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Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting What these cars were built for! |
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08-13-2019, 03:40 PM | #43 |
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Chilling the oil will result in keeping the pressure up. Unless I have been misinformed thus far.
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08-13-2019, 04:12 PM | #44 | |
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I only spent 600 bucks to get the frs wing holes filled and new holes drilled for the ts wing and then paint.. good news if i wanted to sell it. i can do it as a whole piece. the whole car. 20k XD |
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08-13-2019, 06:29 PM | #45 | ||
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Reasons one might *avoid* installing one: $$$$, time, effort expended, overcooling of oil in colder temps, additional potential failure points, fire risk. Quote:
Regarding pressure, here's some data from this thread: https://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91820 Note that while temps are 20-25F cooler with the oil cooler, the pressure is actually the same, ~7.5psi/1000-rpm for 5W30 oil, at ~250F with cooler or at ~272F without the cooler. I.e. any gain in pressure from running cooler oil is lost as pressure drop in the cooler. My oil temps get up to ~272F, but always stabilize and never try to "run away". In my opinion, the NEED for an oil cooler for limited tracking of stockish cars might be overstated... I've mentioned this in other threads, but here it is again for reference only (not saying this definitely means anything for our cars!) here's how Ford characterizes oil temperatures in '18 Mustang Factory Service Manual: 38-60° C (100-140° F) (low) 61-137° C (142-279° F) (normal) 138-146° C (279-295° F) (warm) 147-160° C (297-320° F) (hot) Last edited by ZDan; 08-13-2019 at 06:41 PM. |
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08-13-2019, 06:48 PM | #46 |
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Measure twice (ok three times) CUT ONCE!
Don't add stupid mods that only a high schooler would appreciate, and you will be fine. I screwed my side skirts to my car. There are holes on each side. My front bumper had a lip, I ripped it off; holes there too. Oh well. I also skinned the seats and added leather. It took long enough I would NEVER consider removing it. (I might not actually do it again, it was a PITA!)
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08-13-2019, 10:53 PM | #47 |
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cheaper than me so far! bought a gt-r trunk lid for $600, replacement oem spoiler trunk lid for $300, and i still need to fill and paint it all...
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08-21-2019, 01:10 PM | #48 |
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ummm... use that advice on 270+ oil temps to your own peril.
You're willing to run with risk to your engine and reduced power instead of opting for an oil cooler...? Speaking with guys who deal with oil regularly, sure, you can touch 260+ in a session, maybe even a few times a day. It might not be a big deal, but it does start to break down. You'll want to change the oil when you get home (or run oil that's breaking down already the next time you go out). This is the problem with the internet. Just because someone is willing to risk their own stuff and it has "worked for them" doesn't mean it's a good idea. Get a good oil cooler. Don't run Xw50 oil. Monitor oil temps, and go drive the shit out of the car. |
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08-22-2019, 07:34 AM | #49 | |
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08-22-2019, 11:14 AM | #50 | ||||
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Reduced power, does the ECU pull timing or something? I'd be very interested to see what the actual power loss is. I haven't noticed this at the track. I wonder how many consecutive dyno pulls I'd have to do to get oil temp up to 270F... Quote:
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I would be a lot more worried about this if I saw the oil temp continue to rise, but it always goes to the same temp and then holds. As if it's thermostatically controlled. Quote:
Dry sump is cool but far from fool-proof! I've been at the track where a guy lunched his new engine build due to issues with his dry-sump setup. Oops... I'm all for preventive mods. But you have to weigh risk of doing nothing vs. risk of introducing new problems... Obviously I've decided that for me, the risk of running full synth 5w30 at 270F for ~15-20 minute sessions at the track without an oil cooler is tolerable. |
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08-22-2019, 11:29 AM | #51 |
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Basic thermodynamics: the cooler the heat sink of an internal combustion engine, the more efficient it is (i.e. more power per stroke). I'd be curious to see what's the practical difference between 250F oil and 270–280F oil when it comes to power output though.
Last edited by timurrrr; 08-22-2019 at 11:41 AM. |
08-22-2019, 12:25 PM | #52 | ||
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Quick search result: https://www.hotrod.com/articles/engine-oil-temperature/ As for ultimate power potential, the general consensus among most racers is that hot oil and cool water make more power in most engines. A full-synthetic oil will withstand sump temperatures in excess of 300 degrees, and for hard-core professional racing, some oval-track race teams are experimenting with ultra-thin, specially formulated, race-only synthetics operating at 350 degrees or even higher. Quote:
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08-26-2019, 10:41 AM | #53 | |
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No one is going to force you to do anything. You can convince yourself what's needed or not needed at your own reward or peril.
I convince myself to do different things all the time. GLHF - sometimes everyone says the same thing not because they are all on the bandwagon, but maybe, just maybe, the earth isn't flat. Quote:
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08-26-2019, 10:43 AM | #54 |
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yes, the engine does pull timing. touching those temps is not a big deal, sustaining those temps does break down the oil faster.
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08-26-2019, 12:31 PM | #55 | ||
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1) My indicated oil temp gets to ~272F and stabilizes, does not continue to get hotter. 2) 272F is not a problem for frequently-changed synthetic oil 3) We have data that shows oil pressure running at 270-275F without an oil cooler is the same as running the same oil at 250F *with* an oil cooler. Quote:
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08-26-2019, 01:42 PM | #56 |
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Not exactly sure what my oil temp was but looking at my data on my aim my peak speed on the front strait was pretty consistent all day through all sessions.
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