My friend's had had an '83 Civic that that was hydro locked. Bent all 4 piston rods into S shapes but that was the only damage. Replaced the piston rods and put another 100K miles on the car. Weirdest looking thing to see a bunch of piston rods bent like that.

I have never liked dealerships, reading this just reinforces my hatred.

After speaking to the service manager at the dealership they stated there is a knock on Cyl 2 and this has to be a bent rod so they are stopping their troubleshooting and will not cover this under warranty but if I would like them to continue troubleshooting I can authorize the labor cost and it could be up to $1800.00.

This felt like a scare tactic the way it was presented to me but I know I did NOT hydro lock this engine and I’m defending myself against a fictitious story the dealership came up with so I authorized the labor cost.
After two days of tear down I went to the dealer to check on the progress and found the engine completely taken down to the sealed block they said today they will open the block and see what is really going on.

I received a call from the service manager explaining they found no water, no bent rod and no other damage but a spun bearing and they would need special equipment to make sure the rod was not bent just a LITTLE BIT if they wanted to go that far... The exact statement said to me was “We cannot prove 100% a hydrolock caused this issue so we are sending the data to Toyota to see what they want to do next.”

NEXT? The dealership just proved I was NOT lying and I did not hydro lock this motor but the manager sounded disappointed they couldn’t prove their story was real. WTF.
I will say at least management was nice and informative when I finally spoke to someone who wasn’t a front desk monkey.

I HATE DEALERS......

I'm wondering how the hell a rod bent just like that on a stock engine. Manufacturing defect?

See above, there was no bent rod.

Well the dealer just called and they have ordered the replacement part to repair the issue.
They were very nice about it and even provided me with a loaner car.
.
.Life lesson when you are telling the truth don't back down ever.

Glad they are finally getting it fixed, I hope for your trouble they've given you a nice loaner.

Replacement bearing? or new block all together?

New short block and #2 Direct injector because the pistons was hitting it.

dunno if i'd want a new short block...

Glad the dealer is finally taking care of you rather than trying to lay blame. It seems to me in your video that the engine is running fairly smoothly, just with a very loud noise? I don't understand how the dealer jumped to the conclusion that it was water damage, in that case.

Contrary to what others have said, in my 11 years as a dealership technician I have seen several cases where only one or two rods were bent due to water intake. The '04-'08 Acura TL is notorious for this, in fact. I would guess due to intake design on those cars, when a small amount of water is taken in, it rushes to the cylinders furthest from the throttle body (1 and 4 on that motor). Furthermore, I've seen rods bent from water intake create "rod knock" type noises, when they are bent so badly that the curved part of the rod contacts the cylinder wall.

However, if a rod were bent enough to make that kind of noise, it would most likely misfire badly. Looking at Subaru's intake manifold design, it also seems less likely to affect just one cylinder. A compression test will easily reveal whether any rods are bent, and it's obvious the dealership failed to perform one. If I suspected a car ran through water and the owner tried to hide it, that's the first thing I would have requested authorization to perform, rather than a complete teardown.

Why do you say that? I would rather a new short block than just having a bearing replaced.

Ditto. I would want a short block installed versus thinking about them tearing down the original block and hoping they get the rod bearing replacement and rebuild right. Plus, if the piston was hitting the direct injector there are other problems making a rebuild more complex as well.

Good thing everything has worked out.

Long block basically comes assembled almost drop in. Short block means the dealer has to transfer parts from the old and leaves more room for mistakes to happen or just plain old crap gettin in where it shouldn't.

It's common practice with Subaru to replace short blocks when there is an issue. Since there is no cylinder head damage reported, there is no need to replace them as well. All the technician has to do is ensure that the mating surfaces are clean, that the gasket seats properly, that the head bolts/studs are torqued down properly and that the timing is set. They probably have a dedicated technician or two to do engine work; that type of thing doesn't just go to the rookie hourly tech.

We've seen how well dealerships can replace the timing covers and cam gears with this car already...

True. Dealer service is pretty appalling across the board. Makes it tough for the average consumers, above and beyond the price of dealer service.

Come to Mass; we'll take care of you? Dunno what to tell ya.

This is why you never tell the dealer what you were doing when the problem occors. Just describe the symptoms of the problem. If you don't give them a backstory they won't go searching so a solution based on that.

If they ask when it started just say "not sure."

Subaru (and I imagine Toyota with the twins) doesn't offer long blocks. Subaru doesn't even offer assembled heads, for that matter. I do understand where you're coming from now, though. :)

Don't know about the twins but I know Toyota offers long blocks. I've made more than a few over the years

I lived in Mass. for two years. Nice buncha guys. :D


But I recall hearing my then-Mazda dealer's Service Manager tell me that the reason I wouldn't have my car back for a few months was because they were "waiting for parts from Japan." Japan, huh? For a main seal? Japan? Right.

Did you hear that story on NPR yesterday about Congress mandating that all vehicles have data recording devices, so that accidents can be investigated by law enforcement (and insurance companies). Many cars already have these devices on board, but consumers are not told that their data is being collected. And this data is different from a history of error codes.

Yes, really three choices here

• long block
• short block
• tear apart existing short block and replace only rod bearing or whatever is damaged, and reassemble original damaged internals and short block

First bullet - this is super overkill. I wouldn't do that if I was a dealership and I consider myself a pretty fair guy.

Second bullet - while you do need to take off heads and bolt on ancillaries... It is relatively straight forward even for a dealership.

Comparing third bullet to second bullet. Second bullet Is much, much, much safer/easier to do than compared to the third bullet!!!

Yeah, every FR-S/BRZ has one. I'm not sure what that has to do with I was saying though. I've known about it for years.

I believe somewhere in the manual it mentions that this information is to be used only by the repair shop for diagnostic purposes.

I would like to know were the F it is so i can promptly remove it. Having any form of data recording device in a vehicle i purchase should 100% be disclosed to me before i purchase the vehicle.

So, there was mention of the piston hitting one of the direct injectors.... i don't see how that could happen unless the bearing was completely gone.. even then... isnt the injector in the roof of the combustion chamber between the intake valves.... that sounds sketch to me and I would personally be very worried about metal debris in the oil system... ad if the piston was hitting the injector the piston needs to be replaced as well, not just a rod bearing...

OP, i wish you the best of luck man.

It's in the SRS control unit. Of course, if you remove it, you will no longer have functioning airbags...

Furthermore, the data stored in that unit is YOUR property. The only way the dealership or manufacturer can legally access it is if you give them permission, or law enforcement has a warrant, or a court subpoenas the information.

You'd want to get a cover for that hole from removing the resonator, air sucked into there isn't filtered by the air filter and you may have dust and stuff sucked in.

"legally" being the key word.... I guess i'll start investigating to see if the recording function can be shut off...big brother needs to stay the F out of my car. :offtopic:

If they illegally access the data, you can probably sue the everloving crap out of them. Technically, I believe it is also a criminal offense and could be prosecuted under "hacking" laws.

What that has to do with what you were saying:

There will come a time when the dealer won't have to ask you anything. Indeed, maybe we're there now.


[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Event_data_recorder"]Event data recorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

Right, but the OP said something about following a snow plow in the snow and the dealer goes "oh shit hydrolock". How does this black box know it's snowing and your following a snow plow?

As long as you're not being negligent with your speed and you haven't modified the car what can the black box show that would void a warranty claim?

Although we're a bit off-topic now, I'd like to point out a very important paragraph in the BRZ owner's manual concerning the EDR for all you paranoid people:

If I may add one more tidbit to this side-conversation...

A few years back I was taking my BMW in to be serviced and I made a comment about how much technology had advanced when the "technician" took my key, stuck it in a reader box and was able to get all kinds of data off of it including ECU logs!

He told me about a warrantee claim that was made a few months earlier over a brand new 7-series that a dad bought for his son. It was returned a few months earlier with a blown transmission. The "technician" said when he inserted the key from the car, he was able to tell that the car was moving at 70mph at full throttle when the car was shifted into reverse. He was quite proud of himself for being able to deny the warrantee claim due to abuse.

Anyway, just thought that I would share.

Scott

@Blaine&Andrew:

I am not an expert on this. However, my understanding is that a Congressman in Massachusetts and the ACLU are upset about EDRs, and they want to make sure there is legislation to protect the consumer because, as pointed out above, you own the data. Also, because of First Amendment rights.

My understanding is also that the EDR is like a "black box" recorder on an aircraft. It is logging data of a kind above and beyond error codes, including what's going on in the cabin (e.g., whether or not there is a passenger sitting on the passenger seat).

Could they tell there was a snowplow on the road at the time of the incident? I don't know. Can some cars tell where the curb is and park themselves? Yes.

EDRs basically record telemetry in the event of a crash; or at least that's what we're told they record. Some cars record different data, as evidenced by the BMW 7 series warranty claim above.

In any case, you don't have to be a paranoid conspiracy theorist to want to be the one who controls the data, i.e. where is goes and what it's used for.

I very much agree, but let's talk about rod knock and the dealer trying to screw this guy instead of EDRs.