02-06-2018, 12:22 AM | #253 | |
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humfrz |
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02-06-2018, 12:36 AM | #254 | |
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I don’t miss the unpredictable snap oversteer. I especially don’t miss the Honda S2k seat thieves. You couldn’t go to a car meet in Miami without worrying that the next morning you would find your soft top cut open and your seats missing. |
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02-06-2018, 01:05 AM | #255 | |
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Oh yeah the seats. I figured that would have died off by now. So you don’t miss the perfectly liner power band or the 8200 redline (you said AP2 if I recall)? You don’t miss the engine sound? How about that amazing shifter (although the twin has a damn good shifter too)? I mean you basically didn’t mention any of the things the S2000 is most known for. |
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02-06-2018, 05:19 AM | #256 | ||
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If any at all it would be too small too see. Quote:
The heat is caused by friction. What is the difference in the operating temperature between 2,000 and 4,000 rpms in these cars?
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02-06-2018, 05:21 AM | #257 |
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UMMMM that is what I have said all along. It isn't "extra" wear and not a good reason to not drive the car in that range if you wish though.
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02-06-2018, 05:50 AM | #258 | ||
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Your statement was it was extra wear and unnecessary. My statement was it was normal wear within the design specs and operating range of the car and not "extra". If we can't quantify what "extra" wear means then there is no way to debate it. I have already said repeatedly that there may be more wear at higher RPMs but since the engine changes it's cooling and oiling at the different ranges it would be so small a difference that it would not matter. We are not talking about spending hours at red line here but 500 to 800 RPMs above the normal cruising range in 6th gear.
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02-06-2018, 08:43 AM | #259 | ||
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And I still stand by that... when cruising.
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In the examples that humfrz presented it wasn't 500 or 800 more/extra RPMs. It's the difference between 2000 and 4000. Double the number of times the metal rings scrap across the metal sleeves in the same period of time. And about the operating temps. Are you under the impression the temps would go down at 4000 vs 2000. If so you are very sadly mistaken. Have you never looked at data logs from your car? In closing I stand by my original statement that your better off to "cruise" closer to 2000 vs 4000 if the gear is available. Sure the wear may be negligible (and I have been in agreeance with that all along) but it's still there. Throw in fuel economy (which isn't at all negligible) and it's a no brainer. I'm really sorry if I struck a nerve or offended anyone for suggesting something so outrageous. Here I thought this was manual transmission 101 kind of stuff. |
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02-06-2018, 08:55 AM | #260 | |
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The proper question is what is the oil pressure at 2000rpm vs 4000rpm. |
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02-06-2018, 08:57 AM | #261 | |
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Maybe I should have taken this approach. Pros and Cons of "cruising" at higher RPMs: Pros: - Sounds better (opinion) - Closer to the powerband if you need to close the door on someone making a pass in the right lane. (fact) Cons: - "More" wear on the sleeves, rings and skirts (fact) - Burns more fuel (fact) - Sounds like ass (opinion) - Drones on some aftermarket exhausts (fact) People are free to decide what to do on their own. I personally chose to cruise low for these reasons and in this order: Doesn't sound like ass Burns less fuel As an added bonus it will put less wear on the engine |
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02-06-2018, 09:07 AM | #262 |
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Oil temps are higher at 4000. No debate there. You can see that in logs. Oil pressure is dramatically lower at 2000 but well within safe specs. Also lower RPMs don't require as much oiling anyways. At the high end our car is known for not producing as much pressure to the bottom end. I have read that this is due to a heavy bias on VVT. There is a newer timing cover that supposedly changed the size of some galeries no doubt to improve on this. I would love to see the new cover next to mine which is the original cover.
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02-06-2018, 10:32 AM | #263 | |
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Almost everything you said here is a gross distortion of my points and as you said before this is like arguing religion. One side has facts and science to back it and the other has legends and faith. Each of us believe we have the facts and are not going to change the other ones mind. In closing I will simply state that there is no significant difference between cruising at 2,000 and 4,000 and you are no "better" off. This is all I have said all along.
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02-06-2018, 10:33 AM | #264 | |
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It’s not like it sounded as good as a Alfa Romeo Twin Cam or Alfa Romeo 4C. The shifting and placement we’re great but you still wanted a short shifter or counter sunk shift knob. MY04 also had to go in for the TSB shifter popping out of 2nd gear. Plus, no one talks about the poor fuel economy for a 4-cylinder and lack of power. It felt so slow until you hit 6500 rpms. The entire time I wanted a Lotus Elise. |
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02-06-2018, 10:43 AM | #265 |
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Why would anyone cruise regularly @ 4k rpm lol. Maybe I'm spoiled by my auto but when I'm driving with the paddles my Shift Indicator is set at literally 4.5k
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02-06-2018, 10:50 AM | #266 |
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The question wasn't "why" the question was "will it hurt the car"? The answer remains no.
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