Open Letter to Potential FR-S Buyers & Disillusioned Owners

[eikond]

I don't necessary agree with the original post. his theory is that you are better off paying $35k for a new car than buying a $25k car and modifying it.

While that might be correct for a honda civic vs. 370z comparison, I don't think it's accurate for a FRS vs. Cayman comparison.

We've seen a number of journalists compare the GT86 platform to a Cayman, Lotus, etc.. These are cars that have similar handling, response, steering, etc.. Yet these cars have better hp to weight ratios and thus are faster cars. The base Cayman is $52k... Put $25k into a new FRS and it would be much faster than a Cayman.

For $10k you can do forced induction and exhaust and suspension and be well over 325whp (that comes with the Cayman S).

I have yet to find a new car for under $35k that would be a better driver's car than a properly built $35k FRS.

[Davey]

Originally Posted by eikond

I don't necessary agree with the original post. his theory is that you are better off paying $35k for a new car than buying a $25k car and modifying it.

While that might be correct for a honda civic vs. 370z comparison, I don't think it's accurate for a FRS vs. Cayman comparison.

We've seen a number of journalists compare the GT86 platform to a Cayman, Lotus, etc.. These are cars that have similar handling, response, steering, etc.. Yet these cars have better hp to weight ratios and thus are faster cars. The base Cayman is $52k... Put $25k into a new FRS and it would be much faster than a Cayman.

For $10k you can do forced induction and exhaust and suspension and be well over 325whp (that comes with the Cayman S).

I have yet to find a new car for under $35k that would be a better driver's car than a properly built $35k FRS.

That's basically how I see it, too.

Of course dumping $10K into a $25K car is dumb but so is buying a $35K sports car. If we were so damned financially responsible we'd all be driving around in 10-year-old 4-door Hondas.

[SuiSid3l]

This car was made for two reasons: For the budget minded who want a practical daily driver that's near perfectly built and tons of fun to drive and those who would seek out great tuner cars who aren't concerned with achieving the reliability of a camry on a 400hp car.

If your not one of those two types of people then you should look elsewhere. If your even having that conversation in this thread you should buy another car. Let us not also forget that maintenance on this car is going to be a lot cheaper than a step up bmw or audi too. Yes they will be more reliable and the quality of the car stock will be noticeable, but people shouldn't be buying a BRZ or an FR-S for that reason.

[Hot Lava]

Originally Posted by Vracer111

How dare you take the name of Texas in vain!!



Actually, being we have thousands and thousands of miles of roadway and hilly and mountainous regions, there's bound to at least be some nice curvy roads based on statistics alone. There's quite a few in the Hill country (Central Texas) and Sabine national forest area (East Texas) I've been on....unfortunately not yet in my FRS.

Good of you to to throw that one back at me. I being an ex Texan feel I have the privilege to give you guys a hard time. Been all over the Great State of Texas but must missed the hill country so was unaware that there were actually curvy road there.

[UltramarineLuck]

Originally Posted by Davey

Not really what I meant, I'm sure you know this.

Any car will degrade if not driven. I'm saying Porsche service prices are targeted toward the checkbook of a guy who buys a $70K+ car, and the parts aren't cheap, either.

I think that remains to be seen, really, because you're simply imagining what parts break just as I am imagining what might go wrong on a 5-year-old Porsche that has seen less than 50K track miles.

Why aren't we all driving Caymans and Boxters then? You can pick one up for thousands less than you paid for your FR-S. Why don't you drive one?

I don't drive a Porsche because I got my car for $21k with 55 miles on the ODO and I don't plan on installing any FI system in my car, otherwise I WOULD be in a Cayman. I had PCNA as a client for a few years and the Cayman is my all-time favorite car. In a few years, when 987s drop below ~$25k, I very well may pick one up.

I'm not "imagining" what parts break on either car - I've seen the IMS failures in the 986 and all you have to do is ask Crawford what they were able to break in the FA20 on their way to 400hp+. It is no secret that FI requires a lot of money in supporting mods and you'll get through consumables a bit faster.

Luckily, the FT86 was built with the spirit of the Cayman experience in mind (early benchmarking is qualification enough of that) and comes in $10k cheaper with a better rate and a warranty cause it's a new car.

[UltramarineLuck]

Originally Posted by eikond

I don't necessary agree with the original post. his theory is that you are better off paying $35k for a new car than buying a $25k car and modifying it.

While that might be correct for a honda civic vs. 370z comparison, I don't think it's accurate for a FRS vs. Cayman comparison.

We've seen a number of journalists compare the GT86 platform to a Cayman, Lotus, etc.. These are cars that have similar handling, response, steering, etc.. Yet these cars have better hp to weight ratios and thus are faster cars. The base Cayman is $52k... Put $25k into a new FRS and it would be much faster than a Cayman.

For $10k you can do forced induction and exhaust and suspension and be well over 325whp (that comes with the Cayman S).

I have yet to find a new car for under $35k that would be a better driver's car than a properly built $35k FRS.

You largely missed the point. A 987 Cayman (and even an Elise) can be had in excellent condition for ~$32k+. To me, that's a better option for the money than someone who doesn't really know what they're getting themselves into by buying a $25k Toyobaru and dropping a bunch of money into it for FI and supporting mods. Disappointment is around every corner, and there are people in this thread who have experienced it.

You pretty much nailed what I'm talking about with the comparison of $10k in an FR-S creating more whp than a Cayman S.

This was more a response to a Facebook post in an enthusiast group about the car than anything (that had a lot of really uneducated discussion going on in the comments). Maybe it will save someone some money and heartache, similar the the "Don't mod your car unless you know what you're getting into" thread I read on this very forum a month or two ago.

[Davey]

Originally Posted by UltramarineLuck

I don't drive a Porsche because I got my car for $21k with 55 miles on the ODO and I don't plan on installing any FI system in my car, otherwise I WOULD be in a Cayman. I had PCNA as a client for a few years and the Cayman is my all-time favorite car. In a few years, when 987s drop below ~$25k, I very well may pick one up.

I'm not "imagining" what parts break on either car - I've seen the IMS failures in the 986 and all you have to do is ask Crawford what they were able to break in the FA20 on their way to 400hp+. It is no secret that FI requires a lot of money in supporting mods and you'll get through consumables a bit faster.

Luckily, the FT86 was built with the spirit of the Cayman experience in mind (early benchmarking is qualification enough of that) and comes in $10k cheaper with a better rate and a warranty cause it's a new car.

So if I understand correctly, you didn't buy a Porsche because you want a new car but you think I should buy a used one, you're talking about IMS in a discussion about a 2009+ car, and you're talking about Crawford's 400+ HP turbo build when we're discussing a mild supercharged build which has been thoroughly tested at around ~270 whp and uses the stock clutch, fuel system, etc.

You are really not making a lot of sense here.

[eikond]

Originally Posted by UltramarineLuck

You largely missed the point. A 987 Cayman (and even an Elise) can be had in excellent condition for ~$32k+. To me, that's a better option for the money than someone who doesn't really know what they're getting themselves into by buying a $25k Toyobaru and dropping a bunch of money into it for FI and supporting mods. Disappointment is around every corner, and there are people in this thread who have experienced it.

I don't think you can make a fair comparison between any new car and a used car. Now you're comparing apples and oranges. Throw the entire topic out.. too many variables come into play (age, cleanliness, prior use/abuse, rust or damage, how many prior owners, WARRANTY - I know the motor would be void due to modification, but other warranty would still apply).

Sure you can pick up a 5 year old Cayman or an Elise for around $30k, but you can get a used FRS for under $20k.. You can get a used C6 Z06 for under $25k. You could get used 240sx for under $2k, put $23k into it and it would probably spank a Cayman.

[Sarlacc]

Originally Posted by lsxiong

The people complaining that this car is slow is driving the car all wrong! You're NOT suppose to drive it in a straight line. Turn on your blinkers and sway the car from left to right as you drive forward.

I think I want a Ford Transit van after watching that.

[Davey]

Originally Posted by eikond

I don't think you can make a fair comparison between any new car and a used car. Now you're comparing apples and oranges. Throw the entire topic out.. too many variables come into play (age, cleanliness, prior use/abuse, rust or damage, how many prior owners, WARRANTY - I know the motor would be void due to modification, but other warranty would still apply).

Sure you can pick up a 5 year old Cayman or an Elise for around $30k, but you can get a used FRS for under $20k.. You can get a used C6 Z06 for under $25k. You could get used 240sx for under $2k, put $23k into it and it would probably spank a Cayman.

A $30K Elise is more like an '05, and those things are all death traps anyway. I would not even want to get in a low-speed collision with a Yaris in one.

I agree though that the used vs. new debate is out of place. New is new, used is not. How about a Ferrari 308 GTS we picked up for $40K, which are barely faster than the BRZ (or actually pretty close to dead even.) I'm sure that would be way less reliable than a FI BRZ.

[SkAsphalt]

Originally Posted by Annahra

Yeah, I'd say you have to own the car for a good 6-12 months before you can really comment on how you feel about it. EVERYONE is super excited when they buy it; it's when you drive the car day in, day out that you really learn if it's the perfect car for you.

2 years of ownership, love the f*** out of it.

Also dumped about 10G into it...so I guess my response to this letter is that I am very happy with my car, money spent or not

[OnkelC]

1 year owner here and I use it as my DD. wouldn't want to swap it for anything else

[billwot]

Originally Posted by eikond

I don't necessary agree with the original post. his theory is that you are better off paying $35k for a new car than buying a $25k car and modifying it.

While that might be correct for a honda civic vs. 370z comparison, I don't think it's accurate for a FRS vs. Cayman comparison.

We've seen a number of journalists compare the GT86 platform to a Cayman, Lotus, etc.. These are cars that have similar handling, response, steering, etc.. Yet these cars have better hp to weight ratios and thus are faster cars. The base Cayman is $52k... Put $25k into a new FRS and it would be much faster than a Cayman.

For $10k you can do forced induction and exhaust and suspension and be well over 325whp (that comes with the Cayman S).

I have yet to find a new car for under $35k that would be a better driver's car than a properly built $35k FRS.

But it still ain't a Porsche!

[Davey]

Originally Posted by billwot

But it still ain't a Porsche!

TBH, I'd be kind of glad of that.