Fuel pump issues - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

jamesm · 10-11-2013, 04:24 PM

i'm having issues with my tune and i believe it has to do with my fuel pump, or installation of it.

first i'll describe the problem: my trims are all pretty good, within +/- a few % for the most part, so nothing is wildly off there. when cruising around, everything seems pretty normal. as soon as it goes into open loop it targets 11.5:1 afr immediately, but the actual afr just tapers down to ~12.5:1 and stays there. i haven't been driving it hard or in boost until i can get this resolved, but when i do for a test at 6500+ rpm the afr starts dropping down to 11.5:1 where you'd expect. during these runs, i'm getting weird spikes to 90% duty cycle on the fuel pump, until about 3/4 of the way through the run where it is maxed at 90% from there on out.

i've had the shop check the fuel pump and reinstall and and did once again myself. it's using the white spacer (it's cracked, but i doubt that should matter?) and 2 o-rings. the canister seems to close tight with the clips on the housing. the only thing i've seen different in other installs is mine is missing the black grommet thing that goes on the bottom of the pump. i'm not sure this is an issue as i've seen install videos that don't even mention it.

so, basically i'd like to get a better understanding of the symptoms other folks had with the fuel pump install issues, and see if they mirror my own experience at all. any help would be much appreciated.

jamesm · 10-11-2013, 06:02 PM

just switched to 4 o-rings... no difference at all.

tg_1981 · 10-13-2013, 01:40 PM

Did you ever figure out the problem?

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesm

just switched to 4 o-rings... no difference at all.

Zach3794 · 10-13-2013, 02:11 PM

I was having some pretty terrible issues with fuel cut before (ie my car stopped and my head made friends with the steering wheel, nearly). Turned out it was the way the lines were routed within the canister. This may not be the same issue as yours, but it could be worth a shot. I believe there is a thread on here describing it in detail, but forgive me for being too lazy to search for you :-)

For reference, I'm using the DW65C pump

jamesm · 10-13-2013, 03:56 PM

the problem definitely isn't the fuel pump, i've had it out and checked the line routing and tried multiple different o-ring setups with no difference. after doing more logging it seems way too consistent to be a delivery issue. i'm pretty sure it's in the tune, but i won't know for sure until i can pull it and actually see what it's doing.

Sportsguy83 · 10-13-2013, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesm

the problem definitely isn't the fuel pump, i've had it out and checked the line routing and tried multiple different o-ring setups with no difference. after doing more logging it seems way too consistent to be a delivery issue. i'm pretty sure it's in the tune, but i won't know for sure until i can pull it and actually see what it's doing.

If its consistent, very consistent, I would also believe it has to do with the tune. Just to overkill it, go through this thread again

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33993

I do agree it might be the tune though.

whitefrs · 10-13-2013, 05:22 PM

its the tune
this happen to me with Visconti but LJ got it all good when i switch to his map

Zach3794 · 10-13-2013, 05:39 PM

Agreed. When I was having issues with my pump, it was very intermittent. The car would either run flawless, or make it seem like shit just went terribly wrong.

mtimney · 10-14-2013, 11:51 AM

Before my pump developed 'the crickets' and was obviously bad, it behaved very inconsistently and drove me crazy in regards to tune...especially because I had just put in a header and was trying out different UniChip maps.

Sportsguy83 · 10-14-2013, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtimney

Before my pump developed 'the crickets' and was obviously bad, it behaved very inconsistently and drove me crazy in regards to tune...especially because I had just put in a header and was trying out different UniChip maps.

Developing crickets is not a sign of being "bad". Also, the pump with "crickets" is the HPFP. The pump we are able to replace for a higher volume one (topic of this thread) is the in tank fuel pump.

Circuit Motorsports · 10-14-2013, 02:54 PM

If you're using the tuning software I think you are, then I have a strong feeling it's the tune and the software.

I know you're local to us, so If you want some help we would be happy to assist any way we can.

-Tristan

jamesm · 10-14-2013, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Circuit Motorsports

If you're using the tuning software I think you are, then I have a strong feeling it's the tune and the software.

I know you're local to us, so If you want some help we would be happy to assist any way we can.

-Tristan

you're correct.. using brzedit has been a nightmare. i'm not sure if the software is to blame or the tuner (they essentially blame one another lol) but i know i'm over it whatever it is. ecuflash is expected within a few days, at which point i plan to just start over completely and do it my damn self, as always lol. at least then if it's wrong i'll be able to determine why and be able to fix it. operating with limited visibility is making solving this problem pretty much impossible.

i'd love to have you guys tune the car, but you know me, i need to be able to modify my own maps as i see fit (i'm feeling the pain of not being able to now, so i'm sure you understand). if you'd be willing to do it with ecuflash i'd love that.

i appreciate your offering to help in any case.

Circuit Motorsports · 10-14-2013, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamesm

you're correct.. using brzedit has been a nightmare. i'm not sure if the software is to blame or the tuner (they essentially blame one another lol) but i know i'm over it whatever it is. ecuflash is expected within a few days, at which point i plan to just start over completely and do it my damn self, as always lol. at least then if it's wrong i'll be able to determine why and be able to fix it. operating with limited visibility is making solving this problem pretty much impossible.

i'd love to have you guys tune the car, but you know me, i need to be able to modify my own maps as i see fit (i'm feeling the pain of not being able to now, so i'm sure you understand). if you'd be willing to do it with ecuflash i'd love that.

i appreciate your offering to help in any case.

Yeah exactly.

If you need an Ecutek tune let us know, if something changes on our end with openflash we will post it up.

-Tristan

jamesm · 10-16-2013, 06:37 PM

i finally figured out the problem. turns out it was in the tune. i was able to get in there and edit it myself and resolve the issues rather quickly. car is much happier now

10-11-2013, 04:24 PM	#1
jamesm Banned Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 FR-S Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 2,929 Thanks: 1,166 Thanked 2,293 Times in 1,180 Posts Mentioned: 313 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	Fuel pump issues i'm having issues with my tune and i believe it has to do with my fuel pump, or installation of it. first i'll describe the problem: my trims are all pretty good, within +/- a few % for the most part, so nothing is wildly off there. when cruising around, everything seems pretty normal. as soon as it goes into open loop it targets 11.5:1 afr immediately, but the actual afr just tapers down to ~12.5:1 and stays there. i haven't been driving it hard or in boost until i can get this resolved, but when i do for a test at 6500+ rpm the afr starts dropping down to 11.5:1 where you'd expect. during these runs, i'm getting weird spikes to 90% duty cycle on the fuel pump, until about 3/4 of the way through the run where it is maxed at 90% from there on out. i've had the shop check the fuel pump and reinstall and and did once again myself. it's using the white spacer (it's cracked, but i doubt that should matter?) and 2 o-rings. the canister seems to close tight with the clips on the housing. the only thing i've seen different in other installs is mine is missing the black grommet thing that goes on the bottom of the pump. i'm not sure this is an issue as i've seen install videos that don't even mention it. so, basically i'd like to get a better understanding of the symptoms other folks had with the fuel pump install issues, and see if they mirror my own experience at all. any help would be much appreciated.

10-13-2013, 05:22 PM	#7
whitefrs Love Boost!!!!!!!! Join Date: Jun 2012 Drives: Whiteout Scion FR-S Location: Long Island NY Posts: 3,612 Thanks: 429 Thanked 902 Times in 606 Posts Mentioned: 87 Post(s) Tagged: 3 Thread(s)	its the tune this happen to me with Visconti but LJ got it all good when i switch to his map __________________ ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ I LOVE BOOST ༼ つ ◕_◕ ༽つ

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10-11-2013, 06:02 PM	#2
jamesm Banned Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 FR-S Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 2,929 Thanks: 1,166 Thanked 2,293 Times in 1,180 Posts Mentioned: 313 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	just switched to 4 o-rings... no difference at all.

10-13-2013, 02:11 PM	#4
Zach3794 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 Scion FR-S, Raven, Manual Location: Vista, CA Posts: 396 Thanks: 81 Thanked 143 Times in 101 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I was having some pretty terrible issues with fuel cut before (ie my car stopped and my head made friends with the steering wheel, nearly). Turned out it was the way the lines were routed within the canister. This may not be the same issue as yours, but it could be worth a shot. I believe there is a thread on here describing it in detail, but forgive me for being too lazy to search for you :-) For reference, I'm using the DW65C pump

10-13-2013, 03:56 PM	#5
jamesm Banned Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 FR-S Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 2,929 Thanks: 1,166 Thanked 2,293 Times in 1,180 Posts Mentioned: 313 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	the problem definitely isn't the fuel pump, i've had it out and checked the line routing and tried multiple different o-ring setups with no difference. after doing more logging it seems way too consistent to be a delivery issue. i'm pretty sure it's in the tune, but i won't know for sure until i can pull it and actually see what it's doing.

10-13-2013, 05:39 PM	#8
Zach3794 Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 Scion FR-S, Raven, Manual Location: Vista, CA Posts: 396 Thanks: 81 Thanked 143 Times in 101 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Agreed. When I was having issues with my pump, it was very intermittent. The car would either run flawless, or make it seem like shit just went terribly wrong.

10-14-2013, 11:51 AM	#9
mtimney Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 BRZ Limited Location: NH Posts: 101 Thanks: 14 Thanked 36 Times in 12 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Before my pump developed 'the crickets' and was obviously bad, it behaved very inconsistently and drove me crazy in regards to tune...especially because I had just put in a header and was trying out different UniChip maps.

10-14-2013, 02:54 PM	#11
Circuit Motorsports Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: 2013 Subaru BRZ Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 4,353 Thanks: 294 Thanked 495 Times in 259 Posts Mentioned: 35 Post(s) Tagged: 2 Thread(s)	If you're using the tuning software I think you are, then I have a strong feeling it's the tune and the software. I know you're local to us, so If you want some help we would be happy to assist any way we can. -Tristan

10-16-2013, 06:37 PM	#14
jamesm Banned Join Date: Mar 2013 Drives: 2013 FR-S Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 2,929 Thanks: 1,166 Thanked 2,293 Times in 1,180 Posts Mentioned: 313 Post(s) Tagged: 4 Thread(s)	i finally figured out the problem. turns out it was in the tune. i was able to get in there and edit it myself and resolve the issues rather quickly. car is much happier now

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