GEICO denied coverage(autocrossing BRZ)
 

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/geico-...brz-1770135735

Wtf...Owner on the forum?

Seems kinda messed up, but I heard of another owner that I met at an 86 Expo, Geico also denied her on a BRZ too.

@Stang70Fastback

@Stang70Fastback yes he is on this site.

Edit: @Tcoat beat me to it

I'm not a fan of insurance companies. They pick and choose who the best bets are to insure. This to maximize their profits. They're a for profit business.

As I've said in another thread. People need to SHOP their insurance needs. Every year ... my premiums magically go up for no reason. Their reasons: inflation, multiple pay outs in your area, act of nature, etc. etc. Ever notice they raise your premium for those reasons, but they never lower the premium when they've had a good year. If anything ... Insurance companies should REWARD customers who have good records.

Therefore ... I shop all my quotes. You would be surprised how much money you can save. I do this for every insurance policy I have.

I don't have GEICO, but I should probably read over my Progressive policy. Not that I autocross or track my car.

15 minutes save you 15% on car insurance? Bull shit

15 minutes saves you 100% in this case!


http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2410/...3c420a5e_o.gif

Oh wow it's not a jalopnik article!

I got a notice from Progressive for taking my car to the Mazda raceway. It said that car was shown to be used for something other than what was covered under their policy and to call back. I called them and they said not to worry. I should have letter somewhere.

That's unsettling. I have Geico, but I haven't autocrossed yet. I plan on reading over my policy and see if I can find that clause.


We have a performance driving class at the local police academy where they set up cones and teach you how to negotiate obstacles and such in varying conditions. They even soap the course to help you learn how to recover. This is also something I have considered.


So, if Geico would view this activity as "racing" and even think about dropping me for participating, then I might drop them first.


I would contact your local agent and explain autocross is a safe event that makes you a better, safer driver.

Says it's not racing, calls it racing on facebook....

That aside, the policy terms citation is strange. I'm gonna call my pops about this one (he's an agent).

Do they take your Vin down in autox?

I'm not at all shocked by the refusal to renew. Insurance companies make decisions based on risk. Racing raises the risk, even autocross. When the expected value in claims due to the risky behavior or condition exceeds a certain percentage of the premium, they're not going to renew.

Consider this: The insurance company would much rather keep you as a customer. That's how they make money. If they drop all their customers, they have no income. So if they drop a customer, they usually have a pretty good reason for doing so.

I'm a little puzzled why people are saying this is not racing. You may not be out there side by side trading paint, but you're still competing on time, which means you'll push the car and your own driving abilities harder. The way that insurance policy defines racing, autocross definitely falls within their definition. And autocross definitely carries an increased risk over normal driving:

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB-KBaevPqM&t=0m35s"]Corvette Crashes During An AutoCross Event - YouTube[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSc_j9xnKBg&t=0m25s[/ame]
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHTGAjmBli4"]Corvette Crashes at Autocross and HITS a SPECTATOR. - YouTube[/ame]

Toyota/Subaru call autoX racing when they deny warranty claims. It falls under the "timed event" section of the warranty fine print.


Having said that I would think the insurance policy statements of no coverage for such events is plenty and cancelling the whole thing is a bit extreme.

Oh well, haven't heard anything good about Geico and they've always been the most expensive insurance quote when I asked by a good $50/month.

There's better insurance companies, Geico won't miss the customers as they fatten their profit margins short term and their customers will find better services.

Point of clarification: They didn't cancel. They decided not to renew. Those are two different things. They would need a reason to cancel (like the customer breaching the contract), since they had already agreed to insure the car up to a specific date. They don't need any reason at all to refuse to renew.

And it's not really that extreme. From the insurer's point of view, here's a customer who raced his car and then filed a claim for damage he says he sustained on the way home from a racing event. It probably happened exactly like he said it did. But that story also sounds exactly like other such stories told by people who sustain damage on the track, then lie and say it happened on the street to get the damage covered. That claim is likely what got them looking at him in the first place, and when they reevaluated his risk profile, the expected value of future claims was too high to justify keeping him as a customer.

Are you saying that things like that don't happen in normal driving?




But more seriously, it would nice if the insurance companies came up with a scheme where you are allowed to participate in certain type of events in exchange for a moderate increase of premiums. But I am afraid that autocross or track day participants are too small a group for the insurers to even bother developing something like that.

You're right! Thats what my letter says.

Needs something liek this to be ok.

http://www.lotusclubqueensland.com/i...letter0312.jpg

How do you classify an HPDE then?

Guess I know why people tape over their license plates at these events now...............

Don't be ridiculous.

Yes, people sometimes recklessly drive like complete fucking morons on the street, spin out and crash their cars.

The difference is that when it happens on the street, the guy who does it is a complete fucking moron driving recklessly, whereas in autocross it's normal.

If you recklessly drive like a complete fucking douche on the street, and the insurance company finds out because you had a crash or received tickets, they'll likely drop you then, too.

I think it's hilarious that we have companies whose sole purpose is to take on drivers' risk so that they can avoid responsibility when they fuck up, yet somehow the insurance company paying for all this is the bad guy. Maybe we should just do away with insurance companies altogether and watch people bitch and whine when nobody's around to pay for their damage. "What? You mean I have to actually pay for this myself?"

For those who didn't RTFA...

He disclosed to a chummy Geico rep on the phone that he AutoX'd. That rep then forwarded his disclosure to the Geico underwriting department who then refused to renew his coverage because of this disclosure.

TLDR It's unwise to run your mouth to corporations with a vested interest in taking your money (as premiums) and paying as little as possible as claims. Hard lesson learned by what seems to be a nice guy.

No big shocker here that insurance companies wont cover you when you race. If anyone thinks they should maybe they don't need insurance, or a car

Well, if it is NORMAL in autocross then obviously insurance companies SHOULD drop these people or, as I said, develop a "certain specific forms of racing allowed" policy to cover this. Otherwise, it means that people who don't do autoX will pay for the all that "normal' damage with their increased premiums.



Also, autocross is advertised like this

So someone is spinning BS here, either spinouts and crashes are normal on autoX and unusual on street, like you're saying, or 'hazards do not exceed those encountered in normal driving"

How the heck did they find out you were at a track? Pics of plates and run through some database?

This is good because in a few days I'll be cancelling my GEICO policy since they raised their rates due to losses in the first quarter. I already have a quote with Progressive and will be getting a policy from them. Progressive policy is $421.00 for 6 months, GEICO :eyebulge:$510.00! I've had no accidents or traffic tickets.

From the Blog:
1. How did they suddenly find out?
To GEICO’s credit, it turns out this isn’t nearly as creepy as I and others thought, and it is in fact my doing. Back in January I called GEICO to ask about adding $2500 worth of additional coverage to the car to insure a new set of wheels. The representative I was speaking to at the time seemed pretty cool. He asked me what wheels they were, and I told him, and he said, “Oh, wow those are nice. I’ve got XXXX on my car.” He sounded like a car guy. We got to talking while he worked on his machine, and at some point autocross came up. Apparently he forwarded the details of that conversation to GEICO’s underwriting department, and that’s that. I had completely forgotten about this conversation until she told me about it

And some insurance companies do have that, as evidenced by the letter posted above. However, the time to deal with that issue is before you race, not when you're being dropped because you didn't bother to get an understanding of your policy.

No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that the kind of driving that would be considered reckless on the street is considered normal in autocross. Reckless driving is prohibited on the street because of the increased risk of damage. That kind of driving is considered normal in autocross, even though the risk of damage is increased by driving that way.

Either one increases the risk of claims resulting from this type of driving. None of the accidents in the videos I posted above would have happened had the drivers not been driving aggressively. It's reasonable for an insurance company to consider that risk in determining whether to insure you.

That doesn't necessarily make it true.

Please note that I'm not saying that autocross is inherently dangerous. I'm saying that there is risk associated with any sort of racing, where you push the car and the driver to the limit, that would not be present if you don't race. The insurance company is insuring you based on their understanding of your risk profile. If you do something to increase the risk, you should expect to either pay more or be dropped, at the insurance company's discretion.

I think that we agree more than it may appear from our back and forth-s.

tape your license plate

medicare and insurance,,they are leeches man.

This sucks. Thats why, I dont get personal with my insurance company n tell them what I do with the car or in the car...;)

Plus, another reason to tap the plates with masking tape whenever taking part in an event.

Or your helpful, friendly, eager to help government could require you to have 150k in cash in escrow to be able to drive.

Insurance Companies.
Border Guards.
Airport Security


All people you answer yes and no and keep your mouth shut for anything else.

Or way more for liability! Medical bills are expensive.

@Stang70Fastback

Just don't be a knob and don't tell your insurance you're using it to race. That was pretty dumb.

Yea, that's standard practice over phones and such, Geico is very very well known for pulling that crap there are multiple proven cases on reddit. In some cases with teenagers learning to drive they would add them onto policies without the permission of the parents even though they only drive the vehicle to practice.

Just FYI to all-
Every state has aN Insurance Comissioner (they may different titles in some states) Their responsibility is to prevent abuses by insurance providers. Mostly they review rates and rate requests, but they have a broader responsibility to keep insurance companies in check.

How consumer-friendly they are varies widely from state to state. but here in NC I assure you they are very much advocates for consumers. If you report a suspected violation or unfair practice, the Comission will definitely investigate, and often admonish or discipline an insurance company.

If you have a conflict with your insurance provider, and feel you have been treated unfairly, it could be well worth your while to contact your state Department of Insurance.

I certainly am no fan of insurance companies, but I have to strongly disagree with your criticism of Medicare.

I suspect you are not a Medicare benificiary. But I am. Most of us seniors are pretty crochety, and bitch about most every thing. But I don't know a single senior citizen that is unhappy with Medicare.

I'm 74 years old Generally healthy, but see my GP at least once a year. I also see a cardiologist and a pulmonologist. I had an extensive surgery on my hand several years ago. I have had cataract surgery. If I get sick on a weekend and can't see my regular doc, I go to a walk-in clinic. I pay nothing for any of that.

Medicare has never denied or even questioned any claim. And I don't even have to file them, the providers do.


If the Obama administration had expanded Medicare to provide universal coverage instead of the ACA, I doubt it anybody would be complaining.

My personal favorite:

[ame]http://youtu.be/IhI3DJdjSYQ[/ame]

I didnt criticize,,i am using metaphor lol. I do have medicare beneficial, which i have to pay for it. I am paying for something every month which i dont need, but its required. Now, I am using company's insurance because

"Medicare doesn't cover most dental care, dental procedures, or supplies, like cleanings, fillings, tooth extractions, dentures, dental plates, or other dental devices"

However, I know great amount of people who deserve medicare but got rejected because they are middle class. You might get your medicare beneficial which is awesome. However, not all the people have that beneficial.