, at least new engine is beneficial. But then electric water-pump fails, AC smells like shit (evaporator leaks), you cannot even replace the battery without some computer programming that is not available to you in reasonable way. So, I think I am giving up. Will fix it and sell.

I worked on Prelude for the pleasure of it (and sometimes fixing it) - suspension and other tweaks, but working on the car just to make it run and because it is ridiculously expensive to go to the dealer.... that's not my peace of bread. I do not want to deal with car makes that waste your time, energy and resources anymore.

Looking my way back towards japan cars, hoping I still can find something fun and reliable.

So, from this point of view... Would you recommend BRZ\86 or not? Does it have serious long term ownership issues?

Also, between the twins which one would you suggest? From just going through brochures I could see that Toyota has Hill Start Assist (can I turn it off?) and Subaru does not. Also, I see they have different infotainment systems. From my experience with one in Outback - Subaru's not good as it does not integrate )yet) with Android Auto or iOS thing.... what other not obvious (but important) differences these cars have?

Unless you love the looks of the new 86, there is no reason to buy it over the BRZ. The BRZ comes with more stuff out of the box for less money. It also has Hill Start Assist. You should be able to turn it off.


I owned a 2001 Prelude SH. It was a nice daily driver, but heavy and a little numb. My 1998 GSR was a lot more fun, and reminds me of my FRS.


Have you driven one of these cars yet? That's what I would suggest first.


I have owned mine for over 3 years and I can't think of a car I would rather own, but I have a son so I need the rear seats. If I didn't need rear seats I would probably driving a used Cayman S.

I had a love hate relationship with my fr-s when i first got it, but it was mainly due to me fkn up on my financing lol.

Now that i've come to terms with that and have been living with it for a few years, honestly i'd buy another one if I was in the market for another sports car. It's a car you either love or hate, and that love or hate depends on you as a driver and enthusiast. If you want fast acceleration, and a car you can race people in and win, this isn't that car. This car feels like you're in a race every time I drive it. Having to rev this car high and being able to brake and turn on a dime is a ton of fun, and besides the blah radio and afterthought cupholders (which i think have been fixed in the new models), its a really really fun, cool looking car.

HOWEVER, i'm most likely going to hold onto mine until the wheels fall off and my next vehicle will defintely be big enough to haul a drum set. :D

Coincidentally, my last 2 cars before the BRZ were a Prelude and a MINI Cooper S. Really liked the Prelude and when it just got too many miles I bought the MINI looking for fun handling. Found out it really didn't deserve the "go cart handling" rep it has and, as you said, was easily the least reliable car I've ever owned. Super happy with the BRZ. It handles like I wished the MINI did, similar acceleration to both of your previous cars. Seriously check the back seat for functionality, though. I find it less useful than even the MINI.

I do not want to do this yet.
If I will be impressed, I could just buy it :)

I'd like to collect some information and be a little more cold blooded this time. Despite all the issues that came soon, the Cooper was very engaging car to drive...

You should at least sit in one. This car isn't very impressive on paper. Once you sit down in the low bucket seat, you will start to realize why people enjoy this car.


Where in California are you located?

Kids grow, and rear seats are mostly for a dog (this ruled miata out) and occasional passenger.

I took my time to seat in one at auto show several years ago. Could be fancier, but very solid and tough - was my impression. I believe latest upgrade made the interior better, but not sure.

I am in SF Bay Area.

bought mine new in 2015. love, love, love it every single day. It's a very fun car to drive, I get very good gas mileage (avg 28mpg) even though I don't exactly baby it (I don't drive like I'm racing it everywhere but do some spirited driving once in awhile). as was already said the back seats are only useful for putting a jacket or maybe a small dog back there.
I do use it as more of a 2nd car but it's mostly because I don't want to put a ton of miles on it or thrash the interior from being dirty when I get off of work.

Every time I walk towards or away from the car I still look at it and smile. Really hard to beat that almost 2 years after purchase.

Short answer yes but this thread is silly if you haven't done a test drive, you should judge it for yourself. Hill start assist is on both the 17+ 86 and BRZ and is indeed something you can turn on/off. Both infotainment systems are roughly about the same, neither have Android Auto/Apple Car Play which I don't give a rat's ass considering you have to plug your phone in every time..I'm totally satisfied by just the standard bluetooth connection though music can sound pretty compressed at times.

There really aren't too many differences besides the front and rear bumpers. The 2017 BRZ still uses the older style bumper/diffuser and the 86's rear bumper has slightly different body lines + diffuser (pretty minimal though). While you can generally get a better interior with the BRZ (and the GT86 outside NA), almost all the FRS/86 Toyota's special editions feature the same upgraded interior so technically that window is open too..

E. The new Performance Pack offered on the BRZ is actually the biggest difference which is pretty significant considering Toyota has yet to offer anything similar or even put it on their latest special edition 86...though these are pretty easy mods if you want to upgrade the suspension, brakes, tires and wheels yourself..

As far as reliability you shouldn't encounter anything major as long as you keep the engine stock..

https://www.truedelta.com/Scion-FR-S...1096,2013-2016
https://www.truedelta.com/Subaru-BRZ...1097,2013-2016

Would I buy it again? Well, yes I did! I have a 2015 BRZ that I purchased new, love the car. I've owned over 30 vehicles and this one has been the most enjoyable to drive. I also purchased my Son a FR-S for his first car. I prefer the BRZ (bought the limited) since it came with extra's that I wanted for a price that made it worth while. Go to Toyota and Subaru and try out both and see what you think. The car may not be the one for you, but take one for a spin and see what you think.

Yes, and no.

As others have mentioned, you need to test drive one to know if you want it or not.

Fun, yes.
Reliable, like most other cars.

Would I recommend? Yes and no, depending on if you want more power, more space, more comfort, or whatever you want out of your car.

Most of the problems people deal with are lack of power (addressed by mods), improved handling or braking (addressed by mods), or just general practicality issues. Most of the conversation around reliability is really split between people that know how to work on (and solve) their own car problems, and those that don't. Too many people go out and put ECU tunes on their cars, when they don't understand or realize the consequences it may bring if something goes wrong.

So, just go test drive... save yourself the questions.

Hello accel and welcome to our happy gang ....... :clap:

Too bad you had some miserable experiences with cars ..... :(

I've had my FR-S for 4 years now ...... and yes, I would buy it again.

It's pretty much "what you see and how it first drives" is want you get. It doesn't get any faster with age, nor do the back seats get any larger.....;).

Even if you leave it stock, most likely it will exceed your driving capabilities.

If you don't mess with the engine ...... it won't mess with you.

FR-S or BRZ ? ...... makes no difference, which ever tickles your fancy most.

If you get one, come on back ...... if a forum search doesn't answer your questions, our panel of experts can answer most of them .......:thumbsup:


humfrz

Yes. No doubt about it, since 2013, I love my BRZ.

Yes if i found a bargain. But i would rather buy a 370z

HELL YES!!!!

i bought mine last feb and love it!!!

Here is a list of cars i have owned in chronological order, so you can get an idea of my experience, taste, and background. Oh, i am a drifter btw so that has a bit of influence ;)

65 chevy el camino
89 civic hatchback
92 240sx hatch
86 corolla gts (my favorite car in the universe)
94 silvia
95 240sx
02 gs300
98 camaro z28
86 corolla 20v (i really love these cars!)
12 civic hf (garbage)
13 accord sport (amazing daily sedan)
15 accord sport (yup, that good!)
16 frs

Based on all that, the frs is probably the 3rd favorite, but its growing higher on the list as i mod it. Only thing better was the original 86 and my 400hp silvia i owned in japan. The frs actually falls somewhere inbetween those two, as far as driving characteristics.

If you liked the lude for handling and sportyness, you will love the 86/brz.
If you liked the bmw for the rwd manual layout, you will love the 86/brz.
If you liked the lude or the bmw for power, look elsewhere lol

Oh and i have twin 8 year old kiddos. They fit back there! I promise!

Seriously, go drive one. I didnt have to, the car is a dream come true to me. But go experience it for yourself!

I have not used my new car warranty for anything but peace of mind. Had the car for 2.5 years now. Stock engine, but plenty of other mods.

More than happy to buy another one after this one should something happen to the poor thing. Love everything about the twins.

I got mine at the end of 2012. I autox and track it and it hasn't let me down once. Even with all the abuse it's still a reliable DD for me.

So yeah I would totally buy it again.

I was rear ended recently and while I was waiting for the adjuster to come take a look at it, I was preparing myself for if they said they were going to call it totaled. Financially I am about double where I was when I bought the car and I thought about my options if I did have to buy something else. Thought about Mustang GT, WRX, 235, 370z and Miata. Made up my mind that if I had to get a new car, it would be a BRZ. Only reason I would get the BRZ over the 86 is because it has the heated alcantara seats and auto climate control and stuff that I'm used to from my monogram edition. I ultimately have no regrets with this car. I love the thing. It really is my perfect daily driver. I even had a mostly full sized human being ride in the backseat once.
So yes. If I had to do it again, I would do the same thing.
Also they are fixing my car so I don't have to buy a new one. I hope I can keep this thing forever.

Definitely yes if swap engine will cost too much. I am planning 2jz swap if this engine is done, but most likely not anytime soon (currently 39000miles).

I have owned my 2000 Honda Civic SI for 11 years, and I still do today. It has some suspension modifications (shocks/springs, sway bars, end links, bushings etc.), supportive Recaro Speed seats, and a 98 spec JDM Integra Type R engine swap. It is a fun car, and a little brother to your Honda Prelude, so it is much similar to what you have experienced from a 90s-00s era Honda.

I have owned my 2016 BRZ for a little over a year now. It is mainly stock with no modifications. One thing I can say is my BRZ is leagues better in terms of being a drivers car when comparing it to my Civic.

The BRZ driving dynamics are better. It corners better, the steering feel is better, and acceleration/power is on par with my Civic's engine swap. Overall, the driving feel is something my Civic cannot match. And, that is saying a lot because my BRZ has no modifications.

In the end, everyone has a different opinion on the BRZ, FR-S, 86. The biggest thing that will help you make a decision is to check out the car in person and test drive it.

I did.

Base model (premium) of BRZ is currently cheaper than the Toyota 86. (Both Made in Japan).

If you don't decide on this model, then go with just any car with a J as the first digit of it's vin number. That means you'll get the quality of assembly only Japan can bring. Many Japanese designed cars are made elsewhere. Don't fall for it...insist on a J.

You'll be happy you got away from those British and German cars.

After four years i still enjoy driving a stock brz.
It is "reliably fun to drive".
But it is not a car for everyone , my wife prefers to drive an automatic camry.
The camry is both "reliably boring" and "boringly reliable".

I did too.

I have had my BRZ for 4 years now. Chicago winters and all, I love this car. No regrets. Test drive it first though.

Yes. A buddy of mine was shopping for a vehicle a few weeks ago, so I went to CarMax with him to check cars out. I ended up sitting in ~50 different vehicles. None of them came close to how I feel in my own car. It was actually rather comforting because I knew I had spent my money well.

If my car got destroyed, I'd either get a 2017 BRZ with the PP or some 25+ year old RHD car from my local importer.

I agree with Humfrz a lot here.
I only had my BRZ for about 6 Months before I bought/inherited my Grandfather's 1991 Miata. At that point, I did sell my BRZ, but I really enjoyed it during the time I had it.

I am still active on these forums...so here is an easy cheat sheet.

Are you more about "feel" than power and you want a reliable DD that is relatively inexpensive?
Yes? Buy a Twin or a Miata (you need a backseat, so I would recommend the Twin)

Do you want a little more "oomph" and don't care about "feel"?
Buy a Mustang/Camaro/350Z or 370Z.

If you want power AND feel...
Buy a used, well sorted 911 or Cayman.

The people who regret buying a Twin are the ones who mod it too much (thus its no longer inexpensive or reliable)

Watch this Video and it will help you make a good decision.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkPa5b9oQjE&t=2s"]BRZ with $30,000 in Mods - YouTube[/ame]

I've never owned a car twice .... so to answer your 1st question. No .... I wouldn't buy the FR-S again. But damn I enjoyed the car immensely. Reliability was good for the 3 yrs 36,000 miles I put on the car. Believe me .... those were not granny miles either. My rear tires were bald after the 1st year.

The car just works. I like to switch cars every few years which is why I moved on. Life is short. Enjoy as many cool cars as you can. The FR-S has been checked off my car list.

I read the question as less, "would you buy a second one to replace the first", but "are you glad you bought the first one?"

So yeah - almost four years in and there are no regrets. I planned from the beginning to keep it for ten years and barring unforeseen mechanical problems, I have no problem still envisioning that (bonus, when the original ten elapses in 2022, I should be able to buy a five year old Supra and the FR-S will become a dedicated track car :D ).

Similar to others, I try to avoid buying the same car twice. But if my FR-S got totaled today, I could see myself buying a 17 BRZ with PP. Testament to both how good the car is and how void the market is of similar cars (lightweight RWD coupes). I guess I'd also consider a Mustang GT PP and Camaro SS 1LE, but they are +1000 lbs and +250 hp so very different cars to drive. Possibly another Boxster/Cayman S, but I've already had a 987 so probably a 981 generation this time if I was to go down that road again.

When I first saw this car I fell in love with the way it looks. The 2013 model I own is gorgeous. I was worried about its lack of power though. I test drove a bunch of cars before and none looked as good and I wanted more power (I never drove it yet). I test drove one of the cars I really wanted but it was a bit out of my price range. The WRX STi and the power the car has is incredible. I loved it but the FRS looked better. Then I drove the FRS. When you get into the car you feel like you are a part of it. It just fits like a glove. When you first start driving the car and take the nannies off you see how well this car was made. You can push the car the whole time having tons of fun and not worry cause its so balanced. Sliding the car around is so easy and fun its hard not to do it. It is a little lacking in power but that can be fixed with some money. Still to this day I get out of my car and smile while I admire it (Its still stock btw). If I was in the market for a new FR-S/BRZ and could afford it. I would buy the car and have a Edelbrock supercharger installed right away. Edelbrock will take over the warranty from Toy/Sub for the drivetrain. I love this car though and would rather have this car than anything else you can buy for under 45k.

Short answer: YES

Back story:
I had driven VWs from 1985 til I got the BRZ new in Nov 2013.

My GTI was a great drive as a commuter and as a autobahn cruiser (i85-i95 corridor mainly). Stock suspension was soft, easily found the limit with spirited suburban driving.

But what drove me off the brand was the reliability problems. My Golf and Passat had several sensor failures, cv boots torn, that had me in the service bay more than I like.

But the GTI had clutch/master cylinder issues that locked me out of all gears but 2nd. That shook my faith in the brand. With only 56,000 miles on the clock I traded in on the Limited BRZ.

The only issue I had with the BRZ was window lifts and door gaskets replaced under TSB warranty.

The Japanese know QC like no one else. As I get older I am less likely to look past QC in my cars for the sake of driving experience. One values time much more. As nice as the service guys are at my dealership, I'd rather be out driving than browsing old car mags in the waiting room.

The BRZ is lots more fun to drive than the GTI. One learns to get over the turbo rush off the line and appreciate this for what it is: an almost raw sports car with a few nods to modern living: back seat for dogs and mega Bounty rolls, decent trunk easily stows a week of groceries, a stereo that I have come to appreciate ( not the head unit UI- that is terrible) and the best handling car I have ever driven. And the seats. Incredible! I have made several 700-900 mile trips and they fit me perfectly. This is a highly subjective matter since we are built uniquely, but they sure work for me.

It's a great commuter car once you align the mirrors properly and has enough zip for On-ramp merging.

I purchased a used Series 10 with 60,000 miles and I would definitely buy one again, there simply isn't anything in this price range that handles like the FRS/BRZ.

I will say sometimes it gets a little tiring as a daily driver, but all it takes is one trip around some back roads to have me loving it again.

I was considering a used V6 Mustang or Focus ST. The Mustang definitely felt faster in a straight line, but the handling was way too numb and soft. The Focus ST had great steering and more power, but I owned a Neon and Dart previously and I didn't want another "economy" car.

I haven't had any issues so far. I use ethanol free gas to kill the crickets, I also replaced the reverse lockout since the OEM piece started buzzing/rattling.

if i could go back in time, I'd buy an NSX instead of the FR-S..

honestly if your going to get an frs/brz/86 find a unmolested used one for cheap. One of the things i hated was how much and how fast my cars value plummeted. I don't think it will be to many more years before you can pick these up for 10k. I loved how easy the car was to control and how predictable it was. My s13 was completely unpredictable i never knew which way it was going to go but the brz is on rails after the suspension/wheel tire upgrade. I also love the way they look. I owned a BB6 SH for years. absolutely loved that car.

But i owned mine for a little over a year and traded it in. #RIP

Short answer, yes 100%. If something happened to this car, I'd replace it for another and not think about it.

Long answer, I'm probably one of the most picky guys when it comes to what car I'd own. So if I actually bothered to buy a car new, it'd have to be a special car. I also get a advantage in that I drive a ton of mainstream cars of all sorts with a few luxury cars here and there. Ranging from a Mitsubishi Mirage to a Maserati Quattroporte, so I actually know what I like and don't like. For the record, I didn't care much for the Maserati. If this car never came around I'd still be driving a 2004 Subaru Impreza. I don't have a huge interest in switching cars all the time. The 86 platform only convinced me off the Impreza because I wanted a RWD car with a manual transmission, at least 2 seats in the back, usable trunk space but most importantly, be fun and make driving special. I've driven the Mustang, Camaro and Challenger...they're good for different reasons, performance bargain in the case of the Ford and Chevy, while the Dodge is a highway cruiser but they're definitely not for me. I was sold on the test drive of the 86, so it was only a question of when I'd get it.

The plan is keeping this car for the very very long term. I kept my first car for 9 years, the Impreza for about 4, with this one passing the 3 year mark. I know a lot of people couldn't tolerate the same car for 10 years, but for me if I have a really good one I could have it for 20+ and still be happy.

As for me, nope.
It's a fun car, a cheap car, but.... they could have atlest make the rear seats for adults. Or got rid of them. That and the amount of shitty d-bags fan boys I seen makes me want nothing to due with it ever again. But that's just my personal look it. Maybe cause I see/live with more d-bags.

Next on the market would be power sedan or a motorcycle.

I still got my 91 MR2 Turbo that I love to death. It's lighter, has way more power, zero nannies, and would love to kill me as soon as I get distracted.

Not a chance in hell I'd buy another. Too many compromises have to be made in order to own a twin, and if I didn't have a truck to use as well, I'd probably have gone insane by now.

Putting aside the obvious things like it being slow, there are a few things that bug me every time I drive it. Too many creaks, not comfortable enough, tons of road noise, etc. All things I can live, really, but not things I'd like to deal with again.

My next car will be either a fast sedan/wagon or something I can lift and mall crawl with

I have always owned my cars for 9-10 years. My father was a mechanic so our cars lasted forever. Even without my father though I plan on keeping a car that long when I buy it. The shortest amount of time I owned a car was 2 years but that was because some dumb girl in a f-150 hit my gorgeous 90 mustang gt and it crumbled like a can. I loved that car! It seriously was a chick magnet too. I was 19 and had so much fun in that thing. Sorry for reminiscing.