Update on Window Freezing Issue, and Toyota Finance
 

So, back in November, my local dealership (not the out of town one where I bought my "certified" 2013 FR-S) was kind enough to preemptively take care of the TSB on the windows. Last Friday, we had hard driving rain, rapidly falling temps down to the low 20's (F), followed by four inches of snow. My car was an ice cake. I cleared it and scraped it as best I could 'cause I had to get to a gig, but sure enough when I opened the door the windows groaned, cracked a bit, then remained cracked open. The passenger window was completely inoperable; the switch did nothing. The driver's side did work, but the "one-touch" up and down functions didn't, nor did the window close itself enough to seal after shutting the door. Sooo.. I called the local dealership and took it in again.

They comfirmed the issue, but were able to get'em working again just by re-initializing the windows. Perchance this is in the manual; I didn't check, and I guess I should have. In any case, they showed me how to do it if it happens again. Driver's side first - push and hold the window button down to roll the window down, and keep it pushed for another five seconds once it's down. Then, pull the switch up and keep it up while the window goes up, and for another five seconds. This resets the driver's side, and then the passenger side should become operable. Do the same procedure on the passenger window, and you should be good to go.

I'll let you know if it happens again.

On another note, the dealership where I bought the car (not a great experience, which is why I'm not naming them) had told me that the first oil change would be free, and I could have it done at any dealership. I appreciated that. At my first visit to the local place, I asked them about it and they said I'd need paperwork from the other dealership for that oil change. I contacted them, and they were kind enough to send me a card for a 12-month "pre-paid" basic or classic maintenance plan. Great.

While I was at the local place having my windows reset, I asked if they'd have time to do the oil change, and they were very happy to do so. I gave'em the card. They seemed perplexed by it, but said they'd look into it. Turned out the card, which says it covers oil changes and tire rotations, only covered up to $45 towards an oil change. That barely covered the synthetic oil. It also only covers $10 worth of the tire rotation (not that I've ever paid anyone to rotate my tires.. or do an oil change, for that matter). So, my free oil change cost me $21 (OK.. it costs more than that to do it yourself, so no worries), and tire rotations aren't fully covered either.

SOOO... even though the dealership where I bought the car included this "prepaid" package "free" with the sale... my opinion on all those STUPID after-sale add-on warranties and maintenance plans still stands. THey suck, are borderline unethical due to the fine (or completely absent) print and gotchas, and are nothing more than just added profit for the dealerships. If I'd paid for it, I'd be really mad.

SOooooooooo.... a big fat raspberry to the place in New Jersey that went back on their word on the price of my trade-in and had to be held to the fire to make good on their other promises, and another tip of the hat, hearty handclasp, and Grateful Grin to Nye Toyota in Oneida, NY.

Oh.. one more thing. I financed part of the car simply because the rate they were offering was so low that I felt my money would better served staying in investments. The finance officer at Raspberry Toyota in NJ told me that all I had to do if I wanted to send extra money in towards principal was make out a larger check and indicate "apply extra payment to principal." Sooo.. I sent'em an extra $8000 for the first payment. THEN, I get a statement from Toyota Finance the next month saying my next payment was due in a few years. NOOOooo!!!!!!! I called them and a SURREAL conversation with one of their "agents." I think he was agent 86.

Even though I'd VERY clearly indicated that I wanted the extra $8000 grand to go toward the principal, they applied it to future payments, ALL OF WHICH HAD INTEREST FIGURED AT FULL AND SLIGHTLY DECLINING PRINCIPAL through that time period. BS!! If I wanted to avoid that interest (which I obviously did, since I bothered to send them $8000), I'd have to continue making monthly payments. OK.. I had planned to. BUT, since, in their eyes, I was paid up until the end of 2017 or whatever, they weren't going to send me any STATEMENTS! I'd have to REMEMBER to send them the payment, remember what it WAS, and keep track of every one myself. AND.. if I wanted to send any extra towards the principal, I'd have to send a SEPARATE check to a different address. An address that isn't mentioned ANYWHERE on the bills, statements, or original loan documentation. Absolutely unbelievable. I'm 55, I've owned and paid off four homes in my life, and a couple car loans (although no loans in recent history), all early. NEVER have I experienced anything like this.

Do I just have "Puke On Me!" painted on my back, or has anyone else been through similarly mentally-irregular dysfunctional financial gymnastics with these space-monkeys?


Ahhh.. that felt good.

Best,

Barry

DANG! I'm glad you got that off your chest ...........:eyebulge:

At least you know how to fix your windows ....... :thumbsup:


humfrz

TL;DR ?

I owe very little on my car as its a 2013 aswell. I do pay extra payments but I pay them online, so I'm not sure where the extra money goes. Guess I better check.

LOL payment due in a few years. Thats awesome

Don't have these freezing problems because if its that kind of weather I work at home. However if you door jams up in the ice, pee on it, yes pee on it. Don't use hot water, i know some one that did, but they didn't take physics I guess

Now, that's just fine and dandy ........ if you're a young male ....... ;)


humfrz

Wax where it freezes weekly imo.

Bought a modern budget vehicle, everything went as expected per the fine print.

Thanks!! Good to hear OP :cheers:

ok...i guess you posted this for your experience..
yeah window issue is common in this car and you can reset it.

There is no such thing as free lunch/dinner
even it says free, there is a catch..

I also noticed my family's toyota sienna finance statement doesnt have any other address to send out payment for principal either. I would also argue but how much interested that would be if you already got lower APR. i assume less than $100?

I would visit local performance shop to do my maintenance if i dont do it myself even it costs higher than local shops. i would avoid stealership except for warranty work

lol.... You're maybe waiting for the movie to come out?

Not really. There was no fine print in the financing contract about having to mail extra principal payments to a different address, and having to do that is in direct opposition to the finance officer's representation of the loan contract. So.. no, everything did not go as expected, hence the post.

:lol: your post made my day!!

The amount ain't the issue, although I would argue that $100 is a meaningful amount of money to many folks, me included. The issue is that the procedure for paying additional principal was misrepresented by the loan officer, AND kept pretty much a secret unless you call Toyota Finance and demand to know how to do it.

I do all of my own maintenance, and most of my own repairs. The only reason I went to the dealership was because the selling dealership told me the first oil change was free, and because the windows were a warranty item.

ANY car windows will freeze under those conditions. That has zero to do with the TSB or "issue" since they were for water running down inside the door and freezing the guides there. Be glad that the safety system was there to save the windows and worked as it should. I burned out several motors back in the day trying to open frozen windows.

From Toyota Financial Services FAQ:

https://www.toyotafinancial.com/pub/...s_account_faqs

I didn't figure it out until my 2nd or 3rd payment either, but it's not a secret. Definitely an annoying practice, but not illegal or undisclosed.

I appreciate the reply, Strat, very much. Maybe it's just me, but I still can't excuse Toyota Finance's handling of this. When the loan terms were presented to me, I asked the finance officer in no uncertain terms how to apply extra payments directly to principal and she told me to just indicate that desire on my check and on the payment slip. No mention of another address. No mention of another address on the monthly statements. Sooo.. how am I supposed to know about this policy prior to originating the loan? Tell the loan officer, "Wait, I don't believe you. Give me a second to pull out my smart phone and check the Toyota Financial FAQ to see if you're lying?"

OK, so they put the correct information up on their website. Customers aren't on their website when they're signing loan papers.

Maybe it's not illegal to not furnish this very important information PRIOR to a customer's signing documentation, but it's sure undisclosed at that time. It sure as H E Double Hockey sticks is annoying and unethical.

I spoke with the loan officer at my GOOD local dealership about the practice. He was cool, but pretty much admitted the evasive practices because they don't make much on low rate financing and this is one way for them to make more. So, yes, they're aware of the unethical, deceptive practice yet do it anyway.

You're a more forgiving dude than I am, at least in this respect. I'll be paying the car off within a month or two, and it'll be the last car loan I ever take out.

Thanks again.. I appreciate the thoughts.

Barry

I wasn't complaining about the windows freezing; I've lived in the frozen north for my entire adult life and have replaced, personally, my share of burnt out window motors, bent arms, and broken nylon guides before I learned to stop using the darn electric window switches to try and break loose frozen windows. Better to just let'em stay shut until they thaw on their own or you can get some deicer on'em. I don't like the DESIGN, that's all. I'd rather the windows didn't have an auto-crack function, that's all. What you say is true; any window would have frozen in the conditions I described (and we get those conditions frequently). It'd be better to have windows that didn't subject themselves automatically to enough stress to cause them to shut down and require a reset, that's all.

Thanks..

Barry

I believe I did not convey my tone properly over the internet. I am 100% sympathetic with you, my post is entirely based on cynicism from going through exactly the same process you have.

I am not more forgiving, I'm just lazy and it's easier to be peanut gallery than try to affect actual change. The dealerships are shamelessly trying to get every penny out of you and Toyota USA is not in a position to kick them in the ass to provide good customer service. Their customer service line just kicks you to a dealership customer service rep who usually is just a paid punching bag for savvier customers that can't do anything because dealership owner doesn't give a shit and would rather see that extra profit from shady practices.

IMO direct sales to customers are coming back, if every Apple store was pulling this shit on laptops and iphones you think they'd have the reputation they have? No, they'd have Best Buy's reputation. Come on Tesla!

Like I said earlier, the "too long; didn't read" is that you bought an affordable car at a typical new car dealership. It's a damn shame, I have zero desire to ever go through the process of buying a new car again, it's just not worth it, craigslist has kicked ass in comparison. Be lucky you didn't get hit with the 'yo-yo finance' like I did.

http://www.autoblog.com/2013/08/28/p...-yo-financing/

They increased the interest rate, said they'd mail me a check for cash difference over the loan period, lied and applied the money to the next months loan payment (of course not the principle). I didn't raise a stink because like you I was paying off early so the interest rate increase didn't hurt me and I got like $100 free for falling for their scam and wasting an hour of my time.

Hey market research people, you hear that? Millenials would rather buy cars off craigslist than from a dealership. Get yo house in order!

Take a closer look at the design, I believe they'd catch on the door frame if they didn't move out of the way.

I guess I'm not surprised at any of it, cause I can offer my own experience with a loan from Toyota Financial. Far less crazy-making, however:

Having set up an online account, I experimented by making a timely payment and a few days later making an additional payment. When the statement came, sure enough the next due date was not next month, but the month following. Good for putting it out of your mind for a while, but bound to bite you in the mass one way or another. Making a payment against principal, however, was possible by following certain instructions, doing it between certain dates, pressing certain buttons. You had to look for the instructions, but they are there. They hide them a little, cause after all, paying down principal is unsportsmanlike and costs them money.

Now ask me how I bought a glorious, slightly used BRZ still under Subaru warranty at a Toyota dealer and wound up with a Toyota extended warranty.

:suicide:

Well, certainly Millenials are learning the difference between how we elders bought cars at dealerships and how to save money on a newish car more or less outside the system. But from what I hear, Milleniums aren't much excited about buying cars anyway, as long as somebody in their group has one (our two-seaters mostly don't count).

:sigh:

In broad generalities it's not that cars are uninteresting to my generation, they're about as interesting as they were to any other generation. Before there were computer nerds there were book worms, playing chess by mail and people felt comfortable walking or biking the streets at night. There's no hidden cultural shift for you to uncover watching kids play video games with other kids from Russia (it's just DnD where a computer rolls the dice) it's that cars (and most importantly to this conversation: new cars as there is no data on old car sales) are a luxury many cannot afford. Too many articles and studies and simple maths you can do yourself to see that there is less opportunity now then there was 50, 25, or even 10 years ago.

It's a trend that's been happening since before the early 90's crash that screwed over Gen X. If we had a booming economy and youths gainfully employed those 'average car buyer age' numbers would plummet.