Kraftwerks Supercharger Owners Thread

[DAN_BRZ]

Originally Posted by Chad86

I agree it would make sense to start with the C30 and then later on if I wanted more HP, then upgrade to the C38. In my situation I have been offered a better deal to go with the C38. So would this be a mistake if I am currently only aiming for 300 whp on 94 octane, without a built engine?

for the price @rickspecd quoted you for the c38 kit you'd be silly not to grab that over a c30 kit...

[Triumphrider]

Trying to do my research before I install in March... Last thing to figure out is how to tighten the crank pulley after the kraftwerks pulley has been added. To loosen it obviously I can use a pulley holder. Once the new pulley is added it doesn't look like you can get it in there to hold it

[Chad86]

Originally Posted by 2016 Camaro SS

Personally, I think starting with the C30, driving on it for a while, play with e85 and see how the car actually drives and feels is the most important. Don't get lost in the numbers game. You can always upgrade to the C38 when you are ready for it.

C38 is just more upfront cost for the ability to go to those levels where you need more severe upgrades to support it. It may be way more than you actually need. It really comes down to personal preference and what you want to do. The C38 is designed for those individuals who want 400+ whp and intend on doing those major upgrades to their engine.

I'm trying to understand how you are getting the C38 cheaper than a C30. I'm currently trying to sell my kit since I never got the chance to put it on my car unfortunately and it's a pretty good deal.

The deal fell through, only two kits available at $3499

C30 kit seems like a safer approach to start. When did you purchase your kit? I might consider purchasing from you.

[Triumphrider]

I have an auto

[Triumphrider]

I have found some big strap wrenches so I may have to go that route

[vgi]

Originally Posted by 2016 Camaro SS

You can always upgrade to the C38 when you are ready for it.

C38 is just more upfront cost for the ability to go to those levels where you need more severe upgrades to support it. It may be way more than you actually need. It really comes down to personal preference and what you want to do. The C38 is designed for those individuals who want 400+ whp and intend on doing those major upgrades to their engine.

yep, the upgrade will only run you $1500 vs $500 upfront

i don't want 400+ whp, i just wanted to get max on pump and c38 does it

[post_break]

Originally Posted by Triumphrider

I have found some big strap wrenches so I may have to go that route

Just make sure it's 100% torqued. Ask me how I know lol. I went over 95ftlbs for safe measure but it's your car (and bolt).

[vgi]

Originally Posted by Sellout

You're trying to compare curves that have two different power peaks. I'm talking about what happens when they both peak at the same number, because this entire discussion is about a car that makes 300whp on E85. A number that you can hit easily on the C30.

Move the C38 boost curve OR the power curve down so it's matching the C30 at peak. Copy it EXACTLY, but move it down a few mm so that both superchargers are hitting the same peak number. What do you have now? THAT'S what I'm talking about. If they both peak at the same power number OR the same boost number, the C30 has more area under the curve.

you're not making any sense. if you start moving the curves up/down to match peak numbers then you could claim (depends on a curve of course) a 400whp turbo frs has a shitty powerband because turbo curve starts steeper when turbo kicks in and then gradually flattens out. but when you'll align the curves at peak
numbers... well, something like this may happen



for peops on c30 vs c38 - look at compressor maps:
http://www.rotrex.com/Home/Technolog...Technical_Data
and dynos provided by @KraftWerks:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...postcount=2806

c30 imo is plenty for e85/300whp

[Triumphrider]

@post_break great job on your video logs. Been watching them on YouTube.

[86SPEED]

Originally Posted by Triumphrider

Trying to do my research before I install in March... Last thing to figure out is how to tighten the crank pulley after the kraftwerks pulley has been added. To loosen it obviously I can use a pulley holder. Once the new pulley is added it doesn't look like you can get it in there to hold it

We had a old shredded belt that i used.. ideally you would want something that locks the Torque Converter Flexplate. if it is an auto.. if its a manual we did those in 6th gear, but my Auto we used square tubing, two grade 8 bolts sticking out then wrapped the belt around the pulley, and the bolts, i turned the pulley until it tightened up then torqued it...

[FirestormFRS]

Originally Posted by Triumphrider

I have found some big strap wrenches so I may have to go that route

Open the inspection cover jam a 1/2" rachet in the hole and tighten. Pro tip

[Sellout]

Originally Posted by vgi

you're not making any sense. if you start moving the curves up/down to match peak numbers then you could claim (depends on a curve of course) a 400whp turbo frs has a shitty powerband because turbo curve starts steeper when turbo kicks in and then gradually flattens out. but when you'll align the curves at peak
numbers... well, something like this may happen



for peops on c30 vs c38 - look at compressor maps:
http://www.rotrex.com/Home/Technolog...Technical_Data
and dynos provided by @KraftWerks:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...postcount=2806

c30 imo is plenty for e85/300whp

You just demonstrated exactly what I'm talking about, yet I'm not making any sense. Jesus Christ it's like you have to speak some retarded form of English on this forum for people to understand simple shit like why supercharger manufacturers build them in different sizes...

[vgi]

Originally Posted by Sellout

You just demonstrated exactly what I'm talking about, yet I'm not making any sense. Jesus Christ it's like you have to speak some retarded form of English on this forum for people to understand simple shit like why supercharger manufacturers build them in different sizes...

I just demonstrated that although in real life that 400whp car has more power everywhere, you, for some wacky reason, want to take those actual real numbers and drop them down across the band based on peak number (let's say 300whp in red curve) and pretend like the powerband is worse? Now that is retarded indeed. Peak number or not 400 is not equal 300 in my books and neither are all other numbers across the rpm range. If I want 300whp target on that turbo car then that original turbo curve would not change up to 300whp, so it would still be more power across the board just like the original, and then would be flat at 300 going to red line.


Another words, if you take a rottweiler and call it a mini spaniel (because if you shrink its head to the size of spaniel's head the total rottweiler's size would be smaller than the size of spaniel) that still doesn't make that rottweiler a mini spaniel.


As for different sizes of superchargers - there is an efficiency of compressors which you can look at. that why I suggested to look at the compressor map. The c38 looks well suited for the twins and considering it's centrifugal sc the parasitic power drain on the engine is marginally more than c30.

Also, running out of the best compressor (or a turbo) efficiency range doesn't mean you make less power (unless it's a smaller unit). Why do you think lots of guys on here slam 3076 or bigger turbo? They pay for more power though with higher lug and with superchargers it's higher engine load, but the benefits of more power for them outweigh the drawbacks.

[Sellout]

You're both looking at this like I want to detune a 400hp car to 300 in order to make a point. That's not what I'm talking about, and never has been what I'm talking about.

I said a C30 would give you a better powerband than a C38 if all you're looking for is 300whp on E85. EVERYBODY ON THE FUCKING PLANET UNDERSTANDS YOU CAN GET MORE FROM A C38. That's not the point.

The point is that if you're going to run a C38 detuned to only 300 whp at peak, you should just be running a C30 because it will have a better powerband.

If you take those fancy KW dyno plots (that most conveniently for you two) show two different dyno numbers and boost curves, then bring up the C30 boost curve so that it matches the C38 at peak, it's going to have more area under the curve. It's also likely to make fairly close to the same peak power number.

If you can't understand this, then you really don't have any business even being a part of this discussion, and I'm done.