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Issues | Warranty | Recalls / TSB Problems, issues, recalls, TSBs


View Poll Results: Have you had an issue with your Direct Injection System?
I have had a DI issue and was fixed under warranty (Subaru) 10 12.35%
I had a DI issue that caused Engine Failure and was fixed under warranty (Subaru) 2 2.47%
I have had a DI issue and was fixed under warranty (Toyota) 31 38.27%
I have had a DI issue that caused Engine Failure and was fixed under warranty (Toyota) 3 3.70%
I have had a DI issue and denied warranty by (Subaru) 7 8.64%
I have had a DI issue and denied warranty by (Toyota) 14 17.28%
I had a DI issue that caused Engine Failure and was Denied warranty (Subaru) 8 9.88%
I had a DI issue that caused Engine Failure and was Denied warranty (Toyota) 6 7.41%
Voters: 81. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-14-2013, 01:38 PM   #113
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"And more interesting, there are alot of people who track their cars with a tune on this forum but its not happening to them?"
They are not all running the same tune, with the same intake/exhaust setups, under the same conditions.
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Old 06-14-2013, 01:42 PM   #114
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Mike, I searched "Mike Kang BRZ" as you suggested in your thread. I think there are some things working against you here. 1st, those videos are mostly all "timed events", as evidenced in the titles. Warranties and insurance do not like that. Insurance and car companies can't insure/warrant cars used for racing (timed) because it is not economically viable. Second, you've had two identical motor issues, similar to those known to coincidentally result from lean condition AM "tune" failures. Given the ratio of cars in service to cars with DI leaks, adjusted for those that had the ECU played with, what are the odds that one car with no tune would have this happen twice? I don't know the number, but as it stands currently, the odds are astronomically in favor of something other than a manufacturing issue affecting your car. Those odds are doubled since its happened twice. I'm not accusing you of being dishonest, but I understand Subaru's position. Here's a general question: If the ECU is re-flashed, what data is left of driving parameters and ECU AM tuning? Is it possible to erase that data so the dealer can't see it?
I have some friends in digital/electronic forensic analysis. A reflash will be 100% traceable, and I'm more than happy to make our ECU available (and even encourage) for analysis for signs of tampering/reprogramming/reflashing/etc.

As far as the search is concerned, here's the thing. They're all HPDE events. There is not a single time competition video of the BRZ. They're all videos of my s2k. Unless using a personal timing device (as pictured, suction cupped onto the windshield) makes it competitive.

That 5th link is... interesting.
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Old 06-14-2013, 02:25 PM   #115
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"And more interesting, there are alot of people who track their cars with a tune on this forum but its not happening to them?"
They are not all running the same tune, with the same intake/exhaust setups, under the same conditions.
You're right. Some with the seal issue aren't running a tune at all as revealed by @pheoxs inquisition. Unless people are outright telling him they don't have a tune when they do, half the people who spoke up had left their ECU untouched.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...5&postcount=56

The only commonalities were being NA and having run at the track.
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Old 06-14-2013, 02:27 PM   #116
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Well, I do hope you Guys get it sorted out. Obviously, continuing to put new motors in the car can't go on for long. Here's a vid from the OP:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOeGz2W63OM"]Scion FR-S Chasing Porsche 997 GT3 @ Circuit Of The Americas (Track) - YouTube[/ame]
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Old 06-14-2013, 02:37 PM   #117
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this... exactly... this problem will only effect few of us...



what? so what about the guys who have complete injector seal failure? In the cases where the injector seal is completely burnt off? you dont think sudden blow-by, during the combustion cycle, of the injectors can't cause popping?

or more so for the guys who's injector seals are still in tact but the injectors are still burnt past the seal?

And more interesting, there are alot of people who track their cars with a tune on this forum but its not happening to them?

thats why i'm guessing the blame is on a rare case of tolerances during manufacturing
Maybe it's just wishful thinking, but it appears all of the problems are caused by detonation. What varies is what parts fail first, the di, the di seal, or sparkplug. Some cars have had multiple failures. The majority of the cars with issues have been tracked. So, hopefully what toyota south Africa has released fixes the detonation problem for cars driven aggressively and it's not a hardware problem.

One thing I wonder is with the people who also have coil pack failures if a destroyed sparkplug could cause the coil pack to fail.

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Old 06-14-2013, 03:36 PM   #118
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no offense, i'm ESL, but to me these sound like:

1. "...I think there are some things working against you here. 1st, those videos are mostly all "timed events"..." => "going to the track to push your car and your driving skills to the limit is wrong and can void your warranty as you should really be just cruising around 2-3k rpm" ftw is the difference if it's officially timed or not if the point of going to the track is actually drive it at its limits?

2. "Thousands ... drive these cars aggressively every day ...Given the ratio of cars ... adjusted for those that had the ECU played with, what are the odds ..., the odds are astronomically in favor of something other than a manufacturing issue... " => "there is an obvious conspiracy on this forum against the most reliable car maker (who always sorts it out and make it right at their expense and have a proven record of doing right by owners) because all the people who have blown their engines are dishonest - they either participate in timed events or have ecu tune, or both, and they spread lies about toyota/subaru and their quality and willingness/readiness to address any issues because they want their engine fixed under warranty"

or did I get it wrong?

oh and that disclaimer "..I'm not accusing you of being dishonest..." really doesn't sound sincere
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:37 PM   #119
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We need to add "which cylinder did the seal fail on?" to the poll.
Every fail I've seen has been on cylinder one and I don't understand why.
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:42 PM   #120
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no offense, i'm ESL, but to me these sound like:

1. "...I think there are some things working against you here. 1st, those videos are mostly all "timed events"..." => "going to the track to push your car and your driving skills to the limit is wrong and can void your warranty as you should really be just cruising around 2-3k rpm" ftw is the difference if it's officially timed or not if the point of going to the track is actually drive it at its limits?

2. "Thousands ... drive these cars aggressively every day ...Given the ratio of cars ... adjusted for those that had the ECU played with, what are the odds ..., the odds are astronomically in favor of something other than a manufacturing issue... " => "there is an obvious conspiracy on this forum against the most reliable car maker (who always sorts it out and make it right at their expense and have a proven record of doing right by owners) because all the people who have blown their engines are dishonest - they either participate in timed events or have ecu tune, or both, and they spread lies about toyota/subaru and their quality and willingness/readiness to address any issues because they want their engine fixed under warranty"

or did I get it wrong?

oh and that disclaimer "..I'm not accusing you of being dishonest..." really doesn't sound sincere
The dude works for Toyota or Subaru, its pretty clear...
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:44 PM   #121
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Second, you've had two identical motor issues, similar to those known to coincidentally result from lean condition AM "tune" failures. Given the ratio of cars in service to cars with DI leaks, adjusted for those that had the ECU played with, what are the odds that one car with no tune would have this happen twice? I don't know the number, but as it stands currently, the odds are astronomically in favor of something other than a manufacturing issue affecting your car. Those odds are doubled since its happened twice. I'm not accusing you of being dishonest, but I understand Subaru's position.
Then what are you accusing him of? Are you an engineer? Do you have information that we are not privy to?
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:55 PM   #122
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Well, I do hope you Guys get it sorted out. Obviously, continuing to put new motors in the car can't go on for long. Here's a vid from the OP:
Can you point to the section of the warranty prohibits this?
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:55 PM   #123
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Eh, the drama got less fun and became tedious and annoying.

Speculate all you want on whether or not people are lying about having a stock drivetrain or whether or not the problem is solely related to aftermarket mawds.

It's happening, how widespread is it: does it affect EVERYONE if they drive their car hard or is it a minority that are susceptible?
What is the official response as reported by people who have the problem?
Everything else is just stroking your e-peen.

This has me nervous to do a track day, I've been putting it off but I think I'll just do it anyway.
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:56 PM   #124
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Or any info that I'm not privy to?

Must I remind you (in case you didn't see in the other thread) that the BRZ is NOT my car? I just drive it.... lol

We're willing to make our car/engine/ecu/whatever available for examination by anyone and everyone who is qualified. There's nothing to hide here.
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:57 PM   #125
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Tag you are it.

Find root cause, develop action plan, apply appropriate fixes.

There is enough data now, damage and even TSB from other markets point to issues with the fuel system parts and tuning.

We as owners will never get a straight answer from the OEM on what they are doing, the problem etc.

They want the younger crowd, the aftermarket support and enthusiast and press attention? It all comes at a cost, their owners are going to expect a high level of service and transparency Toyota and Subaru are not equipped to provide at this point.
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Old 06-14-2013, 03:59 PM   #126
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I wonder if this has anything to do with break in, easy vs. hard. The seal might require heat cycling before it becomes resistant to deterioration...

Would also explain why it's happening repeatedly on cars that failed before, they didn't "break in" the seals. Please prove me wrong on this one.
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