2017 civic Si vs....

[johan]

Originally Posted by KR-S 86

It isn't given a K designation, but how much do the F20C and F22C motors have in common with the K-series line? I was always under the impression that it was somehow related to the K-series.

F20C motor was designed in the mid 90's (launched in 99). It was basically an iteration from the H22A. They used the FRM sleeves from the H22, changed the head design to use a timing chain and roller rockers (and the motor spins the opposite direction), decreased the displacement (then obviously increased it again for America due to bitchy journalists), made most of it forged and away they went.

K20A2 iterated from there, ditched the FRM because it's expensive and unneeded, kept the timing chain and roller rockers, used cheaper materials throughout (as their target chassis was $10k less expensive) and then added variable cam phasing on the intake cam to fix the midrange torque.

So yes, they are definitely related, but still - neither were ever sold in a RWD coupe

[brzaapi]

Originally Posted by johan

This has been the case for the last 15 years.

- They could have, but never did, put the J series in a RWD platform. It's an excellent, revvy V6.

- They could have (and fucking should have), put SHAWD in a sportscar. 4-cylinder or 6 cylinder, I don't care. Why the fuck didn't they do it!?!?! It was world beating AWD technology and they just relegated it to stupid overweight sedans/suvs.

- The most glaring stupidity is that the K20 never made it into anything RWD. One of the most gloriously engineered motors ever produced - and all it ever saw was FWD. Just mind boggling.

There was so much opportunity, and they just didn't seize any of it. It hurts my insides. Oh the cars we could have / should have experienced. UGH.

Hmmmm, all good points. And there is/was most certainly a market, an emerging market in the states for these kind of cars. Well, at least for practical AWD hot hatch(sedans too).

And nothing against Subaru or Mitsubishi or Ford, but I would like to have seen a Honda team create something around those Honda engines.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by johan

I think I've just gone past hope, to jaded. It's not a feeling I like having.

Would I love for Honda to build something reasonably priced, RWD, 2 doors, coupelike - yes - I would. Would I buy said car - most likely - yes, I would. But Honda hasn't built a RWD coupe that wasn't an NSX since the old S600. So... it's not going to happen. I like the S2000 a lot, I owned one for a short time, but I can't own one again. I'm too tall, I didn't fit in there, and I wouldn't fit in a new one either. I need a coupe, for my safety.

I'm right there with you. One reason I sold my S2000 was that with it's stock roll bars I wasn't allowed at some race tracks, and at the ones I was I didn't feel especially safe. The top of my helmet was a good 1-2 inches above the top of the roll bars, so one can only imagine what would have happened were I to flip it...And any aftermarket roll bar that I installed would have been too tall for the convertible top to accommodate.

Sigh

[LOLS2K]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Ya but is a world where even a Prius looks like it wants to devour your children it is sort of the norm.

My wife and I love the Prius prime, too! We almost got into one over the 4Runner

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by LOLS2K

My wife and I love the Prius prime, too! We almost got into one over the 4Runner

We looked at them when shopping for the wife's new car (I wanted her out of SUVs). She said no way before we even got within 20 feet of it. I breathed a huge sigh of relief and we headed to Subaru.

[LOLS2K]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

We looked at them when shopping for the wife's new car (I wanted her out of SUVs). She said no way before we even got within 20 feet of it. I breathed a huge sigh of relief and we headed to Subaru.

They're definitely not for everyone. My "traded my kouki 86 for a Prius" thread would have been highly entertaining!

[accel]

Originally Posted by RedGlare

what about stock for stock autocross / general performance?

Twins are RWD with LSD.

Civic FWD and isn't light anymore. Do the stock it with LSD?

[johan]

Originally Posted by accel

Twins are RWD with LSD.

Civic FWD and isn't light anymore. Do the stock it with LSD?

Si / Type-R both have an LSD.

[WolfpackS2k]

English bro, do you speak it?

[dostoyevsky]

I'm sorry but imo at the end of the say it's still a *civic*

[funwheeldrive]

Originally Posted by dostoyevsky

I'm sorry but imo at the end of the say it's still a *civic*

This is coming from a Dart owner?

[LOLS2K]

Originally Posted by funwheeldrive

This is coming from a Dart owner?

[dostoyevsky]

Originally Posted by funwheeldrive

This is coming from a Dart owner?

I ditched that car 2 months ago, I drive a 2017 brz now. I didn't know shit about cars back when I got it. The car served me well tho, But it was trash. It was my first car

[funwheeldrive]

Originally Posted by dostoyevsky

I ditched that car 2 months ago, I drive a 2017 brz now. I didn't know shit about cars back when I got it. The car served me well tho, But it was trash. It was my first car

Sounds like you still have a little left to learn.


The new Civic is a great car, and while the Si isn't a sports car it will likely be faster than the 86. Not to mention cheaper, more economical, more practical, with a better interior. Just because it's a Civic doesn't mean it's a bad car.