Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB - BRZ/86 vs. MKV Supra: An Owner's Perspective

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- - BRZ/86 vs. MKV Supra: An Owner's Perspective (https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=137156)

For what it’s worth I sold the 2018 tS to pay off the Supra. I was leasing a GTI as a DD. When dealers were reopening during the pandemic I took advantage of incentives on new cars and demand for used vehicles and got rid of the GTI lease and got the ‘20 BRZ tS for my daily driver because I missed the fun, mechanical, and raw experience of the BRZ (which is slightly amplified in the tS).

Now I have the tS and Supra as weekend car which is an amazing combination.

Their polar driving characteristics converges and establishes a harmonious coverage of the various degrees of driving enjoyment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ernest72 (Post 3350506)

Typical. Twin guys pick the twin, Supra guys pick the Supra.

Interesting thing many pointed the Corolla thing. Some people buy a sports car to be seen others just for the pure enjoyment, some both probably.

I would buy a used 981 and an 86 before I bought one Supra. But I am biased and was never a Big BMW guy. The Supra does sound like fun though. But the steering of the twins really just shines.

I don’t need to be seen, maybe heard as I fly by at 7000 rpm.

Not sure if it was as black or white as that. Some forum members had that view, whilst others appreciated each car’s attributes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ernest72 (Post 3350506)

The twins have a few other things going for it that the Supra doesn't have.
1.) Its got back seats (They may be small and useless for taller folk, for smaller people like me, i could actually use the space.)
2.) stickshift
3.) its an overall cheaper car

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirty Harry (Post 3349710)

Interesting to see the SupraMKV forum perspective. A few of them have (or have had) both an 86 and a Supra.

https://www.supramkv.com/threads/is-...he-supra.2868/

There's a shocking number of Supra owners who've also owned/own a BRZ/FRS/86.

Of these owners, it seems that the vast majority (90%+) are all turbocharged. A small minority are supercharged. Only a scant few stayed NA with their twin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSG Mike (Post 3350997)

Makes sense, the feel of raw power can overcome, mask or make you forget other shortcomings. For example I have met a number of people who loved the Neon SRT4. I never drove one, but it was likely fun.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Veloist (Post 3263666)

Driving Impressions

The BRZ/86 was praised for connecting the driver to the car through a pure driving experience, and this experience was clear to me after owning a couple of them, and it was the first thing I noticed when getting used to the Supra. So if there’s any clear difference between the Supra and the BRZ/86, it’s that the Supra gives up some of that pure and raw element of the BRZ/86 for refinement and better performance.

I immediately noticed how I missed the quick-ratio steering of the BRZ/86 as soon as I drove the 2020 Supra out of the parking lot. Although the Supra’s steering is actually nicely weighted even in NORMAL setting, it doesn’t have the communication that the BRZ/86 has because of a more noticeable dead spot in the center. Once I hit the twisties with the Supra, that’s when I noticed that the steering still has the precision you’d expect from a sports car--but unlike the BRZ/86 it has less of a “point-and-shoot” feeling.

With that in mind, it doesn’t take long to realize that comparing the two cars is essentially like a shootout between driving experience and driving performance. Well, it’s a given that most of the performance differences come from the powertrain. The Supra manages daily driving situations like passing, merging, and cruising with effortless ease and confidence. 65 MPH feels slow in the Supra. 90 MPH feels like normal, conservative highway driving. In spirited driving, the Supra provides more thrills especially since it can exit corners quickly and push you back in your seat in a straight line.

However, there is also something fun about wringing out the engine of the BRZ/86 to make up for that lack of torque. It kind of reminds me of driving cars at wide open throttle in video games. And, although the Supra downshifts beautifully with a pop, you can’t really beat nailing a perfect rev-matched downshift yourself with a manual transmission. Yes, in a timed competition the transmission would matter but if you’re just out there enjoying the machine on a weekend, the manual transmission would add to the experience.

Cruising along, the Supra rides very smoothly. If the road is decently paved the car almost has a sporty-luxurious ride, and I can see myself being more than comfortable in it during a cross country road trip. But something about the harsher and stiffer ride of the BRZ/86 compliments every other raw quirk that the twins have to offer...it makes it feel...old school. If you close your eyes and remove factors like acceleration and engine noise, the ride of BRZ/86 actually feels more like a sports car than the Supra.

Final Thoughts

The Supra is my new weekend car which was previously held by both of the BRZ’s I owned. For me I want my weekend car to be a nice toy to have around that’s special to me and that feels vastly different than my daily driver (a GTI). The Supra and the BRZ/86 are great cars to own because they feel different from a lot of other cars out there.

But what most people want to know is if the Supra is significantly a better car than the BRZ/86, or if it is really worth 2x the price. Although I can’t answer that because we all have different tastes, I can say that the Supra does a lot of things better than the BRZ/86. It’s fun to have a fast car that still responds well to you. The Supra is more fun than the BRZ/86 if you strongly agree with that statement. At the same time, there are things that the BRZ/86 does that the Supra either does worse or doesn’t do at all. Ultimately, the BRZ/86 engages the driver more so than the Supra.

With that said, I believe that the MKV Supra can’t completely replace a BRZ/86. Doing so may make you miss its raw and pure character that you got used to, and that most likely cannot be satisfied with the more refined Supra. My plan is to keep the Supra as a weekend car and once my lease on the VW GTI is up, to replace that with the 2nd-gen BRZ if it is indeed a better version than what we have today...otherwise I’ll go pre-owned because I now know for sure that the BRZ/86 is the car I want to drive every day.

The MKV Supra feels modern and refined. The BRZ/86 feels nostalgic and raw as if it was from the 90’s. That’s why I can’t express how important it is to appreciate the BRZ/86 for what it is. If anything, the MKV Supra just cemented the purpose and charm of the BRZ/86. It’s truly a unique car designed to give drivers an old-school, well-connected, pure driving experience in a world of modern cars.

Agree, old-school/raw is definitely the description I'd give the twins.
Furthermore, to me, the 86 platform is a blank slate that I don't feel bad in putting my own twist into it or reshaping it to my liking. It's pretty evident with the amount of aftermarket that this platform has that there has to be a place for this kind of car, hopefully 2nd gen sales are satisfactory to keep it going. Very few cars at the 86's price point that give you all the basic sports car checkboxes and offer the amount of aftermarket support it has.

The FR-S' ride is harsher, and I actually like that better. I feel more connected and less... floaty if that makes sense.
In a cross country road trip though, I agree, the Supra has more comfortable seats, suspension, and tires. I think it would be great on trips. The one thing that I hate about the FR-S is the seats are stiff and I'm constantly shifting about to keep my back happy.

I do find the Supra more distracting inside though. My FR-S was pre-steering wheel controls, I also don't have advanced climate controls, or push start, and no carplay or android auto.
In the Supra,it might just be that I need to get to know the car more...but it feels very distracting inside and I feel like I'm thinking too hard to scroll through radio stations or looking at the vehicle/driver settings, changing the temp between left & right.... and my gosh, the backup camera sucks. Is it different on the 8.8 inch screen? I have the smaller head unit and the backup picture looks like they smushed a 16x9 picture into 4x3 space. The 2016 FR-S has a much better backup camera. I may edit this post tomorrow to compare here.

I can't compare too much yet on fun quality or performance without enough Supra seat time, I got mine right as the pandemic started so I've barely driven it around my own city...Whereas I've driven my FR-S all across the country, modded it, had all sorts of animals in it, Autocrossed it, you name it.

The Supra is definitely fun to drive still, very minimal lag and put you back in your seat kick when you are full throttle.

Get a lot of compliments in my Supra in drive thrus and parking lots, although I do as well in the FR-S, not as much in this short period.
Also got an annoying "Is that a Supra!1?!?!?" once already.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ernest72 (Post 3350506)

Typical. Twin guys pick the twin, Supra guys pick the Supra.

Based on some of what I've read on there, I don't think you could convince most MKV Supra owners that an 86 does anything better than their Supra.

Quote:

Originally Posted by NARFALICIOUS (Post 3351898)

Based on some of what I've read on there, I don't think you could convince most MKV Supra owners that an 86 does anything better than their Supra.

I would agree, except if you include cost. If you put fun per dollar, the 86 and Miata do that the best. Not saying that you don’t get something for paying more. I am talking strictly about fun on the street or the track. I mean realistically you could buy 2 twins, one for street and one for track, for the same price as the Supra. Let’s not even talk about parts cost on a BMW.

Update: I just sold my GR Supra.

My only regret was not taking advantage of the free track day. To be honest I didn’t really have an interest to go. Overall, the GR Supra was a nice car. The straight line acceleration is a nice feature but it’s not an important aspect to me in a sports car…especially when an electric car can do that much better.

I ultimately sold the GR Supra without hesitation because as the driver, I did not feel as involved in the driving. I can attribute to the lack of steering feel and light steering weight, as well as the lack of the manual transmission. Also I had less confidence driving the car spiritedly…the short wheelbase makes the car rotate quickly but if the road isn’t smooth I experience the rear-end oscillation that a few others have mentioned.

In the end, I no longer had the emotional feedback that I’ve had in my other cars like the 3 BRZ’s I’ve owned as well as my MR2 and the Mk7.5 GTI.

At least for its replacement I’ll make sure it has a manual and sensational steering feel and response.

Thanks for the update! Have you driven a 2021 model? I heard they came out with a lot of improvements related to the handling. Though I doubt it helped anything with the steering (and certainly nothing changed with the transmission type).

I really like the Supra and would be seriously interested if they were available with a manual transmission option. But with auto only, doubt I will ever be interested. Recently took the plunge for a 2 pedal only sports sedan (AMG) and while the car is really something, I miss the interaction of the 3rd pedal and shifter. Huge part of the experience is missing for me and this will probably just be something I own a few years.

Let us know what you look for next!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Veloist (Post 3453498)

Wow, so what’s next? Or are you sticking with the tS mainly?

I’m concerned that the manual transmission is going be phased out quicker than anticipated (like, within the decade). I pretty much fell in love with the Lotus Emira and on paper it appears to have everything the GR Supra didn’t. I was actually so hyped up when revealed and have the 10th spot at my dealership.

The excitement I felt is the same type of excitement I had when the Scion FR-S was revealed on November 30th, 2011. I’ll also for sure pick up a 2nd gen twin once the special editions come out and most likely a later model year.

I tested the new Supra last week and can tell you that the A91 model is a good update, but I didn't buy it because the price is subdued compared to the new GR86, which will not come to us in May 22nd comparison. I and my wife have ordered the new GR86 for the upcoming trackdays, because I believe that in the long run it will be the cheaper and better vehicle than the BMW brother