max "potential" NA power.

[350matt]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Max I have seen on a dyno was 275 whp.

presumably this was FI of some sort?

[archer]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

Max I have seen on a dyno was 275 whp.

im with matt on this, this had to have been FI because no one is getting anywhere even close to 275 on the fa20 yet NA.

[zooki]

If you knew how much the heads flowed you could figure out the max HP they would support. Anybody have those numbers handy?

[diss7]

Wants max NA hp, but is butt hurt at the cost of replacement throttle body?

Any one uber serious about crazy NA setup, I'll slip you some info. You know those v8s they made out of two hayabusa engines, well there's a version in New Zealand called the synergy V8. It's a custom block with Kawasaki heads I believe.

They've had a wrecked 86 for 12 months now. They've also partnered up with the electronic guys who did all the work on the TR86s for Toyota racing.

Their plan is to offer it as a turn key street package. I know a lot of details about it as getting one is still what's hanging me up on doing a custom turbo setup.
Here's some details.
Motor is 2400cc, but can be 3000cc
Runs on pump gas, but can run on race gas
2400cc on pump makes 350hp @10,500 rpm . The 3000cc on race gas was closer to 500. (off the top of my head, I have the dynos at work)
It's dry sump
It has ITBs
It will work seemlessly with all the stock electronics
It is lighter than the fa20
It has been mounted 86mm (lol) further back than stock, but I believe a custom DS is a part of the package
It has a CRAZY light flywheel/clutch. (They should us weight : pictures in the NZ owners club on fb) I could find that pic next time I'm on my PC, don't mind sharing that one as they've already shared it.

Um, thats probably all I can say. I've seen pictures of it in the bay, now other details about inclusions, price etc. Let's just say the motor on its own is $40kNZD.

Reason I like it, it's an extremely understated supercars. If I buy a porsche / Ferrari, next thing my staff/customers/family think I'm making too much money. Have something like this, it's easier to get away with.

Go google synergy v8 and watch the YouTube videos. Get some tissues ready, either for tears or for baby batter.

[MAPerformance]

Originally Posted by archer

lol but i'm talking about going PAST bolt on's. Once theres a better camshaft on the market, once there's a throttle body that doesn't cost over $1,000.

lol internal's is my interest.

Our 68mm throttle bodies will be around $250.

[diss7]

For the price of throttle bodies that I've seen, there is 10 $1000 mods that I can think of doing that will have a much bigger impact.
Exhaust
CAI
Headers
Final drive
Carbon DS
Under drive pulleys
Flywheel
Flash tune
Hmm 10 was harder than I thought. Fuck it you get my point.

[fooddude]

itb's?

[SkAsphalt]

Originally Posted by fooddude

itb's?

individual (independent whatever you want) throttle bodies

[dabocx]

Your going to have to wait for Cams , ITBs, and a stroker kit to see what this car can really do N/A. Very expensive

[Xero-Limit]

Frankly I think past 200 on pump gas is definitely optimistic. We hit an honest 205 or so on E85 with Simmons' car last year (now Derek's) and I doubt you'll see too much higher. It is > 100hp/liter, to the wheels, which is damn impressive. While we could get more creative with some dyno work (such as arbitrary dynojet conversions on other dynos...) I think there's just a limit to what a 2.0l will do with stock compression--which is already a ludicrous (for an OEM) 12.5:1.

I doubt you'll see too much with cams; the stock setup is already pretty aggressive. If it weren't you wouldn't get the torque dip nor spin to nearly 8k without a massive tq drop. Thankfully the dual VVT keeps things at bay. I'd say no more than 10 hp from cams alone. Compression wise there isn't too much room if you plan on doing many miles.

ITBs sound nice, and make for great response. But the stock plenum ain't half bad for flow. Larger throttle body(ies) might make more HP but I've not seen anyone prove this just yet.

My gut tells me Subaru/Toyota are not making this one easy for the NA aftermarket. Though they certainly did for FI, given the punishment these motors are taking.

[troek]

what witchcraft are those honda engines using?!? lol

[archer]

diss7, screw off. dont like my thread, no worrie's, dont have to be part of it lol. im not complaining about the price of a good throttle body, im stating that as time goes on and more and more parts are out the price will go down on some part's. yes, to build a engine correct it take's a crazy amount of money, so im not complaing about the price lol.

[archer]

Originally Posted by troek

what witchcraft are those honda engines using?!? lol

haha

[archer]

Originally Posted by moto-mike

Frankly I think past 200 on pump gas is definitely optimistic. We hit an honest 205 or so on E85 with Simmons' car last year (now Derek's) and I doubt you'll see too much higher. It is > 100hp/liter, to the wheels, which is damn impressive. While we could get more creative with some dyno work (such as arbitrary dynojet conversions on other dynos...) I think there's just a limit to what a 2.0l will do with stock compression--which is already a ludicrous (for an OEM) 12.5:1.

I doubt you'll see too much with cams; the stock setup is already pretty aggressive. If it weren't you wouldn't get the torque dip nor spin to nearly 8k without a massive tq drop. Thankfully the dual VVT keeps things at bay. I'd say no more than 10 hp from cams alone. Compression wise there isn't too much room if you plan on doing many miles.

ITBs sound nice, and make for great response. But the stock plenum ain't half bad for flow. Larger throttle body(ies) might make more HP but I've not seen anyone prove this just yet.

My gut tells me Subaru/Toyota are not making this one easy for the NA aftermarket. Though they certainly did for FI, given the punishment these motors are taking.

i completely agree with you. realistically this engine is impressive if you think about it. i think there is potential for more power then what people are getting currently. however, how much more is yet to be seen. im not saying im gunna do a crazy full engine build NA. im also not saying that im NOT going to ether lol. im just curious what the potential is gunna be.

some day, someone out there will reach this engine's full NA peak. they will have spent a shit ton money, but in the end it will be cool and provide good info for other people.