Two schools of thoughts Miata and 86

[Th3rdSun]

Originally Posted by sal

I'm hoping the second generation 86/BRZ has an increase in power. The car needs at least 240hp to make it feel quick(er).

Wouldn't the new Toyota 86 be considered second gen? If so,you can kiss your hopes for more power goodbye,as it's only getting a gain of 2hp.

[DAEMANO]

Originally Posted by Th3rdSun

Wouldn't the new Toyota 86 be considered second gen? If so,you can kiss your hopes for more power goodbye,as it's only getting a gain of 2hp.

The new 86 is what is lovingly referred to as a Mid-Cycle (Generational) Refresh or Facelift. This term has in the past had a negative connotation associated with it due to manufacturer designed tacky body modifications and a higher MSRP. Thankfully we got relevant upgrades to go with our tacky body mods. A true Gen 2 would have significant changes up to and including a new or redesigned chassis, power plant and body.

[Mr.Impreza]

Originally Posted by sal

ND Owner and Previous 86 Owner here.

Still have alot of love for these cars. I purchased an ND seeking what my previous 86 offered me. I traded in brand new IS350 F Sport not even owning it for a full year. (AUTO FKN BLOWS)

The ND is definitley quicker than the FRS/BRZ. The reason? Short gear ratios and TORQUE. This car scales at less than 2300lbs so lightness is also a factor too.

The Miata is basically an FRS with no rear seats, more torque and can go topless in a matter of seconds.

I'm hoping the second generation 86/BRZ has an increase in power. The car needs at least 240hp to make it feel quick(er).

The Miata is awesome, post so pics

Regarding power, i totally agree. 220-240hp NA is a sweet spot for these cars. It would be great if the car came with that much power from the factory instead of having to go stage 2 with cat-less headers and dealing with noise and smell.

I'm personally happy and satisfied with the stage 1 tune, but more is always welcomed

Regarding a 2nd gen I don't think we will get one. I believe sales will keep falling since Toyota & Subaru did nothing to attract new or previous buyers with the refresh.

All the hype is dying down and enthusiasts that wanted one have one.

These are my thoughts anyways...

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by Mr.Impreza

The Regarding a 2nd gen I don't think we will get one. I believe sales will keep falling since Toyota & Subaru did nothing to attract new or previous buyers with the refresh.

I'm not sure, with the economy being much better than 8 years ago as a factor, I think a second gen is on the books.

Toyota wants its S-FR(miata) >> 86(BRZ) >> Supra(BMW Z5) lineup. Maybe with even a Celica (a cheaper, bare bones Supra) in there. If the market doesn't allow for it they might merge the S-FR and 86 into one car, not sure where that leaves Subaru. Maybe they can build the BRZ alone and share more components with the WRX?

-Josh

[sal]

Originally Posted by Mr.Impreza

The Miata is awesome, post so pics

Regarding power, i totally agree. 220-240hp NA is a sweet spot for these cars. It would be great if the car came with that much power from the factory instead of having to go stage 2 with cat-less headers and dealing with noise and smell.

I'm personally happy and satisfied with the stage 1 tune, but more is always welcomed

Regarding a 2nd gen I don't think we will get one. I believe sales will keep falling since Toyota & Subaru did nothing to attract new or previous buyers with the refresh.

All the hype is dying down and enthusiasts that wanted one have one.

These are my thoughts anyways...

Second gen is already in development, Tetsuya-Tada has already confirmed it and Subaru is on board.

The Miata is a more mature oriented group of buyers. 86/BRZ demographics are everywhere. believe me, I sell this car lol.

Some pics of the Miata:







Exhaust has been upgraded, Coils and Wheels to be swapped next year.

[Braces]

Miata is a roadster. 86 is a coupe. 2 different animals.

As for a 2nd gen. I still believe a small power jump along with bigger wheels and tires will be necessary to keep people interested.

Off topic. But recently saw a posted camo version of the Ft-1 (Supra) and I'm disappointed. I'm hoping it will look better. Not happy that Toyota puts out this exciting FT1 concept and then reality steps in with a somewhat vanilla looking car.

[Mr.Impreza]

Originally Posted by sal

Second gen is already in development, Tetsuya-Tada has already confirmed it and Subaru is on board.

The Miata is a more mature oriented group of buyers. 86/BRZ demographics are everywhere. believe me, I sell this car lol.

Some pics of the Miata:







Exhaust has been upgraded, Coils and Wheels to be swapped next year.

Such a beautiful car! I love the way these look. I wouldn't touch the exterior, think it looks perfect but hey, your car, have fun with it!

I know you got an exhaust already, but Fujitsubo also makes one

Yeah I'll take your word for it regarding demographics haha.

P.s You know how lucky you are! You don't have to do badge swaps anymore LOL.....I've spent so much time and money removing Scion from this car haha...still need to get the oem toyota center caps and finally done.& Yes I'm keeping the oem wheels...i actually like them a lot and overall like the car in stock form from the exterior so want to keep it looking clean.

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

I'm not sure, with the economy being much better than 8 years ago as a factor, I think a second gen is on the books.

Toyota wants its S-FR(miata) >> 86(BRZ) >> Supra(BMW Z5) lineup. Maybe with even a Celica (a cheaper, bare bones Supra) in there. If the market doesn't allow for it they might merge the S-FR and 86 into one car, not sure where that leaves Subaru. Maybe they can build the BRZ alone and share more components with the WRX?

-Josh

Who knows...maybe your right....the S-FR would be cool!

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by sal

Second gen is already in development, Tetsuya-Tada has already confirmed it and Subaru is on board.

That's awesome.
I'm thinking it'd be great if they kept the weight low, maybe even get down to 1200kg. Tightening emissions could force their hand to get into a turbo motor. They could destroke the FA to 1.8, slap a small and responsive turbo on it and have it make ~250 hp?

That'd be a fun package IMO, and being turbocharged usually means that ecu tunes can produce significantly better gains, so 300hp with a tune could be feasable.

[krayzie]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

I'm not sure, with the economy being much better than 8 years ago as a factor, I think a second gen is on the books.

Toyota wants its S-FR(miata) >> 86(BRZ) >> Supra(BMW Z5) lineup. Maybe with even a Celica (a cheaper, bare bones Supra) in there. If the market doesn't allow for it they might merge the S-FR and 86 into one car, not sure where that leaves Subaru. Maybe they can build the BRZ alone and share more components with the WRX?

-Josh

But the economy isn't really better than 8 years ago it's actually much worse now globally and especially in Japan.

I think it will depend on whether their other sports car models will sell, otherwise what happened around Y2K will happen again (when most of the Japanese sports compacts started to disappear).

Nevermind the small displacement turbo, the 2nd gen twins could very well be a hybrid.

[daiheadjai]

Originally Posted by Braces

Miata is a roadster. 86 is a coupe. 2 different animals.

As for a 2nd gen. I still believe a small power jump along with bigger wheels and tires will be necessary to keep people interested.

Off topic. But recently saw a posted camo version of the Ft-1 (Supra) and I'm disappointed. I'm hoping it will look better. Not happy that Toyota puts out this exciting FT1 concept and then reality steps in with a somewhat vanilla looking car.

I'm sure they would do something to address the power "deficit" in the 2nd gen... Probably something like 20hp would be sufficient.

As for the Supra, keep in mind that's a heavily-camoflauged mule, including fake cladding. The FT1 was so well-received, there's no way they'd deviate too far from it.

I'm concerned about the lack of SF-R news though...

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[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by krayzie

But the economy is actually much worse now globally and especially in Japan.

Fair enough, I'll give you that. I was trying to rationalize North American demand.

Originally Posted by krayzie

Nevermind the small displacement turbo, the 2nd gen twins could very well be a hybrid.

That would kill it for me, a battery pack would push the car over 3000lbs very quick...

Originally Posted by daiheadjai

I'm concerned about the lack of SF-R news though...

Yea same here..

-Josh

[Quentin]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

Fair enough, I'll give you that. I was trying to rationalize North American demand.



That would kill it for me, a battery pack would push the car over 3000lbs very quick...



Yea same here..

-Josh

In the Camry hybrid, the battery pack bumps the weight by less than 200lbs. I'm sure they would focus on weight reduction if they made the twins with supplementary electric power.


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[darthpnoy1984]

The Twins really need a hot version of the car at 2.5L, update the 6 speed AT to 8 speed from the RC-F coupe or RC200T is all that it frankly needs.

[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by darthpnoy1984

The Twins really need a hot version of the car at 2.5L, update the 6 speed AT to 8 speed from the RC-F coupe or RC200T is all that it frankly needs.

Nobody has every thought that before. Nobody ever.