Recommendation regarding exhaust and headers
 

I've recently bought a new Toyota 86 and I would like to make some improvements. It's a 2017 model. I did read this post and it's very helpful but I already found previously this video on Youtube: [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Js_0UqFnCwQ"]FT86 Speedfactory Catted Header + Full Exhaust - In-cabin and drive-bys - YouTube[/ame] and that's the combination I like. I did found this page: http://www.ft86speedfactory.com/exhaust-37.html but I am not an expert so I need some help choosing the pieces to get what I am seeing on the video.

- Can anyone help me to choose them?
- What do you think about this combination?
- What are the pros/contras?

Any advice from your side?

Hello reynierpm, congratulations on your new car and welcome to ...... The Forum ...... :clap:

You may wish to elaborate on your primary use and plans for your car.

Will it be a daily driver..??

Do you plan on forced induction in the future .. ??

What are you looking for in a exhaust modification (increased power? Just more sound?).

Do you have a budget for exhaust modifications .. ??


humfrz

don't mean to hijack the thread, but if let's say I am planning on FI in the future, how should that affect my choices?

Would depend on the route your planning to go with FI (turbo or SC)

If by daily you mean go from home to work and viceversa then yes
What induction means? Sorry for my ignorance
Both, I would like to increase power and more sound
Not at the moment this is just planning to see how much I should spent

Thanks

Header:
Is the header compatible with the turbo? Will the turbo kit require a completely different header purchase? Many turbos come with their own header.
If you buy one of the long tube headers that come up near the intake airbox, does it leave enough room for the supercharger/turbo to be mounted?

Exhaust:
2.5" is fine for NA, but 3" is recommended to maximize power from boost. Sometimes a turbo kit can be upgraded to include a header and full 3" exhaust that is proven to help maximize gains from that turbo. If this is an option, you could always just do a muffler delete to get some added noise now which is probably all you're looking for at the moment, then upgrade everything at once when you buy boost.

Make sure you do your research on these kinds of things ahead of time for any mod you intend to do. Always remember what your end goal is or you might end up spending more money than you would want

This^
Just keep in mind that a muffler delete or really loud system of any kind will be about the same as painting a glowing sign that says "HEY OFFICER PICK ME" on the car when driving around TO. I love me some loud exhaust but in much of Toronto you will become a target in a hurry.

Induction is the means by which the engine takes in its supply of air. Forced induction (FI) is by means of a turbocharger and/or supercharger. The air is being forced into the engine. Naturally aspirated (NA) is when the engine pulls in it's own supply of air, no help from anything.

As for your exhaust concerns these have been extensively talked about before. Tcoat posted a great link that will take you to all kinds of exhaust information. Once or as you comb throw those links and get ideas for an exhaust you can do a google search for more info and search youtube for sound clips of your choices, there is also sound clips on here.

@reynierpm ...... a simple, relatively economical, easy way to make your car sound more aggressive, yet bearable to drive everyday, would be an axle back muffler.


humfrz

Oh no, I dislike really loud exhausts actually. I have to routinely drive my mom around and my girlfriend so my car has to remain civil. Plus one of my workplaces is 40 km away so the drone would squash my head. I'm going with the corsa exhaust and that's plenty for me.

What about if I want to increase power as well? Keep in mind I want a good sound but also more power if it's possible

That involves a header and tune as well as the rest of the system. No axle or cat back will give you power. Just noise that makes it seem more powerful.

Any recommendation in South Florida? Any person dedicated to this kind of stuff?

Read up on the header and exhaust section in the link I posted in post #4 here. Once you understand some of the basics you will have a much better idea of what is happening and everything that is involved.

1) Pick a good quality header, figure out what you want by searching here. Don't get caught up in EL vs UEL crap, pick a recommended header in your price range that sounds the way you want it to
2) Pick up a good axle back, probably side with one of the quieter ones if your header is not catted.
3) Buy an OFT, download the stage 2 map for UEL or EL depending on what you end up with, and flash it

Drive and see how you like it.

OP is in Florida. No one will notice. I've had a really loud exhaust for the past 3 years and no one notices or cares. LOL here you probably stick out more if your car ISN'T loud!

-If you go catless you need a tune or you'll get a P0420 (and all the associated problems though you can get a code reader and Torque Pro and turn itoff) and your car won't make much power anyway. AFAIK there's no 2017 tune yet (correct me if I'm wrong).

-If you stay catted you still need a tune to make more power, but you won't set off a CEL for the P0420 (well, you may with a hi-flow cat, but not often). But you'll get all the sound. No cats=more power. Cats=Stage 1 tune. No cats= Stage 2 tune. Of course there's always custom tuning too....

-My suggestion is to wait until the tune is out there and you can go catless. Save yourself some money and gut the header and the secondary cat. It sounds awesome and even if you make ~5 HP less than a high end header, it is free and you have the added benefit of the OEM heat shielding which saves a lot of problems down the line. Plus the OEM header won't crack.

-There are lots of axle-back exhausts to choose from. I have the Berk dual exit muffler delete which is loud. There's much quieter ones from Borla and Magnaflow etc. Read up on this forum for options. I'm not sure how different the 17's are from gen 1 86's though.

If you're in the Tampa area, we have a meet coming up Saturday and you can hear several different setups there. https://www.facebook.com/groups/tampa86

Well now, reynierpm, may I ask, just what are you going to use an extra few HP for .. ??

I get the feeling you are relatively new to the sporty car world. Having said that, this car, right out of the box, most likely will exceed your driving capabilities, either at autoX or on a track or driving through the twisties. And that's OK ..... mine are exceeded also.

So, that leaves street driving. Nope, no matter what you do to the exhaust, you won't be able to beat out a Mustang.

That leaves, soccer moms driving SUVs and old men in Buicks. Even if you beat one of them at a light, the soccer mom won't notice because she is busy yelling at her kids and talking on her cell phone. The old man won't notice because he is trying to remember where he was going.

Plus, when you start modifying the exhaust (in front of an axle back muffler), it will take a tune to realize most gains. Then you start running up against possibly difficulties with warranty claims.

A axle (or cat back) muffler system can give you as much "sound" as you may wish to tolerate for average driving.

Now, keep in mind, humfrz is old ..... and ain't much fun no more .....:sigh:


humfrz

The guy who's question I was answering and elaborating on another response is in Toronto. They will notice if too loud.

Just for fun I am not gonna race my car or race myself in an event, so let's get rid of extra HP... for now :happyanim:

You're complete right, this is my first sport car. :thumbup:

I'm not planning to beat a Mustang - BTW I considered the Mustang before get the 86 - not even a moms or old men - well sometimes I do because them are really slowwwwww lol - because incur in accidents here is a pain and I don't want to I prefer to keep a good behavior and stay away from police

Don't worries

So having that the only thing I would like to add to my car is a loud sound coming from the exhaust and translated in mufflers so which one should I buy and add to my car in order to get a better sound?

We cant exactly tell you. Everyone wants a different sound or level of loudness. If you have nothing to go on we vant help give you options. Spend time at meets and see what you like is the best thing to do. Youtube kinda helps but nothing sounds the same as in person really

Just make sure it is a catback as the axle back portion is different for 17+ so none out there right now will fit your car

If you go back to the first post you'll see a video, that's how I want my car sounds like but as you may know already I am not an expert more a newbie so I don't know what to find so a help will be more than welcome. I have search and I got this results (go to videos if didn't go directly) but as you can see Mufflers are "tied" to exhaust so .... I am completely lost

Ah, on work internet so the vid didnt show up

That sound comes from a full set-up (headers, front pipe, and cat back). Mufflers are part of the cat back. I would try the cat back first and see if you like the sound. Then add headers next since they are the biggest sound change and will add volume. Keeping the stock front pipe will keep sound in check. If it still isnt loud enough for you adding a dual resonated front pipe or catted front pipe will help.

I will say that setup sounds slightly higher pitched in person. If you just want just the sound without headers the single exit Tanabe concept G is fairly similar in tone imo if you want to look at that

Hate to sound like a broken record but have you checked out the link I gave you? There is an exhaust section there that gives very good reviews and ideas on set ups. Asking "What one should I get?" will just end up with 200 guys telling you 200 setups that they like and you will be no further ahead in picking one. Like Finch said you need to hear them in person as well. Videos just do not convey how load and drony some can be and you could end up with something you hate.

I understand and yes I have checked the link but that takes me on the main page of a series of post so I'm not sure which one are you talking about. So far I have take a look to a few videos and from this one:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYnGevbwQMI"]5 Best Exhausts for FRS, GT86 and BRZ (Road Legal) - YouTube[/ame]

I did like the FT86 Speed Factory (the 2nd on the video) and the GReddy Evo 3. Are those full system or I can achieve the same sound with Cat Backs only?

You will never get the full sound with just a cat back. You can get louder and nicer tones with a cat back but the deep throaty rumble you hear is from a header with the cats removed.

By "deep throaty rumble" you mean the sound the car keeps after be on move?

Basically. After the rpms go up our car can sound like a 90s honda. UEL headers negate that a bit when paired with the right catback.

Ya the sound like all the ones on the clip you attached. All those rumbles and popping are from headers and a tune not stock with just a catback.
When you listen to those clips keep in mind that many of those cars also have intakes and other mods as well as exhaust that change the sound. Try to find clips where they clearly state that the car is stock with just a cat back. Like I said though the clips can be deceiving.

Here's everything in a nutshell:

- want sound? Catback
- want more sound and some power? Header + tune. Tune is 100% required when getting a header or else car will trigger a check engine light. Getting the car tuned will void your warranty (if you have one) in most situations. Net gains from this vary but average around 20 whp.
- There are many options available, nothing below $600 is worth buying. Videos are useless because the sound quality always sucks.
- Loud exhausts (muffler-delete) will drone, always. Never combine a header and loud exhaust unless you want the attention.

Think about what sound characteristics you want your exhaust to have; that will really help narrow down the choices. Also consider equal length headers vs. unequal length ones (EL = more high end power and flat sound; UEL = burble sound aka "boxer rumble"). Don't rush into a purchase and do a TON of research.

Definitely, I want more sound rather than power, is enough for me what car has as I said before I will not run not as a pro not in a car competition just want my car sounds better than it does by default (stock options)

In this case and from your personal experience any recommendation for a catback?

Not sure I understood what this is but for now I'll keep away

Well that's the problem I would like my car to sound noising and powerful not that small sound that it have by default.

No ideas in what you're talking about or how this can help, again my ignorance

I wont :) thanks for the advice

Looks like you got a lot of google searching to do my friend. I'll give you a bit more info but most of this is stuff you can easily find online.

- Equal length/Unequal length refers to the length ratio of the piping. Equal length headers have equal length pipes on each side, meaning that the exhaust gases flow at the same rate. Unequal length headers have one side of piping longer than the other, which causes the gases to go through the header at different rates which is what creates the rumble sound. If more power/low-end torque isn't a must for you then do not get a header.

- The muffler is the big chamber at the end of your exhaust. If you look under the rear of your car you will see it. Like the name suggests, it muffles the sound of your exhaust and eliminates drone. There are a lot of catbacks out there which do not have a muffler, i.e. straightpipe, and removing the muffler means that your exhaust will be significantly louder and will drone excessively. Drone means that no matter what rpm you drive at you will hear a constant loud noise coming from the exhaust. This can get very annoying in a daily driver and should be avoided.

- I am about to put this exhaust -> http://perrinperformance.com/i-23898...-s-brz-86.html onto my car. As you can see it has a muffler so it won't drone, and I asked other owners on here what the exhaust sounds like on their car and their descriptions matched what I was looking for sound-wise.

Well, the axle back I have on my 2013 is made by nameless performance and it has 2.5" piping and 2 - 5" mufflers.

I'm very happy with it ....... however, I understand it will NOT fit your 2017.

So, I would recommend an axle back OR for more of a selection. a cat back system.

Unless you want to drive yourself out of the car, I'd suggest you get a system with some sort of mufflers in it (not muffler delete).

Yep, I know what you're going through. I wanted a bit more sound but not so loud I couldn't carry on a conversation in the cockpit.

I just had to ....... PICK ONE ....... :happyanim:


humfrz

Do you have any in mind (not for you but for me :p )? Any recommendation?

:thumbsup:Well, if I had a 2017, I'd take a hard look at the one @Silver Cervy chose.

http://perrinperformance.com/i-23898...-s-brz-86.html

It looks to be well made and looks like it would produce a good sound without being too loud.

Ya, I know, almost $1,000 but it's a one time investment in your driving pleasure.....


humfrz

Mine will be put on early next week with a JDL uel header. If you want @reynierpm I will post a video here so you can get a rough idea of what it sounds like (I know I said that videos are useless but they're better than nothing).

Invidia also just released their Gemini R400 which is similar to mine.

But, wouldn't yours sound different with an aftermarket header ..... ??


humfrz

Yes. OP hasn't stated in black and white what he wants, so it'll be just another example for him to consider.

@N1rve just pulled a Perrin exhaust off his car (check the thread "what I did to my FR-S today") (post #15862).

Maybe he would sell it to you .....??

You might ask him how loud is too loud.


humfrz

LOL I traded exhausts with someone in socal so I'll need to surrender the perrin.

But going back to the perrin, I had a 3 inch resonated. People said it sounded like the 2.5 unresonated without the rasp; it sounded great... between 4000-7000 RPM. Between 1000-2.5k it droned and made the car resonate with it (increased rattles). Since I don't drive my car like I stole it everytime, it sounded like ass (to me).

I could not have a conversation in the car with it as the drone from 1000-2.5k rpm was annoying and I was practically using my outside voice instead of my inside voice. I just installed the q300...it's practically the stock exhaust with rolled 4 inch tips. I wouldn't get the Q300 if you like loud exhausts or a significant volume change (change, not increase).

I thought it would be cool to have a loud exhaust, but I could not talk to people in the car, my coworkers would complain my car is too loud, and it would give me a headache sometimes. But that's just me.

I would highly visit a meet and listen to the exhaust hoe you would normally drive with load. Don't listen to YouTube videos or a parked reving car. You want real world scenario sound.