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Engine, Exhaust, Transmission Discuss the FR-S | 86 | BRZ engine, exhaust and drivetrain.


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Old 06-22-2012, 11:24 AM   #141
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That would suck if the ECU is found to be self-correcting. It basically means an ECU Tune pretty much required to see un-corrected gains on intake/header/axleback for those who aren't doing them all at once. I know we saw a few hp gained already with each and the header giving the most delta hp and that's progress.
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Old 06-22-2012, 12:56 PM   #142
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That would suck if the ECU is found to be self-correcting. It basically means an ECU Tune pretty much required to see un-corrected gains on intake/header/axleback for those who aren't doing them all at once. I know we saw a few hp gained already with each and the header giving the most delta hp and that's progress.
It would be much the same as modding a turbo Subaru, so I'm not put out. One thing to keep in mind is that it's possible there are gains to be had from the tune itself. So going intake/full exhaust/tune might get more gains than just the bolt-ons themselves.

As it is, we're seeing potentially ~24bhp from just bolt-ons and no tune. That's really impressive with cars these days. Adding a tune to stabilize that is worth it alone. Getting another 5-10hp from the tune would be fantastic.
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Old 06-22-2012, 01:02 PM   #143
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It filled in the evil torque void even more, and with header, overpipe/downpipe, and catback, the whole system made 21whp over stock and 15wtq over stock, with 11-15wtq gains in the evil torque valley.
Considering the fact that over time the exhaust and header system will be improved and that the car has the stock intake and tune these are pretty amazing gains. 30hp+ seems like it will be ridiculously easy to achieve with I/H/E and a tune.
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Old 06-22-2012, 02:13 PM   #144
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there isnt a moment when the ecu is not in self learning mode, its always tuning. thats cause it has to take into account weather change, altitude, fuel grade usage, etc...ppl only disconnect the battery cause its a faster way of resetting all the tuning the ecu stored in its memory also known as learned values, but that being said this isnt always the best way to do things as i personally always like to see how the ecu is correcting its values based on mods i do but there are other times where doing the battery disconnect is the way to go.
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Old 06-22-2012, 03:48 PM   #145
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there isnt a moment when the ecu is not in self learning mode, its always tuning. thats cause it has to take into account weather change, altitude, fuel grade usage, etc...ppl only disconnect the battery cause its a faster way of resetting all the tuning the ecu stored in its memory also known as learned values, but that being said this isnt always the best way to do things as i personally always like to see how the ecu is correcting its values based on mods i do but there are other times where doing the battery disconnect is the way to go.
I always disconnect before adding a new modification so the ECU can learn fresh; problem is that (on the WRX anyways) it always learns back to stock or "safer" regardless, without a tune anyway.
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Old 06-22-2012, 05:18 PM   #146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mastertech86 View Post
there isnt a moment when the ecu is not in self learning mode, its always tuning. thats cause it has to take into account weather change, altitude, fuel grade usage, etc...ppl only disconnect the battery cause its a faster way of resetting all the tuning the ecu stored in its memory also known as learned values, but that being said this isnt always the best way to do things as i personally always like to see how the ecu is correcting its values based on mods i do but there are other times where doing the battery disconnect is the way to go.
my comment was because Jason stated that he didn't want to have to drive the car between dynoing different components, and by disconnecting the battery the car will start the learning process over again. I completely agree with you that it is not ideal every time, however in this circumstance it is an option.

George
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Old 06-22-2012, 06:35 PM   #147
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yea it all comes down to you will never see the true potential of your upgrades without a tune cause being the factory ecu is always trying to keep that safe tune in check always tuning itself on the fly your upgrades will although show some gains will never be fully realized

and another thing to consider whenever i watch live data from the ecm, being i work for toyota i can view absolutely everything the ecm does live with our laptops, it only takes about 5-10 seconds for the ecm to start adjusting to any change it sees that could veer away from the tune the ecm wants to see. ill try to take a pick of a live feed and post it up when i can hopefully tomorrow =)
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Old 06-22-2012, 08:58 PM   #148
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I'm sitting on a plane 35k feet up and now I can't wait to get back home to my car to start planning mods. This thread has so much win it should be illegal.
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Old 06-22-2012, 09:08 PM   #149
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ok, just got home from running the car at the car control clinic at PR. It DEFINITELY has more power, and the torque curve feels quite a bit better. The car now feels faster than my 330i
(side note... the car handled AMAZING on the various exercises throughout the day. Every single instructor took a ride in it and asked about it, along with some Toyota employees that were excited to see the mods on it. The car transitions from understeer to oversteer very predictably and it's SO EASY to manage oversteer on this car it's crazy. With the HP+ pads, I was out braking and out maneuvering EVERYONE on the cone courses, even the e90 M3s, and the amateur-ish 911 GT3 car. All eyes were on the BRZ on the skid pad, as it was the easiest to slide/drift predictably, so far all of us amateurs, it was the only car that could really whip it around the cone repeatedly.)

The car sounds amazing. It IS louder, and John/Jason are going to put another resonator on the downpipe to fix the 3500-4000rpm drone that seems to be occurring with the car. The car had a very specific moment when it smoothed out a lot and the exhaust note changed, about 2 hours into the driving event. There was some rasp happening at around that 4000rpm mark, but it seems the ECU has adjusted to the system. It pulls hard, feels good, no check engine lights, and Jason pulled data logging the entire 3 hour drive up here before the event- safe to say, this system feels safe. I ran the car up to redline, and even hit the rev limiter once, all day long. No knocking, weird sounds, power loss, anything. Consider this fully tested, imo.

I've got drive videos from early in the day doing some braking exercises, and some later in the day on the handling oval (and me having a ton of fun oversteering around the corner exit for fun a bunch, haha) that show the difference between before/after the car seemed to adjust, so you can hear that sound difference I am talking about. (and I felt the difference in the pedal/feel of the car too)

Videos will be uploaded and posted tonight, I was running this setup:
"Larger" of the 2 nameless headers, heat wrapped
Nameless overpipe/downpipe combo pipe with cat
Stock midpipe
Nameless axleback

It sounds so wicked.
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Old 06-22-2012, 09:08 PM   #150
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yeah, with the BMW club, doing the car control clinic. I'll do some slow laps on the big boy track at lunch, too. Not sure what time I'll have breaks in between the different clinic activities though. I'm just re-freshing the car control clinic cert on my drivers log with this new car, so I'll be all set for HPDEs next month. Feel free to come by and at least watch! And catch me between excercises.
I didn't get there until 3pm and apparently you had left. The BMW club is great. 2 of the officials are former chief stewards of the ICSCC and guys I race door to door with. Hopefully you asked them some good questions and had a good time even though the weather was awful.




And just to add... F' Seattle and its shi***y weather!
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Old 06-22-2012, 09:30 PM   #151
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aww sad. I was still there- in the corner kinda tucked away talking to Bob from Drift Office- he showed up with his white FR-S, haha.

Small taste captured from one of the vids:




afternoon driving vid... one of two. less rasp. Still needs the resonator, but there was a noticeable difference in sound and feel.
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Old 06-22-2012, 10:01 PM   #152
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Wow. Louder than I expected. Was this filmed before the exhaust note smoothed out?
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Old 06-22-2012, 10:03 PM   #153
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Wow. Louder than I expected. Was this filmed before the exhaust note smoothed out?
yep.


first vid is earlier in the day, 2nd vid (and 3rd one, that is being uploaded) are near the end of the day, after the ECU made more adjustments. It was a very noticeable difference.

that's also why they will be putting a resonator on the midpipe, smooth that out a bit. Not sure if that's going to be a standard fixture on their downpipes or not, but the headers exacerbate the drone.
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Old 06-22-2012, 10:28 PM   #154
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Definitely could not run that exhaust on my daily driver. Many of my customers/clients are not "car people". That would not work.
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