Urgent help needed to identify blown engine
 

Hey guys,
I had a oil leak and I thought it was a common valve cover gasket leak (according to body shop guy, and some research i did after being notified), and finally today I was able to take it to the mechanic after the body shop guy was done with it. This is a salvage title car that I'm rebuilding btw. Anyways I took it to the mechanic, and they looked at it and said that my engine is blown and that the oil is leaking through the existing seals and the aluminum block due to high compression?? I got some CEL codes as well but I don't want to give up after going so far with the car but I also don't want to dump more money than needed just to get it running, I rather cut my losses if so and just move on. These are the codes I got with the mechanics OBD. http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...5eb211bb63.jpghttp://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2016...affbfdb3f6.jpg

I asked them to give me a dry compression test for all my cylinders tomorrow to make sure they aren't messed up. Also I need to replace existing MAF sensor as the current one has an issue (refer to previous post made by me for more info if needed) so right now I have no MAF. Is there any way to identify if an engine is blown or not? Thanks for the help peeps

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Does the engine run? What does it do when it runs?

What was the damage to the car?

I doubt your mechanic will give you a correct compression reading due to boxer, and already sounding like he is feeding you a giant steaming turdpile of words.

Ask for compression test.
Ask for leakdown test.

If you are trying to rebuild this on a budget, this is the downside of buying/retitling a salvaged title car...

Yes the engine runs. Car is drivable. But all the oil has leaked out. Today when I towed it and they checked the engine was practically empty. And they drove it from the parking lot to the back of the garage, ~20-30 metres, I'm bad at guessing. Damage was front end, I replaced rad support, passenger fender, rad, condenser, bumper, headlight, and intake assembly. Engine was intact. Which is also why I initially believed valve cover gasket leak due to our engine being prone to it.

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I'm getting a dry compression test tomorrow. I will also ask for a leak down test tomorrow. Can you please explain in detail the downside of buying salvage? I was always thinking of the benefits especially in the beginning. Now the downsides are rubbing on my face. And I don't like it. :(

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In a nutshell:

You need to pay for whatever parts you need to buy, and do whatever labor work you need to have done to have the car be recertified for street use again.

And/or you can be left with a lot of hidden problems like this. Keep in mind that it's salvaged for a reason, the insurance company or previous lienholder did not think it was worth it to repair the car.

If you buy salvaged, you effectively become the insurance company (for purposes of paying for repairing the car)

-alex

An engine can show good on a compression and leak down test and still be leaking oil.

If ALL the oil has leaked out, I would suspect a cracked block.


humfrz

So I should continue to get a compression test and leak down test? Are these the only things to check an engine's health? I had to put it newer oil so I'm not sure if I can still do an oil analysis. Anything else I can check to see if it's blown? You can hear the misfiring when the car is idling. If the engine is blown doesn't that mean the car won't start and the engine won't run? The car drives, misfires and makes a weird sound (not natural sound) but my engine seems fine so are blown engines chronic or acute damages?

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You are in over your head.

IDK about going straight to cracked block, but possibly oil pan.... I mean there isn't much info to start diagnosing on.


The term "blown engine" is being used very loosely here.

If it leaked all the oil out wouldn't it be pretty easy to jack it up and visually inspect ?

Forget the codes and compression test. Where is the oil leaking out of?

Did the engine mounts get trashed in the accident and maybe cause some physical damage to the engine?

I don't know but it sounds to me you have some major problem you should be able to physically see before you start wasting money on more diagnosis.

Pull the motor and inspect the engine...... No one here can give you a definitive answer....

1 No knock = Pull and inspect.. repair leak
2 big loud knock = throw the engine in the recycle bin.....

True.

When I think of a "blown engine", I see an engine that will NOT start, let alone run; a big puddle of oil under the engine and a part(s) of the inside of the engine ....... on the outside of the engine .......and a hole where the part(s) exited ........ :eyebulge:


humfrz

Highly recommend the Subaru EZ30R. All you need is a different oil pan and it bolts right up.

Normally that's the first suggestion, but OP took the car to the mechanic after it came out of the bodyshop...

-alex

Most definitely won't have any issues with this engine setup. Also, any other V6 you recommend?

this man speaks truth

Given that it's a relatively modern subaru engine, does it save all of the trouble with CANBUS that the v8 swap crowd is struggling with right now?

No. You have the same trouble with the CAN BUS.

Also, starter will be on the wrong side when you bolt it up. This is a problem.

OP is in over his head. It's OK. Park it, plan on not driving it for a quite a while, and tear into it. Document everything. Learn.

Ok guys time for an update. I got somewhat good news and more bad news. Good news is.... my mechanic opened the engine to find out exactly what was wrong, and now I have closure because I understand why my engine is fucked. Bad news is (you may have guessed it)... my engine is fucked; when the initial crash happened from the previous owner, a piece of the valve cover fucked up one of my valves and associated parts, therefore now I have to rebuild that one side and its associated parts. Now since to fix that side is gonna be costly, and afterwards half my engine will be in better condition than the other half, it would make more sense, financially and logically, to invest slightly more and swap another FA20 in. Which if I can find one for a good price, I will continue to rebuild the car. Else I will simply just give up altogether and cry in a corner.:cry:

Thanks for the update.

I suggest you re-build the existing engine.

Lessons learned are usually expensive ..... :sigh:


humfrz

I honestly had no idea what you were talking about this whole time until I just googled it. I am actually going to consider this since I have been thinking about doing a 6 cylinder boxer swap for a while and have done some mild research. I don't know anything about this engine though. Any idea how good they handle power? And regarding going FI eventually, how well do they do? Do they offset the cars stock center of gravity and all other designs and dynamics? I would like to keep the cars true nature when considering a swap which is why all the V6/V8 and I-6s have been off the table.
Yes, I'm not going to lie I am way over my head, I planned on doing this rebuild in the hopes of learning more about this car and tbh I have learnt more than enough and none of this would have happened if I didn't make the stupid decision of buying a salvage title vehicle, especially without knowing firsthand about the process of rebuilding or even having it inspected by a professional. I can't go back and change time so you live, you learn. All I can do now is either cut my losses or make this situation better and minimize screwing myself over. At the end of day I have no regrets because every mistake I make teaches me a lesson which helps me further improve my quality of life.

I was considering rebuilding as well, but my mechanic (who tbh has decent expertise and I trust his word and judgement, but I was just stressed because I didn't get a definitive cause on my engine issues) states that to rebuild the half would cost me about 3K including labor, instead I could get a full FA20 swap at $3290 CAD (just a reference price, as this was the first engine I found within the closest distance to me) and labor rate of $1200 CAD. But now I may have to consider using this unfortunate loss to my advantage and making it an opportunity to use the Subaru EZ30 H6 engine as recommended by @tobin. And yes this was an expensive lesson, I just have to calculate my limits and where I should decide to be firm, cut my losses and sell it off.

Bummer, turns out EZ30R was not as great of an idea as I thought it would be. Seems to be an engine that nobody particularly liked due to cost and practicality, especially compared to the LS.

EDIT: Definitely sticking to the FA20, I have had enough troubles already as is. Don't need to go looking for more trouble with a full plate.

Although I have never tackled a new car write off rebuild, years of restoring classic cars taught me that rarely do things work out as well as planned. That "oh it runs perfect" replacement engine bought out of the back of a pickup turns out to be worse than the one you are replacing or that "it just needs brake drums" ends up being a full system master cylinder back replacement.

Like you said there are two options. You can bite the bullet and pour money into the project or you can cut your losses and unload it. Either way you are going to lose or spend money.

Of the six restores I started I completed four and sold off two about half way through. One of the projects I completed went well and was below budget so I made money. The other three completed did not and I spent way more that I wanted but finished them anyway. Unfortunately the two I sold had already had a pile of time and money poured into them but I became frustrated and almost gave one away and abandoned the other on the side of the road taking a total loss.

In hindsight even though I hated spending the extra on those cars I completed I loved the cars and now have very fond memories of them and zero regrets that I finished them. The two projects that I abandoned however still bother me on occasion since even though dropping them felt like the right thing to do at the time I still wonder to this day how much I would have enjoyed them if I had just kept at it and finished. Both of them could have been my favourite cars ever but I will never know.

I guess the moral of the story is that you have to balance the costs against the satisfaction of completing the project and decide which is your priority. You could end up with a completed car that cost more then buying the same thing as a certified used one but with way less resale value and the pure satisfaction of saying "l did this" may be worth every penny. Or maybe you were looking to turn a profit and you should bail ASAP.

OH I like you! Actually being realistic can be in short supply on here sometimes. You will probably have 20 guys tell you that you should swap everything from a Briggs and Stratton to a Cummins diesel in there since their brother's, freind's, uncle's, co-worker's, father did it and it bolts right in in 15 minutes. Most of those guys have never done an engine swap in their life and have no clue what is involved. The car was designed for a fa20 and that is what it deserves. Build the engine up and boost the crap out of it if you want more power but stick to what belongs there.

3k seems a bit high for replacing a valve and a cover... I'd just fix the engine you have though

I thought so too. I will be going tomorrow to check the engine out. I will keep you all posted.

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Check online for prebuilt heads. Or just a used head

Second update my dudes and ladies. Just came back from the mechanic and I was able to see first hand what kind of damage my engine suffered from. To our collective understanding and the way we see it is.... during the crash, pieces broke from the intake and went past the throttle body, and got lodged where my valves are located before the actual combustion chambers, I believe they are called the rocker arms but I may be wrong and please correct me if so. So the pieces got lodged into all my rockers arms and that's the end of my engine I guess. It makes sense because when I was working on the car months ago, I had a throttle body problem and I found out thanks to several members of this forum that I had a piece lodged in my throttle body. My mechanic who is also a close friend advised me that it would be cheaper or equivalent in terms of labor hours for me to swap the engine with another one vs rebuilding the cams and what not that was damaged. So I have ordered another engine with a 1 year warranty from a yard for a decent price and hopefully I'll be good to go soon. I'll keep y'all posted with anything else that comes up. Lemme know what you guys think so far. Thanks for your input as well.

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Forgot to mention this. Somehow after my valves getting fucked and screwing up my engine, today I saw first hand the pinky sized hole in my block that was the cause of the leaking oil. Seems to us that it must have blown under pressure to the pieces lodged in the engine as the surrounding areas of the block and components were undamaged.

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