FT-86 SpeedFactory Catted UEL Header

[Re~Mix]

Short video, exhaust is a bit louder than it sounds in the video (GoPro mic isn't great...)

[ame]http://youtu.be/cYXFOHL5Y6I[/ame]

[sobrz]

This header sounds like a holy grail for me:
- kills the dip
- no tuning needed = no risk of voiding warranty
- boxer rumble
I really couldn't ask for more.

However, looking at @hattrickey 's dyno post #2109 I started worrying that flattening the torque curve happens mostly by shaving the early peak of the oem torque, rather than filling up the dip?

I'm trying to find a good baseline for this chart, I 'm aware different dynos show different results, but when I google "fa20 stock dyno" on most charts I see torque peaking around 140 lb-ft before the dip (e.g., here: http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/t...no-tested.html) and @hattrickey 's baseline (before tune) never reaches 120 lb-ft before 5K revs?

Basically, comparing hattrickey's baseline to available stock dyno charts it looks like the torque curve gets flattened mostly by shaving the pre-dip peak. What am I missing?

ps1: I ignored the dyno in the 1st post simply because it comes from the manufacturer
ps2: I really hope I'm missing something as I'd love to get this header if indeed it fills up the dip

[kodyo]

Originally Posted by sobrz

This header sounds like a holy grail for me:
- kills the dip
- no tuning needed = no risk of voiding warranty
- boxer rumble
I really couldn't ask for more.

However, looking at @hattrickey 's dyno post #2109 I started worrying that flattening the torque curve happens mostly by cutting down the peaks of oem torque, rather than filling up the dip?

I'm trying to find a good baseline for this chart, I 'm aware different dynos show different results, but when I google "fa20 stock dyno" on most charts I see torque peaking around 140 lb-ft before the dip (e.g., here: http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/t...no-tested.html) and @hattrickey 's baseline (before tune) never reaches 120 lb-ft before 5K revs?

Basically, comparing hattrickey's baseline to available stock dyno charts it looks like the torque curve gets flattened mostly by cutting off the pre-dip peak. What am I missing?

ps1: I ignored the dyno in the 1st post simply because it comes from the manufacturer
ps2: I really hope I'm missing something as I'd love to get this header if indeed it fills up the dip

Dynos should be used as a comparison tool for the same car on the same dyno. I would not compare dyno charts from different cars run on different dynos as the output is often not scaled the same. What this means is that the same car can show drastic result changes by just switching to a different dyno, as well as two stock cars showing different results on the same dyno.

[hattrickey]

Originally Posted by sobrz

This header sounds like a holy grail for me:
- kills the dip
- no tuning needed = no risk of voiding warranty
- boxer rumble
I really couldn't ask for more.

However, looking at @hattrickey 's dyno post #2109 I started worrying that flattening the torque curve happens mostly by cutting down the peaks of oem torque, rather than filling up the dip?

I'm trying to find a good baseline for this chart, I 'm aware different dynos show different results, but when I google "fa20 stock dyno" on most charts I see torque peaking around 140 lb-ft before the dip (e.g., here: http://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/t...no-tested.html) and @hattrickey 's baseline (before tune) never reaches 120 lb-ft before 5K revs?

Basically, comparing hattrickey's baseline to available stock dyno charts it looks like the torque curve gets flattened mostly by cutting off the pre-dip peak. What am I missing?

ps1: I ignored the dyno in the 1st post simply because it comes from the manufacturer
ps2: I really hope I'm missing something as I'd love to get this header if indeed it fills up the dip

That's an interesting observation, however I don't think it is all that accurate. Below is my E85 tune compared to a 100% stock FR-S on the same dyno. Since it isn't my car, there will be some room for error, but the dyno is the same so I think it helps give you a better comparison.

The stock FR-S looks like it hit just over 120ft/lb of torque at 3100 RPM, dipped significantly and then didn't get back over 120ft/lb until 5850 RPM. My baseline with the header and exhaust shows being just below 120ft/lb the entire rev range until 5000 RPM when it continually increases and peaks at 138ft/lb's.

So in conclusion, I sacrificed a VERY small amount of torque by filling up that curve with this header but again, you need to remember that this is a different car so my car could have been more in line with what we see with the baseline torque curve. Hope this helps

[sobrz]

Thanks for the second chart, @hattrickey, its very helpful. I photoshopped the 100% stock frs curve (blue) onto your first graph.

Looks like the header indeed shaves some torque in the 3Ks and adds in the 4Ks, nicely flattening out the curve (assuming it's fair to compare two different engines on the same dyno).

There is a statement in the edmund's piece that starts ringing true: "Apparently the dip was purposeful on the part of the FR-S/BRZ powertrain engineers -- they intentionally traded some sauce at 4000 rpm in order to gain some driveability lower in the rev range."

So I guess the question I'm asking myself now is: would I rather have more low end torque with a mid-range dip, or a flat consistent torque curve that gives up some of the low-end?

And the right answer based on your dyno seems to be that I just need to forget about the warranty and get both header and tune. :/

[tahdizzle]

Installed my FT86SF catted UEL, Motive OP, Motiv Catted FP, and my HKS Legamax Sports on Friday.

I'm pleased.

[Turkish]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

Installed my FT86SF catted UEL, Motive OP, Motiv Catted FP, and my HKS Legamax Sports on Friday.

I'm pleased.

Are you running an aftermarket engine tune? If not, any codes thrown? Which intake are you using?

[tahdizzle]

@Turkish No tune. No codes (yet). I am still using the stock intake, no drop in.

[EMS Guy]

Some great area under the curve gained here!

[tahdizzle]

I'll get a clip up asap

[Mayb92]

Originally Posted by Re~Mix

Short video, exhaust is a bit louder than it sounds in the video (GoPro mic isn't great...)

That drive-by was music to my ears. Offically sold on getting it

[tahdizzle]

Sound clip of brz exhaust: [ame]http://youtu.be/Clv27JfNnq8[/ame]

[tahdizzle]

Camera on my phone, but it will do

[Turkish]

Originally Posted by tahdizzle

@Turkish No tune. No codes (yet). I am still using the stock intake, no drop in.

Interesting, I was curious as I plan on using the same front pipe and over pipe with this header.