Simple put the price on the sticker is they price you pay.. The dealership can not raise the price of it.... can it be lowered yes.. but then the dealership will lose money on the car...

That sucks it's gonna be a scion. The no haggle system sucks, I'll only pay $500 over invoice just like all my other cars. If scion don't want to haggle I bet Subaru will. And I bet the scion version won't have a turbo (knowing Toyota a turbo will be next to impossible to install and tune). If worse comes to worse I'll buy a Subaru and then buy the jdm front and rear Toyota bumpers: best of both worlds.

oohh ok. yeah i was worried about the idea of not being able to lower it. so pretty much, i can prob cut off a good 100-500 off the sticker, but its gonna take some seriious haggling right?

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Moot point.

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Perhaps used a rwd or awd car to begin with? :iono:

Rado's TC is stupid fast and well developed, granted. Know that full well. However, Put that much time, budget and work into a respectable rwd chassis and see if it doesn't turn out better.. without the park bench on the front. I like unconventional thinking, however what's the point in reinventing the wheel and making it octagon because round is too passe?

**edit**

wow. 24 pages in a day and a half? Must be some sort of record. lmao

I don't think the dealerships lose money on the car if they set the price tag. They can simply say.. this Scion cost 18k(base) + paper work and some of the accessories you want would total 21k, but in reality the car probably costs 14k to make + that other 4k for import tax and all the dilly dally.

Just because the "MSRP" says whatever on the website isn't necessarily true. :P Could be after all that paper work and a smaller margin of profit. If ya' catch my drift. :P

iirc '11 Geneva thread went lil over 30 pages in lil over week, so 24 pages in day & half is pretty fast. That tells you how many ppl are desperate for info in this car

Maybe he likes to do things people say can't be done. Like take a FWD car into the sub 1:00 times at a race track that otherwise only AWD and RWD cars get to. They are just a few seconds short of the overall track times, this is what sparked the development of their AWD tC. They are going after the overall times now.

They had front wings on race cars back in the 60's though, so it's nothing new.

AWD tC got the same sorta treatment in terms of downforce, but doesn't need as much as the FWD of course.

AWD + 1500hp

http://carphotos.cardomain.com/ride_...4001_large.jpg

Whatever floats his boat, but it doesn't really change the grit of the situation.

Yes, cars have had front wings a long time... rado's is ....... unconventional to say the least.

The awd tc reminds me very much of a pikes peak car. Pity one can't actually pick up an awd tC off the showroom floor (as cool a race car I actually opine that the awd tC is).

^^Yeah, definitely thought outside the box. Maybe not the grit to some, but the grip sure changed...:) But that thinking has gained him significant advantages. Now other FF guys are following suit, just not as drastic (Hasport for example).

Yeah Pikes peak is usually the first thoughts on the AWD tC.

I just had a curious thought. People have indicated they think having an Scion version of the FT would kill tC sales.

Wouldn't it sorta be equivalent to a Toyota Solara and a Toyota Camry. Solara is a two door Camry some could argue. But I don't think either hurts the others sales. I think there is a greater difference between a tC and an FT-86 then there is a Solara and a Camry.

The other thing I was thinking of, is that the FT should be above the price of the tC, with peoples opinion of the Scion brand (being for low budget college kids), how can the FT kill tC sales if low budget college kids can afford the FT? Seems a bit contradictory to think of the "image" as being a low budget persons car, but think a higher costing FT would steal sales. The college kids would be still in the tC and post grad young adults (30's and up) would be in the FT. Parents do buy their kids stuff they shouldn't have, but there aren't enough parents to buy their kids FT's to make any impact in tC sales or to make up a demographic % no more than there is a young kid with a 350z, STI etc...

The US Mk4 non-turbo was offered with VVT-i. The JDM Turbo was offered with VVT-i.

The JDM non-turbo (with VVT-i) also had a V161 6-speed option.

The JDM Supras were better. Period.

(Not even getting into the Mk3s... 1JZGTE Twin Turbo R vs any 7MGTE? Any questions?)

(For the sake of keeping this organized-ish. Lol)

1.) Having the FT kill off the tC brand is unlikely. The price difference between the two will have people still purchasing the tC since the cost is much less than of the FT.

2.) Comparing the Ugly Solara to the Not-as-ugly-as-the-Solara Camry is the same as comparing a Pond to a Lake. (Which reminds me, why did they even make the Solara? It serves no purpose whatsoever. lol) If they wanted a mileage out of their car and comfort--a 3dr Yaris could have been a better option. Also, the solara is anything but practical.

3.) By placing the FT into the Scion brand, it defeats the whole purpose of a cheap sports car under 20k though no? (Comparing both vehicles at base price that is.)

4.) Most college students who have the funds to buy the FT are a smaller group. Whereas high school graduates Freshman college students are getting these cars via Gift from their parents. Which brings up another point. If the FT can't kill the tC sales how will Scion get back up on their feet? They're already in much trouble as they already are. Let the brand die and revive TRD cars that aren't trucks.

Which is why the Solara is the wonderful sales success and still in production?

Majority are going in looking for a two-door sporty coupe. They can only buy one. I see it the other way around. Few of the masses will pay the extra $$$ for the FT, and after an early ZOMGWTFBBQ! new car sales spurt, the numbers will fall rather quickly as the masses choose with their wallets, not the driving experience.

OT: but am i the only one not using noob settings? Its page 10 people!