Terrible Resale Value?

[darthpnoy1984]

Thats why if you mod the car. Mod it tastefully subtle but simple.


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[paiceyfan]

Low resale means I can get another one for the track...awesome!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by paiceyfan

Low resale means I can get another one for the track...awesome!

Strangely enough the guys selling them all complain about how little they get and the guys buying them all complain about how expensive a used one is.

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Strangely enough the guys selling them all complain about how little they get and the guys buying them all complain about how expensive a used one is.

Whoever said it earlier nailed a huge detail that seems to cause this.

Sellers want to sell private party because more money in the pocket.
Buyers want to buy at a dealership because they need financing to afford it.

This is driving up the price at the dealerships, high demand, low supply
Driving down the price of private party, high supply, low demand

Ideally dealerships adjust and offer better trade in values, but I believe most know they hold the power, most sellers need to trade in for a different car, most buyers need the financing.

Microcosm effects of the car loan bubble we're sitting on.

[paiceyfan]

Also, I tried to buy a car with cash recently and they nearly pushed me out of the showroom because they wanted to sell me financing...strange world.

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[Yardjass]

Originally Posted by Who8myrice

I think current used car market is controlled by young #lifestyle kids. Most of so called fixed up cars I see locally are stanced. I am not hating on them but seems like they like certain cars and price has gone up.

I'll hate on them. The price is going up because many of them are idiots. With idiots comes a greater tendency for lack of financial resources. When these idiots decide they want a "cool car" that they can't really afford, they have to use every penny they can scrape together to afford it. Then if they go to unload it, they have an unrealistic expectation of the price because they simply can't handle taking a loss on it. They do everything they can to try and make their case, including try and hype the things up and claim that they're rare. If a sufficient number of idiots do this and a sufficient number of other idiots buy into it, you start to see that sort of trend. Just look at some of the laughable prices being asked for shitbox Honda and S-chassis cars.

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Even those can be a gamble since they can go up and down in price in truly wild swings. You also have to consider the investment in storing and maintaining it for 30 or 40 years. Not like you can just park it in the back yard and sell it off later. We can't forget the fact that every single mile you drive it drops the value so you have capital tied up in something you are not even using all that time. You are way better off putting the money in the bank and collecting interest for the same period.

Yeah but savings account interest is a joke. You might as well keep your money in a safe in your house at that point. I don't account for storage fees because I have a garage and there would be some sort of cool car in there either way. Maybe one day it will be a rare/valuable one that I can hang onto for a while as an investment. There has been a 30,000 mile NSX for sale locally for a few months but I'd rather pay off my house first, haha.

Originally Posted by strat61caster

Whoever said it earlier nailed a huge detail that seems to cause this.

Sellers want to sell private party because more money in the pocket.
Buyers want to buy at a dealership because they need financing to afford it.

This is driving up the price at the dealerships, high demand, low supply
Driving down the price of private party, high supply, low demand

Ideally dealerships adjust and offer better trade in values, but I believe most know they hold the power, most sellers need to trade in for a different car, most buyers need the financing.

Microcosm effects of the car loan bubble we're sitting on.

I have to add that I could have bought mine outright and would have, had they not offered me an extremely good loan rate. Also, I looked at a bunch of private party cars but they were all in horrible condition for the age and owned by cretins. The dealership car was in great condition and very reasonably priced, comparably to what people were asking private party or even less. That's why I bought it there.


I'm not sure I agree about buyers needing the financing though. I paid almost exactly 2/3 of what my car cost new for a 20,000 mile certified used car. That's a significant savings on a car that is pretty much still new. I'm assuming the person who sold it was paid even less than that, and that since they bought and sold the car in a couple of years, they probably bought another new car that they will subsequently lose their ass on in a few years. To me that says they afford to buy new and lose big. They have money and probably only finance if they are given an attractive enough rate. Then they tank the resale value because they simply don't care about taking a big loss when they sell it.


An opposite example is the used pickup market. I was keeping track of this because I intended to buy one via low balling combined with model year end deals before I crashed my Miata and had to scoop up the twin real quick. Decently equipped V8 4x4 Rams and Silverados were going for $35k or less. That was the asking price on the sticker for a brand new, albeit, end of model year truck. Then you turn around and idiots on craigslist are asking the same price for one a year older with some mileage built up on them. I've even heard owners of these things complain about their excellent resale value, which basically tells me that they expect them to literally not depreciate at all. This to me says, they can't afford a $40k vehicle. They went out and financed something, probably for 72 or 84 months, and they use the heck out of it. Then when they decide to replace it, they expect to get all of that money back because they haven't paid a whole lot down and they can't afford to take a loss. I'm seeing some of this happen with the twins but I think those owners are just laughed off. In the truck world, those sales are actually made, which blows my mind.

[stock]

Originally Posted by paiceyfan

Also, I tried to buy a car with cash recently and they nearly pushed me out of the showroom because they wanted to sell me financing...strange world.

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They are not making the money from marking up cars now days (or I've heard) they make it from options, oil changes, financing etc.
Having cash in hand is kind of old fashioned (LOL) (great for a private sale though...) Having credit in hand means addition money for the dealership.

Think of it.
$20k from a guy with cash, or $20k from a guy with credit that means an additional $250 kickback (I honestly don't know, i'm speculating here) plus a better rate from the credit agency next time, this I have heard is true. Which means buy from "us" for a better monthly payment.
Who knows, just my thoughts from talking to as dealer last time I bought.

[RichardsFRS]

I would have never paid list for this car. Which is why i bought it used.
No way its worth what its listed for. That said, you wont find any cars that you can buy new that are worth more later or hold their value, they're cars

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by RichardsFRS

I would have never paid list for this car. Which is why i bought it used.
No way its worth what its listed for. That said, you wont find any cars that you can buy new that are worth more later or hold their value, they're cars

But still somebody has to buy new and many of those will pay list. It is worth every penny of list for those that want new. If nobody bought new there would be no used ones to buy. If everybody paid way below list it would drive the resale value of used down even further than it is.

[Celica00]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

But still somebody has to buy new and many of those will pay list. It is worth every penny of list for those that want new. If nobody bought new there would be no used ones to buy. If everybody paid way below list it would drive the resale value of used down even further than it is.

Get the hell out of here with your consumer/producer surplus, supply/demand logic.

The real reason resale value is lower is because not enough have horsepower increasing stickers.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Celica00

Get the hell out of here with your consumer/producer surplus, supply/demand logic.

The real reason resale value is lower is because not enough have horsepower increasing stickers.

Geeez how many stickers will I need to get a good value when I go to trade in my 250,000+ mile car?

[Overdrive]

Originally Posted by RichardsFRS

....you wont find any cars that you can buy new that are worth more later or hold their value, they're cars

911 GT3 RS, Cayman GT4, 918 Spyder, do and will all sell for much more than they were new. Ferrari F40, F50, and Enzo all did the same. The Ford GT from last decade was a bargain supercar when new, and sells now for triple its original value.

The Ferrari 250 GTO from 50 years ago sells on average for about $20 million today because only a handful were ever made. They cost a fraction of that when new.

So yeah, there are a few out there that will and do. They're still just cars, but they have a desirability to them and low enough volume that they appreciate since someone is willing to pay more just to have it.

[Yardjass]

Originally Posted by Overdrive

911 GT3 RS, Cayman GT4, 918 Spyder, do and will all sell for much more than they were new. Ferrari F40, F50, and Enzo all did the same. The Ford GT from last decade was a bargain supercar when new, and sells now for triple its original value.

The Ferrari 250 GTO from 50 years ago sells on average for about $20 million today because only a handful were ever made. They cost a fraction of that when new.

So yeah, there are a few out there that will and do. They're still just cars, but they have a desirability to them and low enough volume that they appreciate since someone is willing to pay more just to have it.

You don't even have to go that rare or expensive. I've heard of people trading Jeep Wranglers and 4x4 Tacomas back to dealerships for more than they paid to buy them new. I was recently looking at 4x4 v8 silverados and the end of the year clearance stickers on new ones were less than those in the used market. Even not on clearance, there is hardly depreciation over the first five years or so, even with high mileage.

[Adam_L]

Originally Posted by Yardjass

An opposite example is the used pickup market. I was keeping track of this because I intended to buy one via low balling combined with model year end deals before I crashed my Miata and had to scoop up the twin real quick. Decently equipped V8 4x4 Rams and Silverados were going for $35k or less. That was the asking price on the sticker for a brand new, albeit, end of model year truck. Then you turn around and idiots on craigslist are asking the same price for one a year older with some mileage built up on them. I've even heard owners of these things complain about their excellent resale value, which basically tells me that they expect them to literally not depreciate at all. This to me says, they can't afford a $40k vehicle. They went out and financed something, probably for 72 or 84 months, and they use the heck out of it. Then when they decide to replace it, they expect to get all of that money back because they haven't paid a whole lot down and they can't afford to take a loss. I'm seeing some of this happen with the twins but I think those owners are just laughed off. In the truck world, those sales are actually made, which blows my mind.

Yeah, used truck prices can be crazy. I haven't followed GMC/Chevy, Ford, Dodge , but in the last few years I've mainly followed Toyota Tundra's and Tacoma's (2000+ model years). Used prices are down right scarry. Ex. 2009 Tacoma Pre-runner V6 , 100,000 miles, $22k. You might as well just go buy new, bit the bullet.

There are some deals on Nissan Frontier (smaller V6) , or Tundra's from 2000-2006 ... but again you have to keep your eyes pealed.. daily. Tacoma's get gobbled up , clean reasonably priced examples. Honda Ridgeline isn't a truck... it's a Subaru Brat on steroids. The Mitsubishi Raider looks interesting... looking into that.