Data Logs! Post them here.

[cjd]

Originally Posted by steve99

High positive fuel trim can be indicator to exhaust leak, or cracked header. 02 sees fresh air at lower rpm between exhaust pulses.Ecu thinks its lean adds fuel via fuel trims.Looks like you have some knock as well at lower rpm causing iam to drop to 0.7 are you on 91 or 93 fuel ?

93 winter fuel on a 91 tune (stage 2)

I don't like the sound of cracked header

[steve99]

Originally Posted by cjd

93 winter fuel on a 91 tune (stage 2)

I don't like the sound of cracked header

you will usually hear it or be able to smell exhaust fumes in engine bay if header/overpipe is leaking/cracked

[cjd]

Originally Posted by steve99

you will usually hear it or be able to smell exhaust fumes in engine bay if header/overpipe is leaking/cracked

Nothing obvious, but it was nice out and I had the windows open. On the other hand, it seemed something changed after a while, suggesting it might be related to heat, therefore... Exhaust. I'll check the O2 sensors first. I had trouble installing the motor mounts so who knows what might have happened. Bah.

Thanks for the tips! I have a race in 2 weeks so we'll see...

edit: you said engine bay, I'll check that. Was thinking from inside the car, which happened to me on my old car and a cracked exhaust manifold.

[Wepeel]

Originally Posted by steve99

Have you made any edits on the tune, that rearly weird behaviour
either the car has a hardware problem, or something rearly weird is going on like weird tune corruption.

I would try running a stock rom and see if it does same thing, you will get cel code p0420 ( you culd disable it in stock tune but no need for test) , car wont blow up with catless header on stock tune.
if stock tune is ok then that eliminated problem with car\sensors


the rear o2 sensor is used forcruise fueling adjustment i believe, maybe lg parameter "wideband 02" as that is rear sensor and see it looksok comaed to front sensor, it will be ddifferent as scaling isff but should show if sensor is stuffed.

Okay, so I flashed back to stock and noticed the same behavior - AFR/Commanded AFR start somewhat normal, then during steady highway cruise they steadily decrease until the car just goes to open loop all the time. On the stock tune (I didn't swap back to stock header, just reflashed to stock), I did get a P2096.

So on the OFT, there is the 'Wideband O2' and the 'O2S2' voltage. The Wideband O2 stayed at a steady 17.00 the entire time, O2S2 voltage was 0.00. The weird thing is, on my torque app I can pull up an O2 sensor voltage that reports meaningful numbers (between 0.5 and 0.8 volts). I swapped between OFT and Torque just to make sure I was reading at the same time. I unplugged the O2 sensor harness, and the OFT measurement showed non-number values, but nothing changed in the OFT parameters. So I'm not sure what the OFT parameters are reporting. Odd.

Anyway, I think I at least ruled out a software issue. I guess it's time to get back under the car to hunt around for leaks. I do notice that when idling for extended periods of time, like at autocross, LTFT can creep up in the teens, but it takes a while for that to happen - I never see that anywhere else but idling at autocross.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Wepeel

Okay, so I flashed back to stock and noticed the same behavior - AFR/Commanded AFR start somewhat normal, then during steady highway cruise they steadily decrease until the car just goes to open loop all the time. On the stock tune (I didn't swap back to stock header, just reflashed to stock), I did get a P2096.

So on the OFT, there is the 'Wideband O2' and the 'O2S2' voltage. The Wideband O2 stayed at a steady 17.00 the entire time, O2S2 voltage was 0.00. The weird thing is, on my torque app I can pull up an O2 sensor voltage that reports meaningful numbers (between 0.5 and 0.8 volts). I swapped between OFT and Torque just to make sure I was reading at the same time. I unplugged the O2 sensor harness, and the OFT measurement showed non-number values, but nothing changed in the OFT parameters. So I'm not sure what the OFT parameters are reporting. Odd.

Anyway, I think I at least ruled out a software issue. I guess it's time to get back under the car to hunt around for leaks. I do notice that when idling for extended periods of time, like at autocross, LTFT can creep up in the teens, but it takes a while for that to happen - I never see that anywhere else but idling at autocross.

AFR is front o2 sensor used for fueling


Wideband 02 is REAR 02 sensor used for cat efficiency checks and has some influence on cruising fueling aparantly, but this is not calibrated in oft to correctly read with stock sensor but it should not be constantly 17 it should vary a bit.


02S2 I think will be rear 02 volts and probably explains whey the afr never changes as volts never changes.


its possible the rear 02 sensor is stuffed and may be causing that weird behaviour, but I am not 100%.

[Silver86K]

Originally Posted by steve99

Yep that flkc over 5500 is knock. don't worry too much about the -0.65 but the stuff over -1 needs sorting out.


on your fuel I would try adjusting the PI/DI fueling ratios so you run full Direct injection until 7200 rpm.


look at the PI/DI ratio tables in the E85 fuel roms and change the axis as is done in those (all three tables cold/warm/hot


running the DI up to 7200 help with knock on your fuels.


we did this for @sav with good results, assume your in south africa


as per the bottom table


The ltft is a bit off at lower rpm might be extremes of temp causing that, if it does not selle down you might want to do a bit of maf scaling


also your running a bit leaner than commanded AFR ie your measured AFR is leaner than Commanded (what ecu is asking for) so again a bit of maf scaling will help you as you will run a bit richer higher rpm which will help with knock

Hi Steve,

So I changed the map so DI runs until 7200rpm and did a log now after riding with the tune for about 500 kms (didnt have a chance to log earlier)

Here is the log wonder if you can have a look:

Again AFR and Commanded AFR look good, still getting some FLKC but it has reduced a bit. LTFT is still worrying me. And this is the first time ever my IAM has not been at 1, but rather at 0.94 throughout the log.

It is a pretty cool day so no excessive temps during this log

http://www.datazap.me/u/86driver/95-...zoom=5286-5981

[Wepeel]

Originally Posted by steve99

AFR is front o2 sensor used for fueling


Wideband 02 is REAR 02 sensor used for cat efficiency checks and has some influence on cruising fueling aparantly, but this is not calibrated in oft to correctly read with stock sensor but it should not be constantly 17 it should vary a bit.


02S2 I think will be rear 02 volts and probably explains whey the afr never changes as volts never changes.


its possible the rear 02 sensor is stuffed and may be causing that weird behaviour, but I am not 100%.

I wonder what the torque app is reading for O2 sensor then? Can anyone else with an OFT verify what they get for Wideband O2 and O2S2 Volts?

Doing some reading, the code I got seems to be one associated with using a spacer for the O2 (which i'm not). I remember when I got the OFH the threading was a bit tight but I thought I had it threaded in all the way. Looks like I need to double check.

Found a post by @arghx7 about the role of the rear O2 in cruise AFR.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...48&postcount=6

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Wepeel

I wonder what the torque app is reading for O2 sensor then? Can anyone else with an OFT verify what they get for Wideband O2 and O2S2 Volts?

Doing some reading, the code I got seems to be one associated with using a spacer for the O2 (which i'm not). I remember when I got the OFH the threading was a bit tight but I thought I had it threaded in all the way. Looks like I need to double check.

Found a post by @arghx7 about the role of the rear O2 in cruise AFR.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...48&postcount=6

i think you found you problem , O2 sensors should screw in by hand, use a thread chaser\tap M18 by 1.5 to clean up the threads in header, its likely damaged threads on sensor and it leaking or the sensor is damaged from excess torque applied to fit\remove

always use new gaskets on header as well

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Wepeel

I wonder what the torque app is reading for O2 sensor then? Can anyone else with an OFT verify what they get for Wideband O2 and O2S2 Volts?

Doing some reading, the code I got seems to be one associated with using a spacer for the O2 (which i'm not). I remember when I got the OFH the threading was a bit tight but I thought I had it threaded in all the way. Looks like I need to double check.

Found a post by @arghx7 about the role of the rear O2 in cruise AFR.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...48&postcount=6

torque will read the primary 02sensor

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Silver86K

Hi Steve,

So I changed the map so DI runs until 7200rpm and did a log now after riding with the tune for about 500 kms (didnt have a chance to log earlier)

Here is the log wonder if you can have a look:

Again AFR and Commanded AFR look good, still getting some FLKC but it has reduced a bit. LTFT is still worrying me. And this is the first time ever my IAM has not been at 1, but rather at 0.94 throughout the log.

It is a pretty cool day so no excessive temps during this log

http://www.datazap.me/u/86driver/95-...zoom=5286-5981

0.94 iam is nothing to worry about on stock tune the iam on 95 ron runs arroujd 0.3 or even less

its likely dropped slightly due some minor knock arround 2000-3500 as you get on the throttle.

do a couple of light steady throttle runs from 2000 to about 6500 in second or third that will probably get your iam back to 1

then log and find where your getting negitive flkc and fbkc over about -0.7 then maybe pull about 0.7 out on the map in those load rpm areas

if you message a guy called @sav he may send you a map

[Wepeel]

Originally Posted by steve99

torque will read the primary 02sensor

Ok, Shiv replied that I should ignore the O2S2 on the OFT since that will always read zero. So looks like the torque O2 sensor voltage reading is the good one. Torque also has the AFR sensor voltage as well.

[Silver86K]

Originally Posted by steve99

0.94 iam is nothing to worry about on stock tune the iam on 95 ron runs arroujd 0.3 or even less

its likely dropped slightly due some minor knock arround 2000-3500 as you get on the throttle.

do a couple of light steady throttle runs from 2000 to about 6500 in second or third that will probably get your iam back to 1

then log and find where your getting negitive flkc and fbkc over about -0.7 then maybe pull about 0.7 out on the map in those load rpm areas

if you message a guy called @sav he may send you a map

Thanks Steve,

When I pull 0.7 timing out of those areas of the map in rom raider, I select the cells I want to change and then type in 0.7 do I then click the up or down buttons next to it? So in other words do I make the value in the cells less or more?

Would you recommend a Maf Scale as well to get the LTFT to decent numbers?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Silver86K

Thanks Steve,

When I pull 0.7 timing out of those areas of the map in rom raider, I select the cells I want to change and then type in 0.7 do I then click the up or down buttons next to it? So in other words do I make the value in the cells less or more?

Would you recommend a Maf Scale as well to get the LTFT to decent numbers?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

less timing ie pull 0.7 is same as saying subtract 0.7

[Silver86K]

Originally Posted by steve99

less timing ie pull 0.7 is same as saying subtract 0.7

Cool that is what I thought and been doing thanks

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk