follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Delicious Tuning
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Technical Topics > Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting

Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting What these cars were built for!


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-27-2018, 10:36 AM   #71
lutfy
Senior Member
 
lutfy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Drives: 2022 LR Defender, 2015 FRS_ST5/TT5
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 220
Thanks: 62
Thanked 193 Times in 100 Posts
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kch View Post
Hard to say, as I can't think of anyone who did those sorts of mods that wasn't also FI (except @celek).


1) Keep it simple, and get header/E85/tune. Focus on handling, suspension setup, and reliability.
What I have. PTuning header, OFT Custom tune by @Steve99 and muffler delete. While not peppy on the straights, not slow for laptimes. I decided to keep it simple.

Proof: [ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EG4idutiq_k[/ame]

This hobby as is requires enough skull f***ng with tires, setup blah blah. At least I could keep one variable constant

Lutfy
__________________
2015 FRS NASA ST/TT5
2022 LR Defender
2023 BMW M2
lutfy is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to lutfy For This Useful Post:
Tristor (10-03-2018)
Old 09-27-2018, 12:09 PM   #72
CSG Mike
 
CSG Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: S2000 CR
Location: Orange County
Posts: 14,522
Thanks: 8,911
Thanked 14,166 Times in 6,828 Posts
Mentioned: 966 Post(s)
Tagged: 14 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandSport View Post
What costs and gains are we talking about for heads/cam/stroker etc? I just dont want to strap 75lbs over the front end.

As far as weight, I was basing my estimates on that thread. I'd probably do it a little differently and end up 150lbs higher because I'd have at least a roll bar and no way I'm driving a car on the track without bumpers.
Depends on how extensive you want the work to be. If you did just cams, the cost of the cams + installation. Lets say maybe $5000 all in at a shop. Plus tuning. If you also did valves, valvetrain, seats, guides, friction treat the whole thing, with a nice port and polish, you could be north of 15k or so with labor, depending on the components chosen.

All for maybe 25-30whp on a NA car. Remember this is just the headwork.

Rods/pistons/crank/bearings for a stroker, would run you maybe 3-8k in parts, depending on components. Again, this cost can balloon out of control depending on how you choose everything to be done.
CSG Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2018, 03:53 PM   #73
Sleepless
Senior Member
 
Sleepless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Drives: 2014 BRZ
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 639
Thanks: 299
Thanked 392 Times in 229 Posts
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandSport View Post
What costs and gains are we talking about for heads/cam/stroker etc? I just dont want to strap 75lbs over the front end.
Didn't you ask about engine swaps as an option? That can also add 75lbs in the front. Car drives fine with weight of the FI up front. Plus I think it closer to 50-60lbs.
__________________
Sleepless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2018, 04:52 PM   #74
GrandSport
Senior Member
 
GrandSport's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Drives: 13 Viper; 14 BRZ; 90 Miata; 18 AMG
Location: TX
Posts: 302
Thanks: 65
Thanked 187 Times in 103 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Thanks for all the help. I think the current plan is FRS until I'm bored with it, then sell for a C5 or something. If finances go well, maybe convert the GS to a track car (although I'd rather my dedicated track car be lighter)
GrandSport is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to GrandSport For This Useful Post:
Shark_Bait88 (09-28-2018)
Old 09-28-2018, 12:30 PM   #75
Sleepless
Senior Member
 
Sleepless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Drives: 2014 BRZ
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 639
Thanks: 299
Thanked 392 Times in 229 Posts
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Personally I'd stick with the GS. Both of the last two gens are IMO the best Vettes to track. I'd cut my track days to keep the costs down and stick with it. It's a tough car to beat.
__________________
Sleepless is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Sleepless For This Useful Post:
CSG Mike (09-28-2018), GrandSport (09-28-2018)
Old 09-28-2018, 02:39 PM   #76
CSG Mike
 
CSG Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: S2000 CR
Location: Orange County
Posts: 14,522
Thanks: 8,911
Thanked 14,166 Times in 6,828 Posts
Mentioned: 966 Post(s)
Tagged: 14 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleepless View Post
Personally I'd stick with the GS. Both of the last two gens are IMO the best Vettes to track. I'd cut my track days to keep the costs down and stick with it. It's a tough car to beat.
Funny hearing this from someone with a car that I believe to be putting up a pretty good fight to those vettes!
CSG Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to CSG Mike For This Useful Post:
Shark_Bait88 (09-28-2018), Sleepless (09-28-2018)
Old 09-28-2018, 03:15 PM   #77
Code Monkey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Drives: Subaru BRZ
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 837
Thanks: 860
Thanked 558 Times in 336 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleepless View Post
It's a tough car to beat.

A twin will make you a tough driver to beat.
Code Monkey is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Code Monkey For This Useful Post:
GrandSport (09-28-2018), Joesurf79 (10-03-2018)
Old 09-28-2018, 03:59 PM   #78
GrandSport
Senior Member
 
GrandSport's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Drives: 13 Viper; 14 BRZ; 90 Miata; 18 AMG
Location: TX
Posts: 302
Thanks: 65
Thanked 187 Times in 103 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleepless View Post
Personally I'd stick with the GS. Both of the last two gens are IMO the best Vettes to track. I'd cut my track days to keep the costs down and stick with it. It's a tough car to beat.
Oh, I'm keeping it! It's not going anywhere. But for the cost of a wing, shark bar, harness and a pair of seats, I can buy the FRS.

It's an incredible car, and it's a blast to drive 4-5x a year. But I want to drive every other weekend. I'm paying for the membership every month- I'm going to use it. I want to get better. I don't want to wreck a $70k car. I don't want to run a nice car into the ground either. If I didn't have the GS, no chance I'd be considering a 200hp track car (I'd also have a lot more money). But when you have it and can take it out for a session whenever you want, having a low cost, fun car you can learn on is the ticket.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Code Monkey View Post
A twin will make you a tough driver to beat.
I learn more and more about a track I've done hundreds laps at in my Miata than I ever thought possible. Learning curve is way faster. I just want to have more fun with my friends out there. It's not fun when you're 15-20 seconds slower than everyone.






Quote:
Originally Posted by CSG Mike View Post
Funny hearing this from someone with a car that I believe to be putting up a pretty good fight to those vettes!
Heh, I've trouble shaking some Miatas at tighter tracks and tracks I'm not familiar with. But I'm typically hunting down faster cars. I can't think of any cars that have really passed me other than a McLaren and a GT3RS. I remember eating a GTR's lunch in the rain one track day. And it all comes from beating the piss out of a Miata.


Here I am at Spring Mountain advanced driving school thing for corvette owners. I'm in a Z51 (not a GS) chasing a guy who competatively races in a Z07 (Carbon ceramic brakes, much wider tires, big downforce, steeper gears and 200hp on me)

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jD9ROYC4l0k[/ame]
(the last lap gets interesting)
He never does shake me. Instructors said they were all watching me hunt him down. He was "that guy" in the class that would ask questions that were really just him telling a story and not a question and complain about the car not being set up right and demanding slicks (we all ran PSS) In the end, his fastest lap was like 0.2 sec faster than my fastest, and the car was a full 4-6 seconds faster than mine (depending on which instructor you ask) when driven by instructors.

God, watching that video makes me want to go back. Leaving so much time on the table in some turns. I bet I have another second with a few simple corrections. $3500 though. Which isn't terrible considering I get instruction, a world class track and probably 5 hours of track time ($2-2.5k in consumables alone for me in my car).
GrandSport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-2018, 04:39 PM   #79
CSG Mike
 
CSG Mike's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Drives: S2000 CR
Location: Orange County
Posts: 14,522
Thanks: 8,911
Thanked 14,166 Times in 6,828 Posts
Mentioned: 966 Post(s)
Tagged: 14 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandSport View Post
Here I am at Spring Mountain advanced driving school thing for corvette owners. I'm in a Z51 (not a GS) chasing a guy who competatively races in a Z07 (Carbon ceramic brakes, much wider tires, big downforce, steeper gears and 200hp on me)


(the last lap gets interesting)
He never does shake me. Instructors said they were all watching me hunt him down. He was "that guy" in the class that would ask questions that were really just him telling a story and not a question and complain about the car not being set up right and demanding slicks (we all ran PSS) In the end, his fastest lap was like 0.2 sec faster than my fastest, and the car was a full 4-6 seconds faster than mine (depending on which instructor you ask) when driven by instructors.

God, watching that video makes me want to go back. Leaving so much time on the table in some turns. I bet I have another second with a few simple corrections. $3500 though. Which isn't terrible considering I get instruction, a world class track and probably 5 hours of track time ($2-2.5k in consumables alone for me in my car).
Ron Fellows is totally legit.

PM me; I think I can help you get even faster, meshing together the skillset you've developed in two drastically different cars. Private coaching may be a much better value for you, both in terms of outright cost, and ROI in expanding your skill set.

Do you know what kind of tires you'll be using with the 86?
CSG Mike is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-2018, 02:50 PM   #80
AndyBRZ
Senior Member
 
AndyBRZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Drives: 2014 Silver BRZ Track Car
Location: United States
Posts: 116
Thanks: 41
Thanked 129 Times in 40 Posts
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
You have received great input in this thread. In my opinion the BRZ is not for everybody. Like you, I have access to cars much faster than the BRZ in the track.
Said that, I find myself always taking the BRZ to HPDE track events because I absolutely adore the challenge to drive it at the limit in order to extract a good lap. Also, the consumables are ridiculously low. It is the most consistent car at the limit that I have ever owned and I had a bunch of good Miatas that were very reliable as well.
If you have time, please read Car and Driver in their October issue. Go to page 47 and read the story about their lightening lap. It sums it all. Look forward to see you in an FRS or BRZ soon!
AndyBRZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-2018, 03:41 PM   #81
Sleepless
Senior Member
 
Sleepless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Drives: 2014 BRZ
Location: Redmond, WA
Posts: 639
Thanks: 299
Thanked 392 Times in 229 Posts
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
I totally understand the not wanting to beat up or wreck a $70K car (that's my limit on the most I'd risk!). There is track insurance for that though.

The issue with a non-FI FT86 is that you will not be able to play with your friends. I drove my NA BRZ on the track for 2 years and the car was a blast and a great learning tool. BUT, in the advanced groups, it is hard to have fun with others when they are all driving cars that are so much faster, including my friends. So, I finally threw in the towel and went FI. That was 3 seasons ago and I've been able to play with most of the field since.

The problem is that to get a well setup FI FT86, it costs $'s. At that point, given you already have the Vette, I'd spend the money on it and on track insurance.

I offer that advice only if you're trying to spend wisely and not from the heart! My heart requires me to own and track all of the following in performance order: Miata RF, BRZ, 944 w LS3, 14 GTR. The BRZ and 944 are purely track cars. The GTR is new to me and I've avoided taking it beyond stock, but like your Vette, it is stupid fast and a lot of fun with the high speed cars and have now had to pull the trigger on a half cage, harnesses, track wheels and tires... My point is, spend the money to make the Vette safe and on track insurance and enjoy.

If, you have more money to spend, by all means get the BRZ. IMO it would be for the heart and not for saving money...
__________________
Sleepless is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Sleepless For This Useful Post:
AndyBRZ (09-30-2018)
Old 09-30-2018, 08:09 PM   #82
GrandSport
Senior Member
 
GrandSport's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Drives: 13 Viper; 14 BRZ; 90 Miata; 18 AMG
Location: TX
Posts: 302
Thanks: 65
Thanked 187 Times in 103 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyBRZ View Post
You have received great input in this thread. In my opinion the BRZ is not for everybody. Like you, I have access to cars much faster than the BRZ in the track.
Said that, I find myself always taking the BRZ to HPDE track events because I absolutely adore the challenge to drive it at the limit in order to extract a good lap. Also, the consumables are ridiculously low. It is the most consistent car at the limit that I have ever owned and I had a bunch of good Miatas that were very reliable as well.
If you have time, please read Car and Driver in their October issue. Go to page 47 and read the story about their lightening lap. It sums it all. Look forward to see you in an FRS or BRZ soon!
Yeah, I'll still track the Grand Sport- Maybe 3-4x a year for variety. It's a dream to drive, but a monster to pay for. Plus, I always learn more in slower cars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleepless View Post
I totally understand the not wanting to beat up or wreck a $70K car (that's my limit on the most I'd risk!). There is track insurance for that though.

The issue with a non-FI FT86 is that you will not be able to play with your friends. I drove my NA BRZ on the track for 2 years and the car was a blast and a great learning tool. BUT, in the advanced groups, it is hard to have fun with others when they are all driving cars that are so much faster, including my friends. So, I finally threw in the towel and went FI. That was 3 seasons ago and I've been able to play with most of the field since.

The problem is that to get a well setup FI FT86, it costs $'s. At that point, given you already have the Vette, I'd spend the money on it and on track insurance.

I offer that advice only if you're trying to spend wisely and not from the heart! My heart requires me to own and track all of the following in performance order: Miata RF, BRZ, 944 w LS3, 14 GTR. The BRZ and 944 are purely track cars. The GTR is new to me and I've avoided taking it beyond stock, but like your Vette, it is stupid fast and a lot of fun with the high speed cars and have now had to pull the trigger on a half cage, harnesses, track wheels and tires... My point is, spend the money to make the Vette safe and on track insurance and enjoy.

If, you have more money to spend, by all means get the BRZ. IMO it would be for the heart and not for saving money...
Man, track insurance is $400-500/day with an FRS as the deductible. It's not practical for 15-20 track days a year.

My friends drive Spec Boxters and run 2:03-2:04 range. I definitely think I can get an FRS there. There is a 2:06 video in this thread on street tires. It's pretty good driving but I think I can find a second (again, not a knock on him, but I am a member there and know that track forward and back). On a good HPDE type tire like an NT01 I think I can run a 2:04.

If anything, my GS is on the other side of the curve. I ran a 1:56 in it. The owners have a GT3RS and they're about a second faster than me. Most everything else is at least 4 seconds slower

I'm not going to FI the FRZ. I'm just not interested in that can of worms. In a year or two, I'll find something in the 3-400hp category if I'm bored. I don't think I'll get hurt too bad on the FRZ, even if I put 7500 miles on it in 2 years. I bet I'd be able to sell it quickly for $8k and sell the aftermarket stuff and extra wheels too.
GrandSport is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to GrandSport For This Useful Post:
14stu (09-30-2018)
Old 10-01-2018, 01:40 PM   #83
celek
Resident Gear Head
 
celek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Drives: 2013 BRZ
Location: Ohio
Posts: 734
Thanks: 264
Thanked 914 Times in 339 Posts
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Garage
I’ll sell you my 2.3 liter short block for $7k. Unlike prices above includeds case halves and you don’t have to ship it to Japan.
__________________
celek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2018, 01:04 PM   #84
GrandSport
Senior Member
 
GrandSport's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Drives: 13 Viper; 14 BRZ; 90 Miata; 18 AMG
Location: TX
Posts: 302
Thanks: 65
Thanked 187 Times in 103 Posts
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by celek View Post
I’ll sell you my 2.3 liter short block for $7k. Unlike prices above includeds case halves and you don’t have to ship it to Japan.
Heh, maybe a year or so from now. I dont even have the car yet. Brakes are definitely #1 and coilover are #2. Then we'll see where it goes.

The most I think about it, the more I like having the FRS for a year or two and then getting a C6 Grand Sport or Z06. I can use the same wheels as my C7, which would be awesome.
GrandSport is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Contemplating Fix bumper or buy aftermarket. Earlier than expected choice Heat Sinker Cosmetic Modification (Interior/Exterior/Lighting) 1 05-30-2016 03:34 PM
Contemplating LS swap, brakes to suit the package? hayden55 Suspension | Chassis | Brakes -- Sponsored by 949 Racing 9 03-07-2016 02:42 PM
Contemplating new ARP studs ... anyone with bad experiences? donoman Tracking / Autocross / HPDE / Drifting 20 06-02-2015 11:50 AM
Contemplating buying used BRZ with tons of mods but is it worth it? Sebaru BRZ First-Gen (2012+) -- General Topics 48 07-19-2013 10:25 AM
Contemplating Raven Purchase Please Advise steve87j Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum 27 11-29-2012 09:44 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.