This is satire, right?

What? No its not... No one is running a low boost turbo setup making only 210-215whp...lol Its 10-15whp more than a FBO E85 1Gen.. The 2Gen is great if you have a stock or near stock Gen1 and want to upgrade for a similar yet better experience.

What other normally aspirated, 2+2 or even just 2 seaters under 2800 lbs cars are coming with a dedicated rear wheel drive chassis? Because I'd be highly interested. Next MX5 is most likely electric or hybrid. Next Elise will be electric. Zs are too heavy and more GT cars. So this might be it. And they nailed it. Why that's a problem for some is beyond me. It's not like it's fast. A Pacifica minivan smoked me at the light and I don't even think she was paying attention. But it does hold a 2nd gear slide much better now and with ease. So sliding the car around is now even more fun. Awesome.[/QUOTE]
The reference was that if a 2012 Camry could beat the FRS a 2022 one still can with the GR.

The "problem" that I have is the fact that some people can not get over the very thought that many many owners were, and still are, very happy with their first gen cars. Of course the second gen are better. They bloody well had to be. This condescending throwing around of statements such as " no amount of envy", "only reason one would prefer the old..." and "Nice attempt to convince yourself..." is pure bullshit. Great you have the increases you want but that does not mean the first gen suddenly become trash. They are still a very capable car in the hands of anybody that actually can drive them.

Ideally I will take my 2nd gen and turn it into a track car in a few years, but heck if a well sorted 1st gen track car became available near me, I would have to put very serious consideration into it.

What does a Camry have to do with anything? And fantastic. You love your gen 1. We know. Im being an ass because i've had both. And it is a disservice to the OP by anyone lying to him about which engine is more refined and better. Nobody cares about gen 1 insecurity. Because it's a car. And gen 1 buyers trying to confirm their bias helps no one either. Your ego is not attached to your car so grow up...

I have a 2013 with 77000 kms and 276 whp/209 tq and yes it peaks higher up. But it's still faster than the FA24, so I'm ok. The car would never be offered stock at that power so if I wanted it I had to put it together. The new model is really nice and I especially like the GR86 but my car satisfies the need to exceed what a factory would offer. Being all black and dark, my car is sort of like Darth Vader lol. I'll creep up to a gen 2 and roll down the window and yell, "Luke, I am your father!" :burnrubber:

:bellyroll::bellyroll::bellyroll:

That’s some weapons grade copium right there.

I admit I threw out the joke about Tcoat saying his 2020 is obsolete, but that was meant in good fun and was (I hope) obvious sarcasm. Let’s not let this thread devolve into another ‘reasons why I like my car better than yours’ thread.

The FA24 is better than the FA20, but it didn’t make the ZN6/ZC6 any worse. They’re still fantastic cars and you have every right to still like them as much as you did a year ago. You don’t need excuses.

To Op’s question, no, it is not more refined. It still sounds like it is going to explode, and when idling you get concerned if it is disassembling itself or it is an european engine form 80s.
You should drive one and see if it still bothers you, because I think the problem was when it was about to explode and you felt that there was not enough power, the bump on power may change your perception now.

In the end, try it and see how goes for you.

All I can say is I am really glad I bought into the concept early. When I say "concept", what I really mean is the bare architecture of the vehicle.

Toyota and Subaru are able to give you MORE and updated content for what equates to having increased pricing something like 2.6% per year from the initial 2013 release year. That's progress for sure and an extremely attractive proposition for anyone in a position to purchase one.

Relating back to the basic architecture, take out the enhanced electronics and the increased cylinder bore and the restyled stuff and it's really still mostly the same car. Mine is so far from its stock form when I bought it that it would be unfair to try to compare to a gen 2. But on all metrics it will outperform a gen 1 in stock form and perhaps this time the manufacturers want a little bigger piece of the overall pie and possibly leave less on the table for the aftermarket.

I'm hanging on to my FR-S. The age of gas powered sports cars is coming to a close and as long as gas is attainable I'd like to be able to enjoy it. My initial outlay might have seemed foolish, but I consider this car a classic and the average cost of ownership per year drops dramatically provided the car is in good condition. Heck, I'm not even at the spark plug replacement yet and going on tenth season on April.

This car is a ton of fun to drive, and while I wouldnt say no to more power and torque, it really doesn’t need it. I’ve owned and driven much more powerful and expensive cars, and this is a really great car.

The immediate responsiveness of the NA engine is super rewarding.

Well a bit, but this is not. I went and looked at one, as I had to get a new fuel pump. A white one and really its not as nice. The ass on a 1st gen is much nicer. The front as well, and I hate the thing under the door. ;)

2nd G has to be better than 1G. PERIOD.
nobody will buy 2nd G if it's no better and no improvement over 1 G.
Look at Miata. people still love 1st gen of 90s to late 90s over 00~current

I am still hanging on to my 13 BRZ. I probably wont trade it for 2nd G either.
I'll rather spend $$ to different car

Not being more refined doesn’t mean not being better. It is way better.

And I like the lack of refinement in this car, it suits well for the character. It not boring and now has enough power (ok, still needs e85)