New 510 concept (Nissan IDx)

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by zigzagz94

At 57:00 Jose Munoz, Chairman Nissan North America, says the freeflow IDx could be built off the Rogue platform if put into production. Last I checked the Rogue was FWD mated to a CVT transmission. If this is the direction Nissan is considering with this car then they've already lost and shouldn't even bring it out. Honestly the more I hear from Nissan about the IDx the more interested I become in the Kia GT4 Stinger (30:32). At least Kia's engineers are talking about pure driving RWD performance and not some crowd sourced BS car for kids who don't like driving. Sad because I really liked the NISMO version....

Rogue has AWD option, right? So it can fit a rear diff and drive the proper wheels. Just like the Subaru repurposed chassis that became the twins.

[chaoskaze]

hmmm why rouge platform instead of juke platform...? O__o

[NemesisPrime909]

Originally Posted by chaoskaze

hmmm why rouge platform instead of juke platform...? O__o

my question exactly

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Rogue has AWD option, right? So it can fit a rear diff and drive the proper wheels. Just like the Subaru repurposed chassis that became the twins.

Subarus have longitudinal engines and are more of a rwd type of platform. Rogue and Juke have transversely mounted engines and are 1st and foremost fwd platforms, with awd optional. Engine placement in these chassis is for forward weight bias required for fwd. Trying to build an rwd car on that platform just wouldn't work.

Not liking this direction for the IDX. Wrong wheel drive, sits way too high, just a dumb sedan version of an fwd SUV. NO THANKS, Nissan...

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Subarus have longitudinal engines and are more of a rwd type of platform. Rogue and Juke have transversely mounted engines and are 1st and foremost fwd platforms, with awd optional. Engine placement in these chassis is for forward weight bias required for fwd. Trying to build an rwd car on that platform just wouldn't work.

Not liking this direction for the IDX. Wrong wheel drive, sits way too high, just a dumb sedan version of an fwd SUV. NO THANKS, Nissan...

I still think it's doable. Engine and transmission mounting/cross members in the open front side is less of a deal than reworking the underbody part of the chassis for driveshaft tunnel, space for pumpkin and rear control arm mounts. The more expensive/complex (in my opinion) parts of the chassis are already ready for rwd.

[Purdue FR-S]

I'm waiting until production version and real data/specs release before I make an opinion...

but it does offer a glimmer of hope!

[zigzagz94]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I still think it's doable. Engine and transmission mounting/cross members in the open front side is less of a deal than reworking the underbody part of the chassis for driveshaft tunnel, space for pumpkin and rear control arm mounts. The more expensive/complex (in my opinion) parts of the chassis are already ready for rwd.

I agree it's doable but it just doesn't seem like the optimal platform for this type of car. And the rogue doesn't have a manual transmission so they'd have to come up with a bespoke trans just for this car. Plus all of the interviews they keep trying to skate around the questionoption of a true manual saying things like " there are multiple ways to offer a manual feel". I hope this car turns out to be awesome but the more I hear from Nissan the less warm feel I get about the eventual production car.

[n2oinferno]

Originally Posted by zigzagz94

I agree it's doable but it just doesn't seem like the optimal platform for this type of car. And the rogue doesn't have a manual transmission so they'd have to come up with a bespoke trans just for this car. Plus all of the interviews they keep trying to skate around the questionoption of a true manual saying things like " there are multiple ways to offer a manual feel". I hope this car turns out to be awesome but the more I hear from Nissan the less warm feel I get about the eventual production car.

Nissan's EXTREME MARKETING promotion guy:
YO WE PUT A CLUTCH PEDAL UP IN HERE SO YOU CAN GET THAT MANUAL FEEL! IT DON'T DO ANYTHING BUT YOU PRESS THAT CLUTCH AND HIT THAT FLAPPY PADDLE BUTTON AND YOU GOT ALL THAT MANUAL FEEL UP IN THIS CAR!

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I still think it's doable. Engine and transmission mounting/cross members in the open front side is less of a deal than reworking the underbody part of the chassis for driveshaft tunnel, space for pumpkin and rear control arm mounts. The more expensive/complex (in my opinion) parts of the chassis are already ready for rwd.

It's not doable due to where the firewall is relative to the front wheels. Front-drive layouts put the engine way out in front of the front wheels to get the 60/40 - 65/35 weight bias they need. Firewall is IMMEDIATELY behind the front wheels.

If you built a rear-drive car on that platform, with a longitudinal engine, the front weight bias would likely move forward a bit from an already very heavily front-biased situation.

60/40 - 65/35 weight distribution for a rear drive car would be a disaster.

If you moved the front wheels way forward of the firewall like you'd really need to do, that totally changes the front structure of the car and the relationship between where the road loads are introduced into the chassis and where the firewall/bulkhead is. To the extent that I don't think you could call it the same platform anymore. Not to mention the very different proportions for the engine compartment for a transverse engine setup vs. longitudinal.

A 2-door sedan version of the fwd-chassis Rogue is not going to cut it for me, even if they gave it awd.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by ZDan

It's not doable due to where the firewall is relative to the front wheels. Front-drive layouts put the engine way out in front of the front wheels to get the 60/40 - 65/35 weight bias they need. Firewall is IMMEDIATELY behind the front wheels.

If you built a rear-drive car on that platform, with a longitudinal engine, the front weight bias would likely move forward a bit from an already very heavily front-biased situation.

60/40 - 65/35 weight distribution for a rear drive car would be a disaster.

If you moved the front wheels way forward of the firewall like you'd really need to do, that totally changes the front structure of the car and the relationship between where the road loads are introduced into the chassis and where the firewall/bulkhead is. To the extent that I don't think you could call it the same platform anymore. Not to mention the very different proportions for the engine compartment for a transverse engine setup vs. longitudinal.

A 2-door sedan version of the fwd-chassis Rogue is not going to cut it for me, even if they gave it awd.

Rear mount transaxle??? You're breaking the balls of hopes and dreams here with your 'logic', 'solid engineering knowledge' and 'realistic expectations', ZDan. That stuff doesn't belong in concept car discussions...

Heh...

[vh_supra26]

Company doesn't think they could sell enough to justify production

Nissan Chief Planning Officer Andy Palmer previously said the company would "definitely" build one of their IDx concepts but now it appears the company is changing their tune.

In an interview with Wards Auto, Nissan North America Vice President of Product Planning Pierre Loing said creating a production IDX might worth the hassle. As he explained, “It’s not easy" to create an affordable rear-wheel drive sports because the volumes wouldn't make sense unless you also use the platform for something else.. He went on to say "Frankly to do a platform for 50,000 or 60,000 [units] a year – it’s not worth it."

Loing said the company is still debating a production version of the IDx but it definitely won't arrive by 2016 - assuming it is green-lighted in the first place.

http://www.worldcarfans.com/11407147...rth-building--

[f0rge]

They need to make the regular car (510?) with a 4door option for the masses, replacing the absolutely dreadful current-gen Versa and Sentra. That would be the only way to get the production numbers up high enough to make this worthwhile.

Then they can make the special editions like the IDx for enthusiasts.

[zigzagz94]

Damn I was really looking forward to the Nismo IDx. Hopefully the new Z doesn't get delayed by the bean counters too.

[DarkSunrise]

Makes me appreciate Tada-san's efforts in pushing the Twins into production. He took a big risk there. Also explains why there aren't more true competitors to the Twins out there (lightweight RWD coupes).