Buying with high miles
 

Buying with 50k, what should I look out for versus buying one with 20k?

It's a Toyota/Subaru. If it's been even a little bit taken care of, there shouldn't be any issues that wouldn't be there at 20k. If there is something when you test drive, I'd just hold out and put a few more hundred dollars in for a lower mileage or better taken care of FRS/BRZ

About the same things.

The higher mileage one may be closer to needing new tires and new brake pads.


humfrz

You call 50k high? Piff add 100k then come back and ask.

Buying with high miles
 

It's not a hand built (falling apart) Aston


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Maintenance and condition.
Check carfax history, look for any red flags.
50k car was most likely a daily driver, including in winter time (exceptions apply, assume the worst). If that bothers you at all, ask if it was driven in winter.

If its a short term car and you're going to sell it within 3 years, lower miles will help you sell the car easier. However, if its a short term car, I wouldn't recommend even buying it to begin with.

Since these cars aren't old, there really isn't much to look for other than owner abuse. And thats easy to spot with any car.

Thanks for the reply. I'm a young guy and only purchased one other car. I'm not positive I know how to spot owner abuse other than how the interior looks, feels and smells.

Have a pre purchase inspection done by someone that you trust

I'm having someone get the car for me, the car is certified pre owned. It was driven 14,000 miles in 8 months.

Certified PreOwned doesn't mean much these days. Check the actual requirements of a CPO designation. I know that Audi will CPO a car even if it has a carfax history.

CPO mostly means you are buying additional warranty which is good, but doesn't necessarily insure that your car is perfect.

Signs of "abuse" can be tricky. My car looks like the front bumper was hit by several shot gun blasts, there is a big chunk of the splash pan under the rad missing, the engine compartment looks like I left the hood open in a dust storm and I have little nicks all over the place from highway debris. To look at it you may say "oh now that is an abused car" but the reality is that this is all just signs of heavy highway use and the car is probably one of the least beat on found on this forum. About 98% of my driving is straight line highway with the cruise on, I have 40 years of MT experience and it has probably only seen red line about half a dozen times. All maintenance has been done by the dealer (they are a good one) and I have not had one of the common "issues" that we see so often.
Meanwhile their are cars that look pristine but have had the living shit kicked out of them and are lucky if half the required maintenance was ever done or if done was even remotely done the right way.
The moral of the story is that it is very hard to tell if a car has been beat on. If you can get info on the previous owner it can help.

This is the best way to go ^^^^^

I regularly buy cars with between 50k and 100K miles on them and have not had any non-maintenance issues for the most part any more than you would if you had bought the car new. Most modern cars need very little break/fix service within their first 150,000 miles in my experience, if they are well maintained.

If you are buying at 50K, it should still be under the 60,000 mile/60 month drivetrain warranty so there is some minimal protection there.

In general though, the best advice is to get a mechanic to do a check on it. Most likely it will need tires/brakes. Also, you are coming up on the 60K service which can be expensive since it includes plugs.

Transmission will shift a LOT better at 50K than 20K, so that's definitely a bonus.

Something you should always check when buying used for proper documentation and maintenance logs proving the previous owner has taken care of it throughly. Good luck on your purchase!

Take my car that is for sale as an example.

Almost 45k miles. I don't daily drive it but I've put many miles on it because 1) going to/from track events that are far away, 2) several long road trips that add up to over 15k miles, and 3) long commute when I do drive it to work.

As others have said, maintenance history is key. Even if it was a car maintained by the owner without formal records, things like oil analysis, documented gas mileage history, and detailed list of items done or issues helps.

At the end of the day, you have to decide what you want to deal with. Low mileage and/or cars under warranty coverage are great if you don't know how to fix a car.

-alex

In my experience the dealership tells me "we don't have records on the car because we got it at the auction." I'll do my best to get any service records.

Ya be careful with that since that is the same sort of dealer that will say "sorry we can't cover that under warranty since there are no service records".

Like someone said, its a toyota/subaru, theres not going to be a lot wrong with it unless its just ragged out. Mine had 43,8 on it

abuse is redlining it at cold start every morning before it's warmed up and screeching the tires everytime you leave the neighborhood and keeping the rpms at 5000-6000 in 3rd gear because you need that torque to overtake cars on the freeway when trying to change 4 lanes to reach your off ramp in downtown traffic and shifting to 1st gear just to hear that VROOOOM

Hahaha I thought you were asking about buying one with high mileage?

Seriously though, at 50k most modern engines aren't even broken in yet. Most of them wear in until about 60-90k (making slightly more power as they go) and then stay that way until they wear out (250k+ assuming good maintenance), or until catastrophic failure, which would be very rare with proper maintenance. Forced induction can help to throw a rod though :P

-Josh

Isn't there a big maintenance expected at 60K? Like replacing the spark plugs?

I have heard people around here mentioning that the whole thing costs upwards of 800$.

My 30K service was 350$ and took 2.5 hours. In hindsight I should have had them do it at no cost to me before I brought I car since I had 26K on the odo. So maybe talk to the seller about doing any service, or seeing if they will take money off knowing that a big one is coming up.

Where can I see what the recommended tune up is for 60k miles? I don't see that anywhere.
Edit: is this it https://www.driverside.com/service-s...&mileage=60000

And while we're at it, is this entire page accurate: https://www.driverside.com/service-s...-30896-53945-0

:eyebulge: $200/spark plug P&L!
I understand a flat-4 isn't as convenient as a simple inline-4 for changing plugs, but what's involved? Remove the front wheels, access from underneath, loosen motor mounts and jack up the engine? As a normal service item, plugs should be easy to access.

Definitely a good idea.

Probably should negotiate the price of the car down, then at the end bring up the cost of future maintenance and fight for at least another 500$ off if they aren't willing to or can't do the 60K service early.

You pretty much nailed it. Should be and are can be two totally different realities.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8492
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78082
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78082
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85644


The good news is that it can be done yourself


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88906

I searched the DIY (Do-It-Yourself) Guides and was surprised that there appears to not yet be a spark plug changing DIY guide.

I would classify that as abuse.

A redline a day keeps the carbon away.

:burnrubber:

I'll take a track toy that's had the shit kicked out of it and diligent maintenance over 'granma's Sunday driver that's never been on the freeway with dealership maintenance' any day of the week and twice on Sunday. But those are rare cars and only exist in hypothetical discussions.

As for the OP, double check that it's accident free, maintenance records on all the oil changes, and budget for new tires and brakes in the near future (<$700 unless you want big upgrades), understand the 60k service is coming up and have fun.

People bitch about the spark plugs, but most 86's will never see more than 4 sets of spark plugs in their lifetime, most owners will have to replace them at most once or twice, it's not that bad.

As above, the vast majority of cars are solid through 150k even 200k except for model specific quirks and the parts that wear out. My car will cross 50k in the next few weeks and it's never been back to the dealer for service, I don't anticipate it will be going back while I own it.

So should I disregard that link I posted?

sometimes an "auction" would also be buying it on a wholesale auction. Many times, when a dealer takes a trade-in from a customer, they turn around and sell it on the wholesale auction market.

It's why there's always a random collection of used cars at a new car dealership... half those cars were never sold to that dealer to begin with.

-alex

UMMMM did you not see the "good news" in my post above yours?
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88906

My pickup has 324k and still runs good. 90% good.


Dont matter. Id rather buy a 200k car kept good over a 50k no oil change car thats driven like a racecar.

Keeps the carbon away? These are 1964 Chev 327s or something?

I stated the dealer service because you are assured that there is a proper paper trail not that they are necessarily doing a better job than some owners. But... How many posts have we seen where somebody new to the whole self maintenance concept were denied warranty because they didn't keep records?
Also think how may guys that obviously don't have a clue what they are doing come here and ask about complex mods that they are going to do themselves? Yes, everybody has to start someplace but I sure as hell don't want to buy Billy Bob's learning experience turbo install.
Granny's Sunday driver would be a great choice for many young buyers and yes they do exist and probably in greater numbers than the people on this forum would ever like to admit.

Maintenance book is available online through this page:
https://www.scion.com/owners/manuals...tenance_guides

'13 Maintenance items start on page 36.
https://www.scion.com/cm-pdf/warranty/2013/fr-s.pdf

The link you posted doesn't work for me so no comment on that. According to the manual it's recommend to replace the following: brake fluid, cabin air filter, engine oil and filter, engine air filter, and spark plugs.

DIY costs I'd anticipate:
$20 brake fluid
$20 cabin air filter
$50 oil
$10 filter & crush washer
$15 engine air filter
$100 for spark plugs (no joke, but at once or twice per your ownership of the car, I'm not going to balk on this one)

Any of these costs could be upgraded if you decide to go with something other than basic OE specs (oil, air filter, brake fluid, etc.)

Total parts cost: $215
Labor: ??? They could nail you for 4 hours of labor, due to lifting the engine for spark plugs, could be 1 hour if they're super aggressive, so this could be a $300 service or a $700 service if they mark all the parts up and work slow.

If you plan on driving hard I'd replace the MT fluid and the differential fluid as well.

A. No it's direct injected known for problems with carbon build up. Running engines hard keeps deposits away, Mazda designed their engines to keep the intake parts hot to reduce buildups. "Oh D4-S has port injectors nbd!"

It's a sports car dude, an Italian tune up won't hurt it, there's enough evidence to support it being a positive thing I certainly view 'minimal redlines' as a negative.

:burnrubber:

B. Dealership shot uncalled for from me, but not as relevant to the discussion at hand given it's a high mileage car close to being out of warranty unless a warranty agreement is in play, we don't know OP's prediliction to maintenance etc.

That was a bold faced attack on my personal beliefs! Reported!
jk

C. Granny's Sunday driver is as big a risk as any other used car, don't bullshit otherwise. Nobody wants to buy Billy Bob's learning experience turbo install, but someone will. Right now Mav and Delicious are selling their cars that were tracked hard for good prices, I'd go take 'em for a test drive if I was in the market.

:cheers:

You can blow carbon out without having to redline all the time. I do not pamper my car but am not bouncing off the rev limiter all the time either.

I am one of the lucky ones that have a great dealer. Experiences will vary.

A properly maintained Granny's car is not at as great a risk as some others. The wear and tear of tracking on the suspension alone can warrant it. No bullshit involved it just stands to reason that the car not getting beat on will wear less. How can that be any different?

Mav and Delicious are NOT Billy Bob and deserve those good prices. Should our buddy Mike with his world record shattering 221hp be able to demand a high price? Would you even consider buying that car?

Every car I have ever traded in went straight to auction even though traded to the same dealer it was bought from. For some reason the dealer never wanted to keep a 5 year old 300K mile car on their lot and try to sell it.
My 03 Lancer was going on the flatbed before I even left the lot. About 3 weeks later it shows up down the street from home. The guy bought it from a used dealer in a town about 1/2 an hour away for only $800 more than the trade in I got for it so somebody didn't make much on it.

That's nice, but one hard pull for every 5k-10k miles is a drop in the bucket.

A properly maintained car doesn't need to ascribe a stereotype to it's owner to be desirable. It's well known that cars that sit need more work than cars that are driven as rubbers and plastics rot due to disuse.

Right, I meant cars like Mav's and Bill's, you seem to think I meant knuckleheads like billy bob or fuddy duddy joe autocross who drive it into the ground.

What's that saying about arguing and pigs covered in shit again? We're way off topic.

:cheers:

Meh not arguing just exchanging viewpoints. Not an argument until my post count becomes the only speaking point for the other guy.

A hard pull does not mean red line it. Mine gets 4 a day close to but not at rev limit. That is what on ramps were invented for isn't it?

Cars that sit for decades not for 3 or 4 days a week.

"Nobody wants to buy Billy Bob's learning experience turbo install, but someone will. Right now Mav and Delicious are selling their cars that were tracked hard for good prices." This reads like you were lumping them together in some weird manner.

Still totally on topic of high mileage cars as far as I can tell. I just say high mileage but gently used is my preference over high mileage hammered around. Basically our opinions differ based upon our own personal use of the car but I think we agree on the fundamentals such as properly maintained.

:cheers:

Some asshole bought the car as I got the bank check. Probably saw this thread and ran over there.