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Old 02-25-2013, 10:22 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BEERzed View Post
Thanks for your honest response. It is appreciated.

Unfortunately, it means Ecutek is still not for me. I understand the concept of locking out competitors, but really good businesses don't need to do this.

I don't care what software a tuner uses. People who buy a car and own their ecu should have the freedom to choose the best tuner available at the time (without paying a new license fee to Ecutek every time they want to try an Ecutek tuner).

If this is a technical limitation and not a deliberate restraint on customer's choices, then Ecutek need to fix it.

Either way, thanks but it's not for me.
Your not understanding what Im saying.

EcuTek's license lives on the ECU.

If the ecu gets erased, flash fails, or ecu gets replaced then the license is gone.

If you lose a license the EcuTek log file will show that, if the dealer replaces the ecu then you'll have a work order for proof.

In those cases licenses will be replaced.

If your car is flashed with EcuTek any EcuTek dealer with that software suit aka ProECU BRZ/FRS/GT86 can tune the car.

Since EcuTek has years of custom code development work in the ECU they lock it prevent a few different things.

1. Preventing Dealers from Flashing over the ecu
2. Preventing non-EcuTek products from reading out the ecu and potentially stealing their custom code
3. Preventing non-EcuTek products reading out the ecu and exposing tuners hard work.

This is why I suggest everyone to own their own ecutek cable - this gives them the freedom to do what they want.

EcuTek isn't the only company that does this, and to be honest I wouldn't have put 1/16 of the amount of time into my calibrations if i knew someone could suck it out and look at it.

John
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:40 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Visconti View Post
Your not understanding what Im saying.

EcuTek's license lives on the ECU.

If the ecu gets erased, flash fails, or ecu gets replaced then the license is gone.

If you lose a license the EcuTek log file will show that, if the dealer replaces the ecu then you'll have a work order for proof.

In those cases licenses will be replaced.

If your car is flashed with EcuTek any EcuTek dealer with that software suit aka ProECU BRZ/FRS/GT86 can tune the car.

Since EcuTek has years of custom code development work in the ECU they lock it prevent a few different things.

1. Preventing Dealers from Flashing over the ecu
2. Preventing non-EcuTek products from reading out the ecu and potentially stealing their custom code
3. Preventing non-EcuTek products reading out the ecu and exposing tuners hard work.

This is why I suggest everyone to own their own ecutek cable - this gives them the freedom to do what they want.

EcuTek isn't the only company that does this, and to be honest I wouldn't have put 1/16 of the amount of time into my calibrations if i knew someone could suck it out and look at it.

John
Please spare me the sermon. I completely understand everything you've said, even the misleading parts.

If I buy a computer and buy an MS Windows license, I can try Linux and then put Windows back on if I don't like Linux. If I can't do that with Ecutek, it's a limitation of Ecutek, not a feature.

After reading what seems like thousands of posts saying "You can flash back to 100% stock", this is the first time I've seen it admitted that if you do Ecutek may refuse to reinstate your license.

Once it's 100% stock, there's no IP to be "stolen". Hence your points 2 and 3 are not relevant. The refusal or inability to restore the license is therefore of no benefit to the tuner, other than to restrict competition.
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:45 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BEERzed View Post
Please spare me the sermon. I completely understand everything you've said, even the misleading parts.

If I buy a computer and buy an MS Windows license, I can try Linux and then put Windows back on if I don't like Linux. If I can't do that with Ecutek, it's a limitation of Ecutek, not a feature.

After reading what seems like thousands of posts saying "You can flash back to 100% stock", this is the first time I've seen it admitted that if you do Ecutek may refuse to reinstate your license.

Once it's 100% stock, there's no IP to be "stolen". Hence your points 2 and 3 are not relevant. The refusal or inability to restore the license is therefore of no benefit to the tuner, other than to restrict competition.
I said what I said, I've been clear.

If you can provide proof the license has been lost then you'll get another one.

If you lose the license because your screwing around with other software well there's absolutely no guarantees.

Licenses only get replaced when they're proof of loss.

If you don't like it, get a unichip.

Simple as that
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:53 PM   #32
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Thanks for your assistance.

I won't be letting any Ecutek tuners screw around with my ECU.
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Old 02-25-2013, 11:00 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by BEERzed View Post
Thanks for your assistance.

I won't be letting any Ecutek tuners screw around with my ECU.
Hopefully you wont let anyone screw around with your ECU.

I dont know anyone that would want their ecu screwed with.

If your looking for a tune you should get tuned by a experienced person...

But dont kid your self , you'll pay for experience, and delivery of that experience.

-John
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Old 02-26-2013, 07:46 AM   #34
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Just so I'm clear...I have two questions.

I asked earlier if I can flash back to stock for the purpose of warranty work, and then flash my tune back on. So if I'm following this correctly, what I'm really doing is flashing back to a EcuTek version that is a "copy" of the stock settings, which in most cases is not detected by dealer, unless for major warranty work. From there I can then flash back to my custom tune, unless the dealer replaced my ECU, in which case I would need paperwork to get the license dropped back down on the ECU.
Did I get that right?

Second question, again may be a dumb question, but I'm new to this and why I like this forum so much.

What is preventing a person from purchasing a second ECU for the car and swapping them in/out as needed? Or is that not something you can do and why?
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:24 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BEERzed View Post
Please spare me the sermon. I completely understand everything you've said, even the misleading parts.

If I buy a computer and buy an MS Windows license, I can try Linux and then put Windows back on if I don't like Linux. If I can't do that with Ecutek, it's a limitation of Ecutek, not a feature.

After reading what seems like thousands of posts saying "You can flash back to 100% stock", this is the first time I've seen it admitted that if you do Ecutek may refuse to reinstate your license.

Once it's 100% stock, there's no IP to be "stolen". Hence your points 2 and 3 are not relevant. The refusal or inability to restore the license is therefore of no benefit to the tuner, other than to restrict competition.
I don't get the animosity toward John on this. Completely uncalled for I think. If its not for you, its not for you. Done. I also don't get why so many people are weird about their ECU being locked by the tuner. I sure as hell don't want to get in there and mess around with it myself. Most of the EcuTek guys have free tunes for life and I'm even sure anyone of them would Dyno tune for you over IP.

Why would you want to "try" another tune? Just get with your tuner and say, this seems weird. Or I'd like it to do this or that. I'm sure anyone of the EcuTek tuners would be more than happy to oblige. EcuTek in general has all the features I need or will need for my upgrade path. I haven't seen anything non-EcuTek that is mind blowing. Price may be only small complaint but once you have it, you have it. But that being said, the car is so new, you gotta pay to play.
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Old 02-26-2013, 11:47 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by djliquidsteele View Post
I don't get the animosity toward John on this. Completely uncalled for I think. If its not for you, its not for you. Done. I also don't get why so many people are weird about their ECU being locked by the tuner. I sure as hell don't want to get in there and mess around with it myself. Most of the EcuTek guys have free tunes for life and I'm even sure anyone of them would Dyno tune for you over IP.

Why would you want to "try" another tune? Just get with your tuner and say, this seems weird. Or I'd like it to do this or that. I'm sure anyone of the EcuTek tuners would be more than happy to oblige. EcuTek in general has all the features I need or will need for my upgrade path. I haven't seen anything non-EcuTek that is mind blowing. Price may be only small complaint but once you have it, you have it. But that being said, the car is so new, you gotta pay to play.
I don't see anything wrong with what @BEERzed was asking. If anything, I think John was more childish in his responses. However, putting that aside, what did you find wrong with what BEERzed was asking? They're perfectly valid questions.

What if I wasn't 100% satisfied with the ECUTek tune I was given? Let's say I took my car to a tuner shop to have it dyno tuned, to try and get a tad more power squeezed out. This shop uses something other than ECUTek. I decide later that I actually preferred the RaceROM features ECUTek offers, and try to flash back. I already bought the license, I bought the cable, and I bought the generic tune. So, why can't I flash back if I paid for everything?

I tend to agree with BEERzed, that I bought and paid for it...so why can't I experiment with other products and choose what I like the best. We're not stealing anyone's IP. Every tuner shop is going to prefer tuning with software and tools they are most comfortable with. It may not always be ECUTek. So, just because you can't imagine anyone not being happy with ECUTek...that doesn't mean someone else won't.

So, again, I ask you...what was wrong with BEERzed's questions? Where is the animosity you claimed he showed towards JV?
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:25 PM   #37
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Yeah, this is still a little unclear. I know back in the EvoX ecutek days I could flash back a stock ecutek rom and still retain the license, but i think they have changed the license model since then.

So, If i have an ecutek tune and I flash an ecutek provided stock map back into the car:
1. is the license in the ecu retained
2. can the dealer reflash the ecu (lets say a tsb comes out that calls for a reflash before and part replacement). IE, is the ecu unlocked at that point?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Zgrinch View Post
Just so I'm clear...I have two questions.

I asked earlier if I can flash back to stock for the purpose of warranty work, and then flash my tune back on. So if I'm following this correctly, what I'm really doing is flashing back to a EcuTek version that is a "copy" of the stock settings, which in most cases is not detected by dealer, unless for major warranty work. From there I can then flash back to my custom tune, unless the dealer replaced my ECU, in which case I would need paperwork to get the license dropped back down on the ECU.
Did I get that right?

Second question, again may be a dumb question, but I'm new to this and why I like this forum so much.

What is preventing a person from purchasing a second ECU for the car and swapping them in/out as needed? Or is that not something you can do and why?
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:48 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by BEERzed View Post
Please spare me the sermon. I completely understand everything you've said, even the misleading parts.

If I buy a computer and buy an MS Windows license, I can try Linux and then put Windows back on if I don't like Linux. If I can't do that with Ecutek, it's a limitation of Ecutek, not a feature.

After reading what seems like thousands of posts saying "You can flash back to 100% stock", this is the first time I've seen it admitted that if you do Ecutek may refuse to reinstate your license.

Once it's 100% stock, there's no IP to be "stolen". Hence your points 2 and 3 are not relevant. The refusal or inability to restore the license is therefore of no benefit to the tuner, other than to restrict competition.
Wow, if this is true I definitely won't be going with Ecutek...

DRM in my car no thanks.
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:56 PM   #39
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I don't see anything wrong with what @BEERzed was asking. If anything, I think John was more childish in his responses. However, putting that aside, what did you find wrong with what BEERzed was asking? They're perfectly valid questions.

What if I wasn't 100% satisfied with the ECUTek tune I was given? Let's say I took my car to a tuner shop to have it dyno tuned, to try and get a tad more power squeezed out. This shop uses something other than ECUTek. I decide later that I actually preferred the RaceROM features ECUTek offers, and try to flash back. I already bought the license, I bought the cable, and I bought the generic tune. So, why can't I flash back if I paid for everything?

I tend to agree with BEERzed, that I bought and paid for it...so why can't I experiment with other products and choose what I like the best. We're not stealing anyone's IP. Every tuner shop is going to prefer tuning with software and tools they are most comfortable with. It may not always be ECUTek. So, just because you can't imagine anyone not being happy with ECUTek...that doesn't mean someone else won't.

So, again, I ask you...what was wrong with BEERzed's questions? Where is the animosity you claimed he showed towards JV?

BEERzed said please spare me the sermon. Just seems rude. IDK. Must be me. That being said, If wanted to see if I could get someone to squeeze more out of my car, and wanted to have a person there to do it, I would find a local EcuTek tuner or drive to the nearest one with the best reputation. I have a local EcuTek tuner where I'm at and still went with @Visconti because of his reputation in the tuner world. My local tuner has a great reputation but at the time I went with my tune, the weren't and Ecutek dealer. Tp each their own. I'm happy.
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Old 02-26-2013, 12:57 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Visconti View Post
But the current recall replaces the Ecu not flashes

I've had a few customers have their custom tuned ecus replaced under this recall already.
I haven't gotten my recall work done yet since I wasn't exactly sure what it meant to my ECUTek license. Thanks for clearing this up - so it's a complete ECU swap after all. Should I even bother reflashing back to Stock before going to the dealer? If they're just swapping the ECU out, I guess it won't matter, right?

Once the recall work is done, I just have to get another license key generated by you so that I can re-flash ECUTek, or do I just re-flash as normal?

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Wow, if this is true I definitely won't be going with Ecutek...

DRM in my car no thanks.
To be clear, you already have DRM in your car. The stock ECU is locked. ECUTek and any other re-flash tunes work because they managed to crack the protection. I understand what you're saying though, and Piggy-back tunes, on the other hand, manipulate the information going to the ECU rather than changing the programming directly - so that's most likely the option you want to take.
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Old 02-26-2013, 01:16 PM   #41
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because of his reputation in the tuner world.


Thanks for the good laugh today. I thought you were serious, until I read this part.
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Old 02-26-2013, 04:13 PM   #42
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Thanks for the good laugh today. I thought you were serious, until I read this part.
Whatever. People blow me away.
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