I had a 350z before this car. 100 hp more, but also about 500lbs more. the ft-s is faster in some regards. all out straight-line speed, no. But the ft-s is much faster in twisty's than the z. I haven't upgraded tires yet, but it doesn't matter. More usable power range.

The z had a lot of power everywhere, but I had to be more careful with the throttle. I couldn't use all the power the z had. Was too much. Great for swinging the back end out, but not great for traction.

The twins don't need any extra power. Just better tires and driver.

That's the first time I have ever read that the 350Z had "too much power."

I agree with "the twins dont need any extra power" my method on getting the best performance from your car isnt tunes and upgrades its maintenance, I keep it in the best mechanical shape possible and always always make sure the tires have enough air and are not worn out. Tires are so critical not only to a fast car but to any car, this is the first time ive bought a car brand new that wasnt used, but previously any used car I bought went straight to the mechanic and 4 new tires no matter what the previous owner told me. Once you can keep a car close to perfect mechanically you can have faith that it will do what it was designed to do. I dont believe in modding the gt86, its like arguing with the subaru and toyota engineers on the quality of their work and the reason why they decided 200 hp was enough. Its messing around with the hp and torque that will get you into trouble, their experience told them that this weight and engine along with all its components are ideal and I respect their opinion, messing around with its dynamics and engine can give you all sorts of problems and really make your life hell. You have a toyota/ subaru and those two are considerd the leading car manufacturers with the track record to prove it. I would trust their opinion any day over mechanics who want to make a quick buck.

Moral of the story is they have done all the trial and error already, so you either trust their expertise or go buy a v8 if its about the power.

This baby is razor sharp, flies like a butterfly, trust me on this, ive driven many many fast cars and slow cars and shit cars, this car takes my breath away with what it can do and the pure driving experience it gives you. I have never seen anything like it. So dont go messing with a work of art. Its like trying to improve on the mona lisa or a picasso.

Phew im out of breath.

300+hp so you can wipeout and hit/jump curb like I did of course

I don't know about that, peak whp I must be very close (when I'm not jumping curbs, breaking rims and unhooking my front bumper) with my KW c38, full bolt-ons on 94 octane and 550 injectors. I'll have to dyno it once I get it out of the body shop and take it to a 1/4 mile to see where my whp actually stack up but I do have enough top end power to spin myself silly on 3rd/4th gear (ask me how I know) :cry:

That's my next upgrade lol.


In all honesty I am a pretty decent driver but this is the first time I've owned anything with more than 250hp (sc'd brz), and I just tend to forget how much more power I have under my foot at all times (WOT can now be a dangerous thing for me whereas it wasn't at all with my previous cars, WOT just meant go a bit faster, now it means you may start spinning tire in 4th on a straight line if you go from little throttle to WOT instantly)

"it will never have enough power until I can spin the wheels at the end of the straightaway in high gear." -Mark Donohue

I am slowly coming to the realization 80% of this board has never driven anything remotely fast....and that this is the fastest car they have owned.


The car is great. The car handles exceptionally well. It isn't perfect from the factory and many people beg for more power. It is a nice car....but it is far from uncontrollable or breath taking. The car begs for another 200 WHP, then it would be FUN car.

Another 200WHP would put it into Corvette power/weight territory, which means you should've bought a Corvette. Corvettes are fun. 86s are also fun. It's just the type of fun that doesn't lead me to buy thousands of dollars worth of tires every year, which was most of the appeal for me.

for tight twisty backroads, yes. The power came on heavy and would light the rears up at almost any chance. I had achilles art sports all the way around.

Wow this thread still going? Too lazy to read detail, but Tcoat stated well.

Does it really matter how much power you have? Power is one of equation on this car formula. Other stuff is more important than "power". You can have 600whp FRS and still be well balanced or better balanced car than stock. You can have stock power, but shaved the weight til 2,100lbs. "Feels" like you got more power, but it just have less weight for engine to move.

Bob Hall once stated:
"It's not about power. If you can't go fast with 90 horsepower, 900 ain't gonna help ya. I genuinely feel that."

I gotta agree with him.

BUT if you just want the number game, then sky is the limit... correction, wallet is the limit.

Corvettes are FUN. 86's are fun..... big difference.

Driven Z06, not even 1 sec I thought it was "FUN". It was fckin' scary!

C5 Corvettes less than the price of a brand new 86, 345hp, 350 ft-lbs, <5s 0-60, and that's for the base model. Z06's are still cheaper than BRZ's looking at my local craigslist for 385hp & ft-lbs. Yeah a little chubby at 3,200+ lbs but everything in the car was built to handle that kind of power, no shopping for wheels/tires, injectors, radiators, worrying about the transmission, driveshafts, clutch, or overall engine longevity because you're stretching what the factory designed it for, all things known to be issues with high horsepower 86's.

Great book, just finished reading it, fits the thread perfectly. And for those who don't know, he was discussing the Porsche 917 with the Porsche engineers which some claims place at 1,000-1,500+ horsepower. I can't even fathom that, let alone on 1970's tires. Thing was at or better than 1/2 hp/lb at certain points, and we're playing with 1/14...

So any regrets settling for 'fun' instead of 'FUN'?

Achilles ATR sport and throttle input seems the culprit.

I had a Z06, and built three other LSx platforms. I wanted to try something different. Once I put the edelbrock SC and get CCW's I'll be happy.

The only thing I'm going to say to your comment (not that I disagree with it, but it is somewhat anecdotal), was it the mod that actually did the performance improvement, or did the mod just give you the balls to do it?

prius swap, for the torque

It becomes pointless when you spend too much time worry about other things besides actually driving. Or when the only way to have fun is breaking the laws with triple digits and the backend wants to go first. lol

I mean the Z06 had more power than necessary to drive normally and it liked to go....but they are completely civilized cruising at 1100 rpm at 70.


Backend wants to go first? No.... a completely balanced vehicle with wide tires and enough stability nannies that anyone could drive the car. If you turn everything off and don't know what you are doing they can get you in trouble, but.... If you want to drive a corvette civilized it is EASY. They can also get 28-30 MPG reliably if you just set the cruise and go.

Can enjoy a Vette on the track just as much as an 86 on the track...

One of local autoxer let me race his Z06. When you're racing for time, Z06 like to eat you alive. Even with Hoosier tires... but it was a good experience for sure. Power was crazy... but felt more like ridiculous tq more. That's something cannot get from 2 liter 4 cylinders engine (even with FI).

Or fuel

Ignoring the prius part, I feel that even if they left the horsepower at 200bhp, and somehow managed to bump up and flatten the torque a lot of these power complaints would go away.

Hell, my boat (Fusion) with the 2.0 Ecoboost FEELS a lot faster than my BRZ did, because its torque-y as hell until about 5000RPM... After that the turbo tops out and it falls on its face, but that's off topic.

I dunno how they'd accomplish this though. Maybe make an FA25? Because we know it'll never be turbocharged.

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tq dip is one of trait of boxer engine. Even Porsche's boxer engine have this tq dip.

I'm really not noticing a dip, maybe on a manual it's not so evident because you have a bit more control. Regarding corvettes I'm sure they are an amazing ride but their re sale value is terrible while the gt86 has a very good one, but from what I'm gathering here re sale or fuel economy doesn't come into the equation.

Some ppl notice more bout TQ dip more than others. For me, daily, idc much. When it comes to Autox & track, TQ dip is very noticeable (but still don't care too much).

As for vette, I'm not sure on resale, I feel most muscle cars go through same kind of resale.

Not sure what resale you are talking about....clean vettes always demand a premium......Fuel economy should NEVER come in to the equation with a toy.


The 86 resale hasn't had enough time to determine. High teens low 20's generally but you never see many with miles. They're still too new to see a large drop IMO.

Probably in the states American cars retain their value better than they do in the gulf, here if you compare their depreciation to Japanese cars there is a big difference. Their parts are also more expensive and seem to be more prone to needing repairs than Jap cars. The best cars for retaining value here are :
1. Toyota
2. Nissan

German cars, British cars, American cars depreciate at a much faster pace. French cars have the highest depreciation.

Maybe, that's interesting. I would think that after importing something it would retain some of its value. Here generic Nissans plummet, I think its actually the worst resale Japanese make! Edmunds say Nissans lose 46% of value after one year. I'm sure the 370 and GTR are exceptions....


Subaru and Lexus are the top resale vehicles.

Corvettes hold their value here pretty well. They seem to drop until they're two generations old and then either plateau or rise in some cases. I would be surprised if the twins held the same value long term.

I've driven fast cars, I just don't have anywhere to use one with regularity. If there are open roads they're usually residential and you're not by yourself for very long. We also have a lot of cops.

When I say the FR-S doesn't need more power, I mean it doesn't need more power for the way I use it. I'd say the same about my Miata which has even less power.

If I had some wider and longer stretches of empty pavement available I may be singing another tune.

-Justin

You get what you paid for. For 25K ... you get 200hp. If you wanted 300hp ... then you pay more for a different car. For 200-300K you can buy a Huracan or Ferrari 488 with over 600 hp.

Yes ... the 86 would offer a "different" level of excitement at 250-300 hp, but would most here pay for it? At the end of the day ... the 86 is an entry level economically equipped sportscar that handles really well.

It is what it is and it isn't what it isn't. (sounds like something the late Yogi Berra might have said).

Local Chevy dealer is offering a new Z28 for ~$52k ($20k discount off MSRP). Corvettes at least don;t start depreciating until they are purchased once.

-Justin

46% drop jeez. Jap cars retain value because they do well in extreme heat. Temps can reach 50 c in summer. List a Toyota for sale and it's gone the next day at a very good price. Sport cars will lose value no matter what the make. I've been monitoring the prices of the gt for a while because I was going to buy a used and their prices held. 2013 models lost just 15 to 20% of their value can you believe that?

Please provide a link or other documentation to support that!

Yes, but if my line of thinking is right (its probably not, but I'm gonna keep going anyway) other than boost, they key to more torque (and power) is displacement. The saying came about for a reason.

Additionally, we all know a catless UEL and an ECU tune does wonders for this car. If it were possible for Subaru to implement those changes, it might be the difference some/most people are looking for.

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https://dubai.dubizzle.com/m/motors/...s=&price__lte=


Brand new they cost between 90,000 to 124,000 in the local currency. 20 to 25% to be more accurate.

1$ = 3.68 in local currency.

Yes, UEL header will kill TQ dip to certain lvl... but that won't pass smog :(

Eh, bull! VW did it, so can Subaru!

On a serious note, that's true. It's been a while, but even catted UEL headers help with the torque dip a little. Combining that and a slightly larger displacement just might help

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My opinion, its all relative. If I had a turbo 86 I'm sure there are guys in stock cars putting down faster times than I would.

My personal mods weren't because I wanted to go faster.
I got track tires because I hated how the stock ones would get greasy and I had to drive slow to cool them.
I got dedicated track wheel because I like having a street tire for the street. Plus I don't have to worry about road debris ruining my track weekend if I get a flat driving there.
I got "BBK" because I like how a set of pads lasted me 12 days vs 4 on stock size.

Honestly I wish I could afford a tow vehicle and trailer. But then I'd probably not have a twin.