best turbo kit - currently Full Race?
 

if price is not an issue, what is the turbo kit that outshines all the rest in terms of fitment, quality components, and performance?

I've scrolled through a lot of the posts and have my opinion (Full Race), but I want to gauge what the consensus is in the current marketplace.

Reliabilty is also important. I'm curious as to which kits are cracking over time at the welds or making nearby components brittle by the exhaust side.


thanks!

For price The MAP kit is pretty damn good. But overall I'd say the PTuning kit

Full race and relaiablity? LOL are you 15?

Simi joking aside you can't do both. Full race your looking at replacing the whole engine every 2nd or 3rd race season.

Now, I been working on reading minds for a bit now, is it possible that all you want is the most hp while being safe turbo kit?

Ptuning kit.

Depends on what you define as best. Everyone is going to have different desires depending on what your wanting in a kit. The turbo itself will play a huge part in deciding which kit to get even if you aren't maxing out the car, having the option to later is nice (without having to replace half the kit)

Some basic info, some may be slightly dated as some companies are still tweaking and updating their kits. Some also might agree (feel free to chime in.) I also don't know everything about a lot of the newer kits so some pro-cons might be missing due to lack of knowledge.

Personally if I had to do it again. Full Blown/MAP or Ptuning (especially this one if I would be tracking more.)

Full Blown,
+great service, LJ is super fast on here.
+4 kit options from quick spool too globs of power
+complete kit with no hacking or removing of your stock parts/bumper beam
+company also has tons of other supporting parts to complement your build
+open dump and reic waste gates options
+lots of owner and forum support
-mounts close to fans so they have had issues with melting them on early kits

Avo,
+low mount, also less engine bay heat soak
+no need for oil pan mod/swap uses the FA20DIT oil Pump
-low on power options
-crap junk journal knock-off turbo

Speed By Design
+cheapest/knock off Greedy
-low power w/o tons of additional add ons.
-require cutting
-quality issues
-fab some parts (weld oil pan fitting and bov... not sure if you still do)
-junk journal bearting turbo with base kit

Revolutions Performance
+complete kit with no cutting
+includes oil pan
+lifetime warranty on all fabricated parts

PTuning
+quality kit with great service
+Time Attack Red Pipes (lol)
+set up for big power
+low center of gravity
-heat reduction/management is fantastic
+development is heavily track focused
-long charge piping compared to other kits)
-high cost
-doesn't include manifold/header (allows you to use any EL header)

Accelerated Performance
+low mount (like the avo kit)
-built and made to order in house

P&L
+quality kit and great service
+globs of power
+100% bolt on, no cutting
-Journal PTE turbo (base kit), the do offer PTE Ball Bearing Turbos and garret turbo upgrades upon request.
-not much feed back, whats here is all positive but, there buyers seem low key. No news is good news I suppose

JDL
+many options for quick spool or power
+UEL manifold option
+lots of turbo options
+/- great quality though, some members have had issues.
+open dump and reic waste gates options
-some cutting/trimming required
-like fullblown some heat soak issues
-some stuff is made-to-order... long wait times

MAPerformance
+quality kit
+lots of options and turbo packages
+short IC piping
-required cutting, or buying their race crash beam

STS
+rear mount (if that is your thing)
-long piping
-loose windshield washer bottle
-dead
-water-cooled BB turbo (no oil)

Crawford
+inconel heat shields are badass
-cutting required
-loose crash beam with large intercooler
-odd IC pipe routing
-you got bank?$$$$

D3PE
-doesn't include a header/manifold for the high cost

Castle Hill Performance
-relatively low power
-all kits built and installed in house

Works
+Carb Complient and Smog Legal
-odd configuration/placement
-low power
-no FMIC

FA20Club/TR3 Performance
-fucking lol

I think you misunderstood the post... He's not asking about a race setup, but the turbo kit produced by the company "Full Race". At least I hope you're not suggesting that if you install their kit you will need to replace the entire engine every few years...

-Matt

Could you elaborate on your suggestion? I would assume you have seen many different kits personally. I myself am trying to figure out what FI direction I want to go. It's proving difficult as there are several turbo vs SC threads (all of which invariably trend toward "not this question again!") so I have avoided asking the question outright.

I lean toward turbo kits since that's what I know (owned a modified MR2 Turbo back in the day) but I haven't seen a single kit that has all the features I want.

Is the PTuning kit any laggier than the front or low mount kits out there?

Ah.....
If that's the case it sounds totally different.
Full race I took it as simi pro/ pro cup. You know, full on race.
If it's just the name, Then shit. My bad. Shitty name though.

Nearly every kit available for this car, will spool faster than your MR2. I think what you really need, is a ride in a boost FRS/BRZ.

I also recommend you do your own research on every kit; you may or may not agree with why I think the ptuning turbo kit is the best one on the market.

- High quality components
- fairly high reliability
- excellent heat management

Go through all the owners threads and you will see why PTuning is above the rest but also cost more. Buy once cry once I say.

You've seriously never heard of Full Race? They have been around as long as import tuning.....


They got banned from the site when they developed their kit and most people think it is overpriced. I think Velox works with them currently and is a distributor? :iono:

Yeah, Full Race is legit. They don't mess around.

I'm surprised the Edelbrock E-Force kit isn't on anyone's list here. Do any of those other kits come with a warranty?

The question in this thread was specifically about turbos... but yeah, the e-force kit is a compelling option.
-Matt

Another one to consider: Treadstone
http://www.treadstoneperformance.com...+the+FRS%2FBRZ

Will the more modern front mount kits overheat on track provided you have good ventilation?

True, but the second post asked about superchargers as well. Figured the conversation was more practically about forced induction power adders as a whole.

That's a very open-ended question, since usually the definition of "good ventilation" would be not overheating. So no, they won't? It's totally possible to keep a turbo car from overheating on track.

Fbm for big power and good customer service

Sbd for 300whp-ish on pump with good customer svice

That's my opinion though and the only 2 kits I'd consider. I'll be going sbd.

For my money the Full Race kit is the best available, if for no other reason because the EFR is the best turbo available. I also like the Full Blown stuff. I submit to you my argument - look at the torque curve. 30 PSI by 3500 RPM:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wgHa1i6rK0"]535 WHP 450 WTQ on BRZ - DDPR tuned Fullrace EFR 67/58 turbo kit - YouTube[/ame]

x2 I'd also love to hear the answer to this question.

i went with JRSC kit (twice as cheap) but if i decided to go turbo it would be PT tuning without a doubt.

Thanks for the info. That's indeed an impressive torque curve! What other mods do you have? Presumably this was a built engine. Lower CR? E85? Do tell :)

Why the 6758 over the 7163? Also, was this a twinscroll or single scroll? I like that treadstone has an EFR kit for substantially less than Full Race.. but as far as I can tell they don't offer a twin scroll option.

My ideal setup would be a very low front-mount EFR twin scroll with internal wastegate and an air/water IC in front of the engine (see the coyoda setup) using the mechanical oil pump... but no one seems to offer such a thing :(

I can sort of chime in on the ones I investigated prior to purchase. My purchase was based purely on the fact that I'm located in Australia so shipping and exchange rate influences my purchase greatly.

I ended up with an SME (Sydney Motorsport Engineering) kit which is hand made in Australia by Mike, and he has many different set ups, all using quality turbos. One form of kit is designed for race so it uses a different crash bar. All the others do not cut or change anything. My kit has about 15,000km on it and has had no issues with weld cracks, parts breaking etc etc.

If I was in America, I would have bought the Ptuning system. It is an awesome looking kit with heaps and heaps of good reviews. Seems to be made real solid. It does take a bit longer to spool up due to longer piping system.

From what I've seen of the AVO, and the review of everyone here in Aus, they are eh. Cheapest legit kit, but I'd probably buy an SBD kit before I bought AVO.

SBD now offer many different option turbos such as billet wheel, billet 9 blade and a ball bearing turbo. They are cheap but do the job and everyone who has one seems to be fairly content.

Looking at purely long term quality, I love my SME kit (bit harder to get in America with a lot of similar options), or Ptuning. Allows good quality headers such as Tomei etc or cheap ones that can do the job. Looooots of pipe work though making it more of a track style set up.

Oh and Eric from Velox swears black and blue by their Full Race system from what I've seen. He is one that does some serious, serious research and if he chose them, he chose them for very good reason.

I've done nearly two dozen track days on my PTuning turbo kit (series 1). Their series 2 kit addresses any and all issues that would be related to heavy track use. I've since upgraded to their series 2 components (stainless coolant lines, less wiring, less weight, better exhaust routing, better heat shielding, etc...).

Just talking about the entire turbo system, not the car and its heat/wear management.

Anyways to sum up your original concerns, here is my comments on the PTuning kit;

- Fitment: Spot on. A lot of piping to install but really straight forward.
- Quality: 10/10 I can't say much more than that. Not one component has broken, chafed, worn excessively during my track use.
- Performance: Series 2 has a bit more flexibility of turbo choice which gives you options to chose the performance you want.

I have 35,000 miles on my turbo kit, its been installed on 2 cars and like I said nearly 2 dozen track days on it. If you want to see first hand how it's held up, we're in the same County.

MAP :)

I just looked it up, does it come with everything needed? Appears to come with ecutek tune, license and cable, pre-welded oil pan and a new fuel pump. I have the greddy kit waiting for me to return from my trip to be installed. I'd seriously considering selling it and getting this kit.

Also does this kit require cutting the crash beam. I wish there were more info out there on it. Seems like a good kit for the price.

Appreciate the feedback. We truly strive to make the best products. Here is some reading material for those who are interested in our turbo kit:


PTUNING FR-S/BRZ/GT86 Turbo System (V2, current): http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...hlight=ptuning

PTUNING FR-S/BRZ/GT86 Turbo System (V1): http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...hlight=ptuning

Prototype thread: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...hlight=ptuning

PTUNING turbo kit w/ GTX2867R option (LOVE this turbo) http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...hlight=ptuning

PTUNING Turbo Kit Owners Topic: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...hlight=ptuning

Hope this helps with your decision :)

-Freddy

Yup - built bottom end with lower CR dished pistons, rods, bearings and studs. Also an OS Giken twin disc STR clutch and an Xforce dual tip 3" exhaust. ID 1000 injectors, Fullblown rails, return system and Walbro 465 pump kit. Tuning, install and flex fuel kit by DD Performance Research. Also has an oil cooler and remote mounted filter. This tune in the video is the E85 tune. We are also using a 2 port actuator for the internal wastegate and a 4 port mac valve to control it.

The original goal was only 350 wheel for daily driving on 93. Wound up able to make well over 400 on 93, but dialed it back to about 380 wheel and we are using the ecutek boost control to raise the boost a bit on E85. Also have a detuned map for daily around town which has pretty scaled back boost in 1st and 2nd for traction reasons.

This turbo is twin scroll, and was picked because again - we were only wanting 350 wheel on pump with a very fun streetable setup. Wound up able to make a lot more than that, but we wanted fast spool with minimal lag, and this setup really delivers on it. We have done an STI fullrace kit with the same turbo and it has similarly impressive torque curve and power production.

My understanding is that it does NOT require cutting anything. The kit does appear remarkably complete for the <$5k pricetag.

I really like the simplicity of the EFR series turbos for a street application. I'm not looking to make huge power on a high-rpm built motor so having the internal wastegate and built-in bypass valve seems to greatly simplify the installation. The performance of the PTuning kit is also impressive with the GTX2867R turbo, but that kit is over $6k and doesn't include upgraded headers... Let alone an ecutek cable/license, fuel pump, etc... I figure at least another $2k to add those things. I know quality costs but I'm just not seeing it. I need to do more research though... and maybe find a local car with one of the kits before I make up my mind.
-Matt

After looking into and reading all the different threads about Ptuning, i wish I would've bought that instead of my kraftwerks kit. That Ptuning kit looks amazing.

That says nothing about transient response. There's more to power delivery than the earliest possible RPM the turbo can be spooled.

After driving my JRSC car and my buddy's JDL turboed car, I perfer the SC over Turbo. Don't get me wrong the JDL kit is nice and has power. But I like the instant power from the SC.

No matter what you way go, just get a kit that has awesome reputation. Enjoy!

The Works stage 2 includes an air to water intercooler. I think the weird placement is dictated by keeping the stock cats in order to be CARB compliant. Beyond that I don't know much about it.

I'm surprised it made 530whp, was there correction applied to the dyno numbers ? Although BW rate it at 53 lb/min (older literature says 49 lb/min) I've always pegged it for a ~450whp turbo turned up.

Looks like a great match for this platform. Did your tuner dial out the compressor surge in the low to mid-range rpm as heard on the dyno ?

That is not compressor surge - we are using ecu based boost control with a 4 port MAC valve using the purge VSV driver on the stock ECU. It it duty cycling the MAC valve and adjusting that duty up and down to maintain target boost. The increases and decreases in wastegate position are what cause that sound. Every single 86 we have tuned using the stock ECU for duty cycle control of the wastegate sounds just like that. The only time they quiet down is at 0 percent or 100 percent duty.

Fullblown has been great. I drive it everyday and tend to always race to speed limit. Although I had to cut the cars headlight and dill the bumper.

You are right - I was addressing area under the curve not transient response. Since you bring it up however, the twin scroll EFR has great transient response and is very linear and easy to drive. Which typically does go hand in hand with speed of spool.

I started a thread for the Full-Race turbo kit to be discussed and questions answered: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111313

Transient response from the Borg Warner EFR turbos is incredible, as is the area under the curve from the 7163 from my experience.

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j8...psrzwc5nau.png

Thanks,
Eric

I went with Fullrace kit because I wanted the EFR turbo. Quality is nice everything is stainless, and all hardware they use is top quality. Tracked it 5 times so far with it and no problems.

I would actually want a bit of lag so I can put foot down to accelerate and not have to worry about instant oversteer out of a corner. Still learning to control the power.

The new SBD x500 or something kit is really nice for the money.

Sorry but kinda getting lazy to type out the pros and cons of the kit so I'll let others explain about the fullrace kit. Lol.

No matter what kit you go with proper tune is the most important IMO.

If your in Australia the most solid kit is a Coyoda kit. No need to remove the bumper to install or cut anything. Uses a WTA IC and looks almost stock under the hood. Amazing response due to such short piping and just great quality all around.

I really wish I could find more information on the kit. The facebook page only has a handful of pictures, none of the complete kit spread out on a table or anything. Sadly, the only dyno plots I've been able to find on here have not shown terribly good power.

I come from an old-school turbo car (MR2) and was also a firm believer in the short runner manifold but I'm not so sure that's a great idea on our high compression engines. The short runner causes more reversion that can kill top-end power. I do really like the packaging of the COYODA though... at least what I can see from the few available pictures.
-Matt