more grip?

[aesthetect]

so both the FR-S and BRZ (so far) come with 215/45-17s, and i believe some of the reviewers likened them to the low resistance tires used on prius' (ie low grip), obviously for a net function of easy to swing the ass out around a corner given teh modest torque capabilities.

as i would imagine im not the only one thinking about switching wheels i figured id ask... i cant help but feel the need to put wider wheels and tires on there, but really wouldnt want to mess with what i imagine to be a delicate balance.

i dont really plan on 'drifting' in the literal sense, but would still like a bit of that excitement when on the track. so those with more rwd or maybe drifting experience than me, what are your thoughts? how wide would you go? what kind of impact would you expect this to make?

i guess a lot of the answer lies in the "wait and we shall see" but cant help but wonder already

[Racecomp Engineering]

Before people start talking about widths....remember, tire compound is more important than tire width if grip is your goal.

Choose your compound first based on how you'll use the car and go from there.

- Andrew

[aesthetect]

very true, i meant to imply both together in a general consideration of 'grip'.... first step being just moving to summer/tarmac compounds in the same size

[Racecomp Engineering]

Roger that.....to answer your question then.....

A 225/45/17 in a good summer tire compound would be a good small step up for a fun daily driver occasional track/auto-x car and there are a lot of choices in that size.

245/40/17 would work well for a little more grip at the track or auto-x. I believe there are good choices in that size as well.

Remember to look at the big picture. More tire grip means more body roll, so suspension upgrades may be nice to have when throwing sticky tires on. It's a system and worth looking at everything. Obviously going huge will mean a lot of grip if that's what you're after, but it'll feel like crap on stock suspension and just isn't really needed for a street car anyway.

EDIT: and i expect equal sizing front to rear will work very well for most people. 16 inch wheels/tires may be worth considering as well.

- andrew

[Dave-ROR]

I'm going for 235/40/17s, wider and better overall gearing than stock. IMO for autocross the better than stock gearing will offset the 10mm wider width of the 245/40 which results in a taller than stock gearing ratio.. low hp momentum cars like shorter gearing

[aesthetect]

yeah, for autox i can imagine the benefit from the overall lower diameter, but there youve also got a clearer answer of wanting max grip. although i guess theres the counter argument that the flat torque curve could make use of a full rpm range and not need to stay up at peak hp, particularly as its reported to trail off before redline.. although i guess its a slight enough change to maybe come down to shift points and cone layout anyway

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Roger that.....to answer your question then.....

A 225/45/17 in a good summer tire compound would be a good small step up for a fun daily driver occasional track/auto-x car and there are a lot of choices in that size.

245/40/17 would work well for a little more grip at the track or auto-x. I believe there are good choices in that size as well.

Remember to look at the big picture. More tire grip means more body roll, so suspension upgrades may be nice to have when throwing sticky tires on. It's a system and worth looking at everything. Obviously going huge will mean a lot of grip if that's what you're after, but it'll feel like crap on stock suspension and just isn't really needed for a street car anyway.

EDIT: and i expect equal sizing front to rear will work very well for most people. 16 inch wheels/tires may be worth considering as well.

- andrew

i guess what im getting at is i definitely plan on moving to a quality tire (star spec, advan neova) for predictable break-away, stiff sidewall, etc. but am realizing that since this car isnt all about grip, too much may just detract from sideways fun with the less fulfilling side effect of only marginally reduced lap times

although you are certainly right, suspension plays an equal part and would to be factored into the overall balance, im kind of assuming that would be done accordingly.

i suppose the E30 M3 guys' tire selection (lessons regarding balance of drift and lap times) may be a good place to start, being FR with similar power and weight...

[Racecomp Engineering]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

I'm going for 235/40/17s, wider and better overall gearing than stock. IMO for autocross the better than stock gearing will offset the 10mm wider width of the 245/40 which results in a taller than stock gearing ratio.. low hp momentum cars like shorter gearing

Agreed....for auto-x a smaller diameter will certainly help.

Originally Posted by aesthetect

i guess what im getting at is i definitely plan on moving to a quality tire (star spec, advan neova) for predictable break-away, stiff sidewall, etc. but am realizing that since this car isnt all about grip, too much may just detract from sideways fun with the less fulfilling side effect of only marginally reduced lap times

although you are certainly right, suspension plays an equal part and would to be factored into the overall balance, im kind of assuming that would be done accordingly.

i suppose the E30 M3 guys' tire selection (lessons regarding balance of drift and lap times) may be a good place to start, being FR with similar power and weight...

I hear ya. I preach about tire compound being important, but my DD (mini cooper s) has 195 lame all seasons on right now and it is just a total blast to drive.

Lots of STI and EVO guys end up with super wide tires and it just isn't as fun sometimes as a medium sized tire that can make the car dance. It's all gonna be about balance and making it work for what you want the car to do. That said, I don't think a good tire with grip will make the car "worse" to drive.

The E30 M3 comparison is interesting. I've always wanted one of those....

- Andrew

[subaruslow]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Agreed....for auto-x a smaller diameter will certainly help.




I hear ya. I preach about tire compound being important, but my DD (mini cooper s) has 195 lame all seasons on right now and it is just a total blast to drive.

Lots of STI and EVO guys end up with super wide tires and it just isn't as fun sometimes as a medium sized tire that can make the car dance. It's all gonna be about balance and making it work for what you want the car to do.

The E30 M3 comparison is interesting. I've always wanted one of those....

- Andrew

I was very impressed with my brothers mini s on the all seasons but I always imagined how amazing it would be with better tires.

[aesthetect]

Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering

Lots of STI and EVO guys end up with super wide tires and it just isn't as fun sometimes as a medium sized tire that can make the car dance. It's all gonna be about balance and making it work for what you want the car to do.

The E30 M3 comparison is interesting. I've always wanted one of those....

- Andrew

yeah my subarus got a hell of a lot more grip than power so ive always just embraced that, really not that much fun though

which has left me wanting an E30 (or something just as light, driver centric, rwd and also relatively easy on the gas) for some time.. but its really surprising how many options there ARENT in that space... i was looking for other similar models to get tire ideas, theres obviously not really anything new anymore, S13/14s are pretty close.. too bad theyre only ever built to drift as much as possible now

plus it would really make sense for me to get something 'new' that i wont have to be wrenching on all the time (and not swapping motors) ...enter the BRZ-FRS

[NESW20]

you guys are weird if you don't think grip is fun.

[old greg]

Originally Posted by NESW20

you guys are weird if you don't think grip is fun.

Grip isn't fun or boring, it's just grip. Being right on the edge of running out of grip, now that's fun. You can get there with lots of grip or with very little grip, but the more grip you have the more power you need and the more dangerous/illegal/expensive it gets. Having lots of grip on an underpowered car just makes it harder to get to that point, so if you aren't chasing lap times it isn't really all that great.

[blur]

I think I might go with some Continental extremeContact DW as I hear they have a nice mix of dry/wet traction, durability, road noise, and comfort. As for wheels... I think I'll stay in the stock width but I'll go up in diameter, maybe 17s.... white CR Kai for street and occasional track duty

[aesthetect]

i believe stock is 17..?

contiextreme contact are great, for all seasons. also good in the dirt

[blur]

Stock is 16 low spec at least, which is what I plan on getting.