VVT Tuning Noise - ADDED: Comparison Video

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

This thread needs an update. It is scaring people to think that the noise from the cam phasing is going to cause damage or is bad for the car when it really isn't an issue unless there is a different issue (and it still hasn't proven to cause an issue other the fuel pressure pulsing as far as I know).

I disagree. I wouldn't have bought my initial tune if I knew it created that rattle noise. I'm not buying another that does.

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[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by vtmike

I disagree. I wouldn't have bought my initial tune if I knew it created that rattle noise. I'm not buying another that does.

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It the noise like what I posted in my videos or something different?

[regal]

Originally Posted by vtmike

I disagree. I wouldn't have bought my initial tune if I knew it created that rattle noise. I'm not buying another that does.

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But its there fairly loud on at least one of the factory tunes. I just received my tatrix and hope to have my second car fixed soon so I can play with the latest factory tune. I'm very curious if the newer factory tunes are quieter.

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

It the noise like what I posted in my videos or something different?

Mine was a loud metallic vibration noise, kind of like heat shield vibration from 3700 remember to 4k rpms . Went back to oem tune (a01c I think, includes injector fix) and if it does make the noise it's quiet enough I really don't hear it. It was loud enough on the tune my wife noticed it and asked if there was something wrong with my car, and she rarely rides in it and isn't a car person.

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[regal]

That video is no b.s. , Avo knows the FA20 well. Can anyone make out what the Aussie is saying the oil pressure drops to?

[xjohnx]

Originally Posted by regal

That video is no b.s. , Avo knows the FA20 well. Can anyone make out what the Aussie is saying the oil pressure drops to?

I'm not sure he says what it will drop to, he does say that the switch that triggers the oil dummy-light triggers only below 4 psi, though.

[w00t692]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

THE ISSUE:
I have heard this is multiple tunes, including the Perrin, Vish, and Visconti.
Vish explained it's simply a large change in VVT timing in a small amount of RPMs. (5 to 40 degrees)

I'd like more technical information on what exactly is creating the noise. Perrin said its resonance, Vish said its "rasp." Sounds like shit, and like valvetrain noise to me. With all of the tuning drama recently...

I'd like a straight answer as to mechanically what is happening, because if the long term effects of reducing torque dip has mechanical implications I want the VVT timing cut back.

SOUNDS OF THE MODIFIED VVT TUNING TO REDUCE TORQUE DIP
Here are the logs to accompany the video:





New comparison video, stock VVT map vs aggressive VVT tune:

Noise can be heard here Perrin Tune: at time -31.00 and -23.00

http://www.freesound.org/people/dezoris/sounds/191194/



And here on Vish dyno: At 22 Seconds

At 22 Seconds


UPDATE: 3/11

Perrin modified my flash file to go back to a stockish VVT map from 2800-4200RPM range. After the flash the valve train noise is now gone.

The argument remains, tuners say the noise introduced from the optimal/aggressive VVT tuning is normal. Tuning VVT agressively can be done on FI or NA the same way, depends on the motor on how much noise it generates.

Given the unproven long term mechanical implications of those statements (if any) going back to a conservative VVT setting is good insurance for now.

I run anywhere from zero to 40 degrees in my civic's tune and i have 123k miles. Does that reassure you enough? Sure it's not the same car, but it's exactly the same type of oil pressure VVT system.

The MANUFACTURER THEMSELVES designed that VVT system, if it wasn't safe to spin it around to 40 degrees and back to zero it wouldn't exist...

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by l0aded

Installed my OFT today with STG 1 91octane. Injen+Catback and I heard the sound and thought my car was blowing up. Then I ran into this thread.. I agree that it is more pronounced in 3rd gear going up a hill at WOT as that is when I noticed it.

Here is the log for that pull if anyone cares.
http://datazap.me/u/l0aded/run2?log=0&data=1-2-5-6-9

Honestly a little sad to hear it as I really enjoy the extra kick but the sound is pretty annoying.

That log isn't helpful in determining if the noise is bad or not, you need to have the VVT angles logged as well as fuel pressure. If there's a wave in the DI pressure then it's problematic, if there's no wave then it's just resonance/rasp.

[Amadeus]

Is this only audible in 3rd and 4th gears at around 3,700-4,000 rpm? If there is the same amount of VVT timing change in that rpm range regardless of the gear selected then that might suggest it's just resonance. Lots of people have been driving on NA and FI tunes with aggressive VVT timing changes for well over a year now so there's no need to panic. It would be nice to have a definitive answer either way since that sound is unpleasant.

@Dezoris Dyno update?

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by Amadeus

Is this only audible in 3rd and 4th gears at around 3,700-4,000 rpm? If there is the same amount of VVT timing change in that rpm range regardless of the gear selected then that might suggest it's just resonance. Lots of people have been driving on NA and FI tunes with aggressive VVT timing changes for well over a year now so there's no need to panic. It would be nice to have a definitive answer either way since that sound is unpleasant.

@Dezoris Dyno update?

It's been a while since I was running the tune but I'm pretty sure it was much louder in 3rd and 4th vs 1st and 2nd. Mine didn't sound like the ticking that there is audio posted here of. Also not what I would consider rasp. Sounds like something metal vibrating like an exhaust heat shield or something. But at high frequency so you can't hear each individual tick like the video.

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[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by vtmike

It's been a while since I was running the tune but I'm pretty sure it was much louder in 3rd and 4th vs 1st and 2nd. Mine didn't sound like the ticking that there is audio posted here of. Also not what I would consider rasp. Sounds like something metal vibrating like an exhaust heat shield or something. But at high frequency so you can't hear each individual tick like the video.

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It is louder due to load. If it was an issue with the changing process, it would be loudest in low gears because they are the ones where you are blowing through the rang fastest and therefor forcing the system to change advance the fastest.

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

It is louder due to load. If it was an issue with the changing process, it would be loudest in low gears because they are the ones where you are blowing through the rang fastest and therefor forcing the system to change advance the fastest.

Not 100% but could have been more load dependent. I also had a tip in knock issue with the tune that was never resolved. It was the fa20club stage 2, got it before the fall out.

From everything I've seen Bill with delicious tuning is supposed to be top notch, just hesitant to run another tune after my previous experience.

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[mxsled]

Originally Posted by vtmike

Not 100% but could have been more load dependent. I also had a tip in knock issue with the tune that was never resolved. It was the fa20club stage 2, got it before the fall out.

From everything I've seen Bill with delicious tuning is supposed to be top notch, just hesitant to run another tune after my previous experience.

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same here!
the tune from fa20club i had have full of click sound(tip in knock) when i press the throttle
he said it was normal
in this vid you can hear the tip in knock and also hear the VVT noise
[ame]http://youtu.be/g8nnFeP7ib0[/ame]


it's an old video,now I have a Jdl header /moto east tune and no more clicking sound and VVT noise

[Luckrider]

Originally Posted by vtmike

Not 100% but could have been more load dependent. I also had a tip in knock issue with the tune that was never resolved. It was the fa20club stage 2, got it before the fall out.

From everything I've seen Bill with delicious tuning is supposed to be top notch, just hesitant to run another tune after my previous experience.

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That is totally understandable. Tip-In knock seems to be very prevalent and it looks like people are pulling timing down low to prevent it. As for the noise, I have noticed it is even louder on an incline which is what makes me say it is load dependent.