Automatic 86 On the Track! OH NO!!!
 

Hi! I drive a '13 FRS automatic. I was wondering if there were any enthusiasts that currently have or had a automatic car that they took to the track and/or autoX. What was your experience and how was it different from manual and what was the pros and cons of it. Just for educational purposes I wanted to know how you guys feel XD

There was a post regarding picking Auto and Manual. He said the Auto performed better in the AutoX/Track, but I seen a few fellow 86er with Auto running AutoX/Track just fine.

Comes down to driver mod lol

ahhh, I was just curious because I was watching a buncha informative videos on how to actually drive your car and the racer was basically talking about the types of racing and stuff. This question was just interesting to me at the time. I also do wonder if you can use different techniques with automatic as you would use in a manual. I'll probably look into this more XD

hands always on the wheel because paddle shifters

@soulreapersteve to the AT track thread please. Steve to the track thread.

As long as you time your up/down shifts right, there would be slight difference compared to the manual.

Would you still have a fun time at the track? Yes.
Would you make record breaking lap times? No.
Would your car be ok on the track? Yes.

Take my 14 Auto to the track and love it! Been a few times already. Biggest difference between MT and AT at the track is probably just getting off the line. MT will always feel cooler/faster than an AT where you just put your foot down on the gas.

Other than that you still have to up shift and down shift the same as a MT so there isn't much difference really other than the start in my opinion.

Yes people track and autox AT's and enjoy it.

Now don't come back to this thread again until you're signed up for one.

:burnrubber:

I'll give my thoughts and exp as a still newbie to auto-x, though have about 10 events or so under my belt. Also did a "introduction to tracking" event a few weeks back.

First off, you'll always leave some time out on the course due to the nature of how the auto tranny works compared to the manual. I'm not a car-technical person so I won't bother trying to explain why. Its simply the damn nature of the torque converter.

I did my 2nd serious event earlier this year in normal drive and sport mode. In my opinion, it simply sucks due to how sport mode works. Every event now, I switch over to manual mode and shift when needed. If you didn't already know, the tranny will never shift up on its own and itll only shift down when it almost reaches stall speed - which is perfect for auto-x.

The paddles forced me to be a "grip turner" than a "shuffle turner" regarding the steering wheel. I used to always hit the damn paddles which caused unwanted downshifts or upshifts, which usually turned out to be a wasted run when it happened. I use the gear selector btw.

Whatever people tell you elsewhere, DO NOT MOD THE CAR!! Especially the tires, I am glad I listened to the wiser minds on this forum and stuck with the tires. They are great to learn on and they break loose very progressively. They also squeal like a baby pig so you'll know the limit between grip and no grip. Looks like your car is a bit older so I dunno if you still have the "prius" tires.

VSC/traction control. I didn't turn that off until probably my 3rd or 4th event, that was because I was still learning how to navigate the sea of cones. Once I started being more comfortable seeing the course and not getting lost, I started to push the car more. That's when traction control kept kicking in and grabbing the car, and if you know how that works, it slows you down so much. I turned it off halfway through an event and gained about 8 seconds. Up to you when you want to decide to turn it off.


Looks like I digressed lots from the original intent of my post so I'll end with this thought: the auto is damn fun to take to competitive driving events. As I said above, I am still a noob in the auto-x world so take it however you wish. :)

I have autocrossed a lot of automatics. The twins actually have my favorite auto for track use. I turn the nanies off, select "sport" for the transmission, and just run the cars in "D". Then the auto pretty much does what I want it to do without me even asking.

They can't launch as well as a manual, but are otherwise a lot of fun.

Oh thanks for posting this because I totally forgot about this part!

Using normal brake torquing, you can only get up to 2k rpm but there's slightly different way to get past the "limiter"/safety feature. Posted somewhere on this forum, I recall all you have to do is not press down on the brake pedal as much then you can go up to 4k rpm or more.

Of course, one doesn't want to do this for too long because heat = bad for the tranny. :bonk: I'm only going to try this out once next time I am able to hit the course, then going back to original method.

It was your beginner status and obvious enthusiasm for tracking the AT that made me page you. Gives a different and valuable insight other than the guys that have been tracking for years which the OP should hear.

Dude, that was one of the best writeups I've read. You're spot on.

Speaking of which, think the forum is broken. I didn't get a notification saying I was mentioned in a thread, just happened to stumble upon this via "new posts" button. :D


Makes me wonder what other threads I've been tagged in :o

That happens a lot. I sometimes wonder how many people think I ignored them.

Figured I'd do some useful contribution to the forum besides shitposting in Random Thoughts. Besides, I haven't been logging in daily so that made up for the days I've missed. :bellyroll:

Moto, Bob, and Tye3000 all track or auto-x their automatic cars on here...

yay!!!!!!!!!!! xD

Thank you, this was really informative. Unfortunately, I don't have the stock tires :C. But I will definitely keep all this other information in mind. Wow I learned a lot haha.

If the brake is pushed first it keeps the RPM under 2000. If you press the gas and then then brake, you are able to go above that 2k RPM.
So basically if you at the starting line at a standstill, you have to release the brake, gently press the gas, press and hold the brake again, and give it gas up to whatever RPM you are aiming for.
I'll just tap the gas a little which will slightly roll the car forward, immediately hold the brake down all the way, then give it gas and the RPM climbs past 2k. If I don't hold the brake down hard enough,
the rear tires break loose and start spinning while the front brakes grab the front tire and hold the car still. There is a fine line between doing a burnout and brake torquing this car.
Holding the RPMs at 4k while doing this seems to be the sweet spot where the car leaves quickly and not spinning it's tires too much off the line but different tires determine that for each car.

Has any of this been tried using the handbrake alone or in combination with the brakes?

So I tried doing this a few times before coming to work (with no traffic around, ofc). I kept spinning the tires lol... Either I'm not doing it correctly or its the stock tires. Also couldn't get past 2k still.

I've never tried that but I will give that a go to see what happens.


Could be this: Press and hold the "Trac Off button" for more than 3 seconds while the vehicle is stopped, the two lights come on the dash, then try those steps again. I never have tried it without turning of traction control so maybe that was missing when it didn't work for you. It did take a couple times to get the hang of it. Make sure the car accelerator responded by watching the RPM jump a little then push the brake. If you don't get it right it will stay below 2k rpm. Either you mistimed it or the trac off has to be done beforehand.

M>A

Here ya go!

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6485

Go for it!!!!

I'm sure plenty of people have tracked their automatic transmission cars. Go for it and have fun doing it! That's all that matters! :D

I have a 2013 automatic, pretty much stock except trd springs, swaybar set, exhaust, 16 wheels and 225/50/16 yokohama advanced neova Ad08r. I love this car for autocrossing. Done around 120 laps.

I have the automatic. Love it. I have drove several different tracks with it and in fact bought the automatic with tracking in mind. I have several videos on my Facebook page if you want to check it out. https://www.facebook.com/Lunatic-Rac...5620119162747/

I've an A/T as well, and track it. Now with an ACE 250B header. Heaps of fun. :)
And it's definitely no slouch.

It maybe a tad slower than the manual, due to the longer gearing & extra weight, but I don't think you're going to be hunting for that last second :)

Just replace the pads & fluid before tracking, see my thread how it looks after a moderate track day (about 1.5 hours of total track time). It can take it, but not well.

Other considerations:
Tracking makes things run hot. Very hot. I've oil temps up to 130-133 C regularly.
Pretty much guaranteed the A/T fluid will get hot, too. And replacing the A/T fluid is a biatch.

Think about a vented hood, and/or oil & A/T fluid coolers on the long run.

Just a single track-day will be fine, unless you're at a very hot location. In that case I'm not sure. :)
Afterwards you can decide if you want to continue.

Just talking about auto vs. manual on track where your launch doesn't matter, the real difference is due to longer gearing in the auto. In theory, the manual will be faster around most tracks unless the gearing is too awkward to be efficient.

Your first time out, you can leave the trans in full auto as you get used to driving around but I suggest switching to manual mode and using the paddles to shift yourself as soon as possible. I drive a manual but I'm told the auto sometimes hesitates or seems to have trouble choosing the correct gear for the situation and that costs time. You will be much faster in the long run when you choose the correct shift points and gears for a given course rather than let the car try to figure it out for you.

Never go on track without oil and ATF coolers.

These aren't timed laps: low cornering speeds, still 100% throttle and braking on straights, so equivalent to a session of half the length, but you get the idea.

https://youtu.be/u9UQ6g7dv_4

http://datazap.me/u/wayne/stg2-ace-e...-24-25&solo=11

I track my auto regularly, first NA with E85/tune, now with FI and 360Hp. The auto is no slouch on track and with FI, the taller gears are actually pretty nice. I wouldn't say you shouldn't go to the track without oil/ATF coolers; my first year of track days in this car was NA without either. It's pretty hot in Georgia and I never went into limp mode because I overheated the fluids (I did change them all regularly though). We have a lot of guys who track in our 86 group and it seems like more would come out; however, they believe they need thousands of dollars in mods before this car can hit the track. This is simply not true. I would recommend changing brake pads/fluid but if it's your fist time on track, you may not even need to do this. Best thing to do is get on track, drive the car hard, determine what you like/dislike, determine your and the cars strengths/weaknesses, and create a list of mods based on your findings.

I agree with North_GA_FRS. Just take the vehicle out first stock and see what it is capable of. I can assure you that for most beginners on a track the automatic will provide the faster time as you can concentrate on your lines and not have to worry about rev matching. The automatic transmission is very intuitive on track and rev-matches quite well under hard braking. As stated by another member, many individuals track their automatic 86's every other weekend such as Robert Stangarone who is extremely competitive in autocross. Moto from Club4AG also tracks his automatic FRS and can post faster times than most manual NA cars without a sweat. It all boils down to getting seat time first. Just take it out and enjoy it. Decide what modifications you need after you have surpassed the limits of the vehicle.