2020 Toyota GR Supra Revealed!

[Irace86.2.0]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmr0voM5dck[/ame]
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I74_kKtJyjs[/ame]

[gymratter]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CeM_UaR2-A[/ame]

[rice_classic]

Another car that will roll into Toyota service bays where the engine is from another manufacturer and techs have it figure everything out. And because it's a BMW engine - they will probably be in those service bays a lot - so I guess the tech's will get familiar with them pretty quick. Silver lining and all...

[OwlDance]

I feel like I'm in the minority when I say I dislike the FT1 concept and prefer the actual thing, as the concept looks like a pseudo supercar when it's not.

The actual model looks like a proper sports car but keeps the crazy curves and design without overdoing it. That is, it actually looks unique without pretending to be something it isn't. Furthermore, concepts are almost always a more exaggerated version (lower ride, bigger wheels, smoother body) of their final form and with that in mind, I think the full model Supra is closer to its outlandish concept than most other vehicles that go from concept to production.

And for the record, I'm getting really sick and tired of the "it's a BMW" talk. Toyota isn't just going to slap its badge onto this and have the dude who developed the ft86 just to have it have the same issues as a BMW. Is it being sourced from BMW a concern for quality? Yeah. Is it the same as a BMW? No way, not until we have the car properly abused by non-corporate drivers can we really say where it stands, but even then I still refuse to believe that it's "just a BMW." The lack of nuance for this sort of blows my mind when it's coming from this forum of all things. W/e. I probably haven't said anything that hasn't been said the past 22 pages in the past four days.

The fact of the matter is, I hope to hell the car is great and that I'd love to at least test drive it, and if it passes the first year or two without major issues, I'll probably snag one eventually. And I have confidence that coming from a Japanese manufacturer, where a feel of a car is as important as the quality and design, (eg, FT86 AT versus typical ATs) that they'll make a decent enough car. But until that happens, I can't pass judgement on the car, and I think that people running around bemoaning it does no one any favors.

[Captain Snooze]

I really don't get the "but it's a BMW engine" thing. Why does it matter whose name is on the block?

[chaoskaze]

Originally Posted by Captain Snooze

I really don't get the "but it's a BMW engine" thing. Why does it matter whose name is on the block?

That's because lot ppl in their 20s and early 30s got one of these thinking they are cheap but actually can't keep them on the road, they thought they can fix most of the small issue of the car inturns of general maintenance.


There are countless examples................ I mean a friend of mine had a beautiful red E46 till he told me that it needs a valve adjustment only to show up 2 weeks later in an infinify. Another friend of mine who is into grassroot racing stuff had a 1 series that she thought she can fix & guess what? .....She sold the car soon after as well. Both of them actually knows about turning a wrench or two, but they simply decided that it cost too much to fix/keep them ....so they all got rid of it.

[DaJo]

It IS just a BMW... Which equates to future failure, poor reliability.

Don't get me wrong... Germans know how to engineer their performance cars, but statistics show over-and-over again that these cars are high maintenance, ticking time bomb.

The only thing Toyota did was design the exterior, tuned their suspension and tweeked the handling dynamics. Everything else is all BMW, which is wrong... Especially if you're going to put a "Supra" nameplate on this, it should have been a pure Toyota from the get-go.

Conclusion: Another great performance car reinvented, but just not a Toyota Supra...


https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-w...sup-1831800550

[chaoskaze]

Originally Posted by DaJo

It IS just a BMW... Which equates to future failure, poor reliability.

Don't get me wrong... Germans know how to engineer their performance cars, but statistics show over-and-over again that these cars are high maintenance, ticking time bomb.

The only thing Toyota did was design the exterior, tuned their suspension and tweeked the handling dynamics. Everything else is all BMW, which is wrong... Especially if you're going to put a "Supra" nameplate on this, it should have been a pure Toyota from the get-go.

Conclusion: Another great performance car reinvented, but just not a Toyota Supra...


https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-w...sup-1831800550

In the intewview Toyota enginner tada san did say they stress test different parts of the entire engine & made improvement on it thou.... So only time will tell now.

[Kodename47]

For those who want to see/hear this on track..... not sure if this was posted before but this was the Europe pre-launch drive.

[ame]http://youtu.be/0OXNHTpkUdA[/ame]

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by chaoskaze

In the intewview Toyota enginner tada san did say they stress test different parts of the entire engine & made improvement on it thou.... So only time will tell now.

I guess BMW wins more of this cooperation. Toyota would have to share some of their methods and their findings and Germans get FINALLY a more reliable unit.

This is what was playing lately in German media:

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by DaJo

It IS just a BMW... Which equates to future failure, poor reliability.

Don't get me wrong... Germans know how to engineer their performance cars, but statistics show over-and-over again that these cars are high maintenance, ticking time bomb.

The only thing Toyota did was design the exterior, tuned their suspension and tweeked the handling dynamics. Everything else is all BMW, which is wrong... Especially if you're going to put a "Supra" nameplate on this, it should have been a pure Toyota from the get-go.

Conclusion: Another great performance car reinvented, but just not a Toyota Supra...


https://jalopnik.com/what-we-found-w...sup-1831800550

Please show me proof of poor reliability on current generation BMW's.

BMW did earn a poor reliability reputation for a while but has since rectified it in the last 5-10 years.

If you cannot provide proof of poor reliability then its all just talk.

Head over to the M240i and M2 forums and you wont find much talk of problems or issues with reliability.

What you will find is tons of people easily modifying their engines and tunes making huge gains with no issues.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Please show me proof of poor reliability on current generation BMW's.

BMW did earn a poor reliability reputation for a while but has since rectified it in the last 5-10 years.

If you cannot provide proof of poor reliability then its all just talk.

Head over to the M240i and M2 forums and you wont find much talk of problems or issues with reliability.

What you will find is tons of people easily modifying their engines and tunes making huge gains with no issues.

There are 100s of places to look up actual reliability stats but of course people's bias will never let them accept them as accurate so they just disregard them.
BMW is certainly below Toyota but still comes in the top 5 for 2018. As you said they have come a long way but the myth will prevail for years as the nay sayers yet again ignore the real numbers.
Nice to note the top vehicles for both Toyota and Subaru (which again people will say is wrong)

[bcj]

You guys who have actually seen the release.
Is there an oil dipstick?

[TommyW]

Well you can buy a 2JZ on ebay for 3k so maybe justs get one of those and install it. You just have to change it back every time you need a smog cert. That BMW motor is pretty reliable actually. While the car may not be what everyone wanted at least there's something new to talk about.

Many here are correct, these cars are more halo cars than anything and barely, if at all profitable even with collaborating with another manufacturer. Starting from scratch and it's nothing but a money pit for Toyota and they're actually in business to turn a profit believe it or not. The proof of the good value\poor value will be in the reviews after there are some actual road tests made. With a new Cayman starting at about 71k for the base, it won't be a direct competitor as many believe. Probably the Nismo Z is closest and you can get it with a manual.

Probably a good question is if Toyota developed their own car with high HP and a more FT1 look and charged 90K ish if it would sell.