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Old 01-16-2018, 08:36 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OND View Post
In addition to all the things mentioned:

- Gravity bombing in space --> Mmm no

- Leia's sudden competence in using the force --> how?

- Luke's explanation of force to Rey --> too Disney

- Total emasculation of the pilot dude and the lesb vibes between Leia and Holdo --> just to gain SJW popularity or what?

- MOST IMPORTANTLY: There used to be a rationality vs emotion struggle that defined light and dark side which made Star Wars a philosophically interesting watch for me. That is completely replaced by the classic good vs bad bullshit in this film. Rey I'd say is way too emotional to stay on the light side for long, but we'll see..

To sum up, it was good entertainment, but it wasnt good Star Wars for me and I am by no means a Star Wars geek, so I can definitely understand the frustration of hardcore fans.

Let me do some 'splainin'

1. "Bombs" are gravity in atmosphere and guided in space. Idea of Space Bombers in Star Wars is a Lucas thing and goes back long before Disney. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Bomber

2. Leia has been force sensitive since Episode 3 (and perhaps even earlier), and discovered that Luke was her brother in that same trilogy. So at this point she has had 20-30 years to train her force powers. She's not a Jedi, but many force wielders are not. Just an incredibly powerful Force user.

"Luke, don't talk that way. You have a power that I don't understand and can never have."
"You're wrong, Leia. You have that power, too. In time, you will learn to use it as I have. The Force is strong in my family. My father has it. I have it. And… my sister has it. Yes. It's you, Leia." ―Leia Organa and Luke Skywalker[src]

3. Many YouTube reviewers think this movies explanation of the Force has been the best ever. I loved it. As with anything, opinions vary.

4. Pilot dude (Po) was simply wrong about Holdo & Leia's plan. He didn't trust that they had something in mind. Both Leia and Holdo knew Holdo was going to have to sacrifice her life to pilot the cruiser into the Dreadnought so the escape pods could make the planet. They simply could not tell Po who had to learn the hard way (by his own actions) that the rank of Captain didn't entitle him to need to know info of the Admiralty. Also he learned that a leader must know when to fight and when to run.

5. No Lesbo vibes at all. Holdo & Leia were lifelong friends (as good as sisters.) Who fought alongside each other for decades. They both knew Holdo was going to give her life for the rebellion so the love portrayed in the film were the final sisterly feelings between to people that truly believed in each other and their cause. Hang up the SJW business on this one dude. They are sisters-in-arms. It was about patriotism, shared cause, and friendship. If it's ok in "Band of Brothers", it's ok here too.

THE MOST IMPORTANTLY PART - The binary lightside vs. darkside is simplistic and doesn't really reflect life's true conflicts. The direction Star Wars is going is to show those gray areas where emotional and intellectual conflict exists. Old Star Wars and legacy fans loved the characters that were defined in that old light/dark jedi/sith paradigm. The problem was if Star Wars continued down that path, they would have to keep retelling the old story but just with new characters (ie Kylo Ren in a pseduo Darth Vader helmet.) He had to smash it to become something new. His own soldier, and leader to fight his own war.

Some people always want to hear their favorite band play the same tunes at every concert. To move ahead and make new art is always the Artist conundrum. Really though in life we are often faced with that very question. What of the past has to be let go to make room for the possibilities of the future?
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Old 01-16-2018, 09:55 PM   #30
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Eh, the bombs were sitting on a rack and there was no actuator to give the first motion whatsoever, so im not sure im buying that. Edit: Actually magnetic actuation makes sense, so ok ill give them that.

The other points i can understand, although i could probably do more reading first.

About the most important part, it was never binary to begin with. That was the whole thing about force balance. It was also not as simple as good vs bad though. I could definitely tell there were two different philosophies at work and i could find things i could relate to in both sides. Not with this one.

The new movie is a diverse population of oppressed people “resisting” against a white population of oppressors (you cant tell me the empire officers dont look like nazis). To me thats just scoring easy sjw points by telling the same old story, only in space this time.

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Old 01-16-2018, 10:06 PM   #31
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Old 01-17-2018, 02:13 AM   #32
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I'm ah thinken that some of you folks are thinking waaaay too hard about that movie, to have just sat back and enjoyed it ......




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Old 01-17-2018, 02:40 AM   #33
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What I want to know is how did the rebel cruiser have enough fuel left to make that kamikaze hyperspace jump when the entire movie was focused on, for the first time in Star Wars history, "omg we don't have enough fuel to do this." I mean the ship was supposedly running on fumes and she had enough to turn it around and make the jump? Not buying it.

Also how did Rey get back on the Millennium Falcon? And how was the Falcon able to do all the things it did after the Porgs totally ruined the ship? I mean the Falcon has historically run like garbage, and they made a point of showing porgs nesting on it and making a mess of things but there weren't any problems? It's not a Star Wars movie if the Falcon doesn't have some sort of mechanical issue.
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Old 01-17-2018, 02:45 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humfrz View Post
I'm ah thinken that some of you folks are thinking waaaay too hard about that movie, to have just sat back and enjoyed it ......




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Eh I'd say it's a question of investment. As a film by itself I'm sure it was just fine. The problem is when some people have spent time immersed in the universe, like by reading books or playing the video games that are now considered as *not* canon.

It's not that the movie is bad per se, but it doesn't fit our perspective as well.

But on the other hand, my personal feeling past history with books/whatnot aside is that it just wasn't that good.

Opinions are like asses, everybody has 'em.
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Old 01-17-2018, 02:47 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brink View Post
What I want to know is how did the rebel cruiser have enough fuel left to make that kamikaze hyperspace jump when the entire movie was focused on, for the first time in Star Wars history, "omg we don't have enough fuel to do this." I mean the ship was supposedly running on fumes and she had enough to turn it around and make the jump? Not buying it.

Also how did Rey get back on the Millennium Falcon? And how was the Falcon able to do all the things it did after the Porgs totally ruined the ship? I mean the Falcon has historically run like garbage, and they made a point of showing porgs nesting on it and making a mess of things but there weren't any problems? It's not a Star Wars movie if the Falcon doesn't have some sort of mechanical issue.
Eh I don't think there's much issue with the fuel thing. They didn't have the fuel for a sizable enough jump to run away. But she just hyperjumped it in-system rather than to a separate one. Stuff like that, at least in the old books, is pretty doable.
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Old 01-17-2018, 02:49 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brink View Post
What I want to know is how did the rebel cruiser have enough fuel left to make that kamikaze hyperspace jump when the entire movie was focused on, for the first time in Star Wars history, "omg we don't have enough fuel to do this." I mean the ship was supposedly running on fumes and she had enough to turn it around and make the jump? Not buying it.

Also how did Rey get back on the Millennium Falcon? And how was the Falcon able to do all the things it did after the Porgs totally ruined the ship? I mean the Falcon has historically run like garbage, and they made a point of showing porgs nesting on it and making a mess of things but there weren't any problems? It's not a Star Wars movie if the Falcon doesn't have some sort of mechanical issue.
If I recall proper, the cruiser had enough fuel for one more hyperspace jump, but the bad guys could just track it and when ran out of gas, it would be defenseless.

But, I could be wrong ...... I can't hear much in movie theaters and I nod off a lot ......


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Old 01-17-2018, 02:52 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humfrz View Post
If I recall proper, the cruiser had enough fuel for one more hyperspace jump, but the bad guys could just track it and when ran out of gas, it would be defenseless.

But, I could be wrong ...... I can't hear much in movie theaters and I nod off a lot ......


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They had enough for one more jump...at the start of the chase. Then they spent the entire movie on a chase scene where the other 2 rebel ships involved ran out of fuel and the remaining cruiser was running on fumes and had already transferred most of its fuel to the transports which were then (most of them) blown up. And yet the cruiser still had enough fuel to burn on turning around and making that final jump.
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Old 01-17-2018, 03:00 AM   #38
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They had enough for one more jump...at the start of the chase. Then they spent the entire movie on a chase scene where the other 2 rebel ships involved ran out of fuel and the remaining cruiser was running on fumes and had already transferred most of its fuel to the transports which were then (most of them) blown up. And yet the cruiser still had enough fuel to burn on turning around and making that final jump.
Oh, OK ......maybe she switched over to a reserve tank ..... or, more likely, that was one of the times I nodded off.......hey! THAT was yesterday ...... my short term memory ain't so good no more ......

Time for my meds.


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Old 01-17-2018, 03:30 AM   #39
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It was called "The Last Jedi" because it's the last Jedi movie I'm going to see in the theater. A movie like this I can watch at home with fast forward whenever I want. Which would be somewhat often. Please don't show me a movie where I'm going to feel bored. There's so much good TV out there. Why can't they make a movie that's equally as tight?

I mean, for fuck's sake, the Abrams movie was better. I've never said that before!
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Old 01-17-2018, 11:19 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DAEMANO View Post
..."Bombs" are gravity in atmosphere and guided in space. Idea of Space Bombers in Star Wars is a Lucas thing and goes back long before Disney. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Bomber ....
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Eh, the bombs were sitting on a rack and there was no actuator to give the first motion whatsoever, so im not sure im buying that. Edit: Actually magnetic actuation makes sense, so ok iill give them that.
Actually, gravity bombs have nothing to do with atmosphere. You could very easily drop a gravity bomb from space, it just requires a lot of math. The Apollo 13 return to Earth was, for all intents and purposes, a "gravity bomb". The question would be does the ship have enough mass to exert enough gravitational pull to cause the bombs to fall towards it.

The magnetic actuation seems a more likely solution for low gravity scenarios though. The rails could easily provide the initial propulsion for a bomb in space I would think, and they are going to travel straight, hence having to be directly over the target. If it is rails though, it seems they could have traveled a lot faster.
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Old 02-14-2018, 07:57 PM   #41
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well..

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I gave this movie a 5.5/10 or so. Plot holes, useless subplots, only some character development, not enough plot development, too much unnecessary humor (especially during scenes that needed gravitas and had it ripped away by jokes). In general just so many missed opportunities.

I'm a huge book universe fan but wanted this to succeed and was willing to give it a chance because I thought episode 7 was a solid 7/10 (no pun intended).

If you're a book universe fan then at least you should know that Luke didn't die. In fact, he's the only one to have come back to physical form from ethereal form in the book universe...

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Old 02-14-2018, 08:01 PM   #42
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If you're a book universe fan then at least you should know that Luke didn't die. In fact, he's the only one to have come back to physical form from ethereal form in the book universe...

Jaden
I had no complaints in that comment about Luke and what happened to him. Not sure where you got that from.
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