Cars.com FR-S review

[Sport-Tech]

http://www.cars.com/scion/fr-s/2013/...s/?revid=58456

Overall very favourable but the reviewer notes a lack of power.

[SuqMadiq]

Main reason I wont be buying one. I get that its great for handling, but you do need some power to accelerate out of the corners and when you're ascending hills. Even if the engine maintains its peak torque for most of the curve, it doesn't have a lot to start with.

I understand turbos don't feel as pure as a naturally aspirated engine, but I would sure as hell prefer the engine the later Cobalt SS's had. Turbo 4cyl with about 260hp/260tq and an optional GM mod to bump it up to 300hp/300tq.

This car has a lot going for it, but it seriously lacks balls.

[switchlanez]

Originally Posted by SuqMadiq

Main reason I wont be buying one. I get that its great for handling, but you do need some power to accelerate out of the corners and when you're ascending hills. Even if the engine maintains its peak torque for most of the curve, it doesn't have a lot to start with.

I understand turbos don't feel as pure as a naturally aspirated engine, but I would sure as hell prefer the engine the later Cobalt SS's had. Turbo 4cyl with about 260hp/260tq and an optional GM mod to bump it up to 300hp/300tq.

This car has a lot going for it, but it seriously lacks balls.

Then you should get a Cobalt SS.

Toyota/Subaru intended for power to be added by the owner later. They had rather focused on developing a low CoG and lightweight platform - things the owner can't as easily add later/would cost waaay more. Instead the owner starts on a launching pad with much greater potential. They give us a spectacular skeleton with enough meat; we just add some muscle. Light to moderate power upgrades can bring it on par with more expensive sports cars for less cost.

I'd rather have it with sufficient power/lower cost with a ridiculous platform than more factory power with a Cobalt SS platform. If we could have the awesome platform with high power all from the factory, it would be in the bleak $30k+ sports car segment. Less attainable and proven to lead to extinction (S2K then RX-8). Who wants Toyota to make it a 3-peat? So it's either more power or more attainable. Toyota chose the lesser of the two evils.

[KeepGuessing]

^^^You talk about the Cobalt SS like it's some terrible platform for performance driving..

You do realize the cobalt SS managed to hold the record for fastest production FWD car around the nurburgring

It lapped the nurburgring faster than the Boxster S (something this car won't come close to doing.

It lapped Leguna seca faster than the Evolution 9..(Something this car won't come close to doing)

It lapped VIR faster than a GR WRX STi, 335i M Sport, Audi S5 and Gen Coupe 3.8...

The Cobalt SS was a highly accomplished and highly capable car, drivetrain and platform..To deny it THAT is just a huge glaring "I don't know a damn thing about it other than people consider it cheap and it used to be a cavalier"

Seriously sir, don't spout off about cars you really have no idea about other than "herp derp it's cheap" because the Cobalt SS, much like the neon SRT4 were both cars that were cheaper than this "thing" and offered a hell of a lot more to the "performance enthusiast" crowd than any scion ever released.

The car was arguably ugly...arguably "cheap" in interior quality.. and everyone owned a cobalt....But it was fast, it produced power, it's engine and gearbox were sound and capable...and it's chassis was equally able..the same goes for the Saturn Ion Redline...and even MORE SO once it became a Turbocharged car instead of supercharged.

Lastly..To say "Subaru wanted to give you the better blank slate" Thus far even the IDEA of producing moderate power numbers is still up in the air. The inclusion of direct injection just to get the crazy old man behind this car's goal of 100HP per liter (of which Direct injection was NOT necessary they just didn't want to build too good of an engine apparently) has been the single greatest obstacle in determining this cars ability at producing power in the aftermarket (of which this car was supposed to be the "clean slate starting point" for)....

And with "common" upgrades....not silly things like bra and plastic-laminate liners to protect from rocks..the AVG things you'd expect to find in 50-60% of the various models sitting at the lot..Can see a final price tag of 30k quite easily on this car...Especially considering the automatic ups it from 25k to 26k tax destination tags add another grand onto it and apparently the radio will be roughly another ~1000...you're looking at a 6 speed Auto with radio and nothing else costing 28k....

[sprintertrueno86]

Originally Posted by KeepGuessing

^^^You talk about the Cobalt SS like it's some terrible platform for performance driving..

You do realize the cobalt SS managed to hold the record for fastest production FWD car around the nurburgring

It lapped the nurburgring faster than the Boxster S (something this car won't come close to doing.

It lapped Leguna seca faster than the Evolution 9..(Something this car won't come close to doing)

It lapped VIR faster than a GR WRX STi, 335i M Sport, Audi S5 and Gen Coupe 3.8...

im gettin a cobalt ss then

[Bristecom]

Originally Posted by switchlanez

Then you should get a Cobalt SS.

Toyota/Subaru intended for power to be added by the owner later. They had rather focused on developing a low CoG and lightweight platform - things the owner can't as easily add later/would cost waaay more. Instead the owner starts on a launching pad with much greater potential. They give us a spectacular skeleton with enough meat; we just add some muscle. Light to moderate power upgrades can bring it on par with more expensive sports cars for less cost.

I'd rather have it with sufficient power/lower cost with a ridiculous platform than more factory power with a Cobalt SS platform. If we could have the awesome platform with high power all from the factory, it would be in the bleak $30k+ sports car segment. Less attainable and proven to lead to extinction (S2K then RX-8). Who wants Toyota to make it a 3-peat? So it's either more power or more attainable. Toyota chose the lesser of the two evils.

If they went with a 2.5 L, it wouldn't have cost any more money. But Tada-san wanted a higher revving car with a square bore/stroke ratio. However, I do think they should offer a version of this car with more power at some point to satisfy those who want more. Even though I like the design of this engine, I'm still worried about the power. On one hand it sounds like it will be just enough but on the other, I think I may be disappointed by the lack of a pushing feeling. I guess I will find out when I drive it.

And it's not that easy to add power (particularly torque) to an engine like this. You will likely have to void your warranty and add a turbo, supercharger, or stroke/bore the engine out. None of which I would ever want to do.

[Deslock]

Originally Posted by KeepGuessing

the cobalt SS managed to hold the record for fastest production FWD car around the nurburgring

From the Car and Driver BRZ review:

UNDERSTEER ............................... NONE

Seriously, I have nothing against the Cobalt... it's another one of those great bang for your buck cars. But if you don't mind FWD, there's no reason to be interested in the FT86 (and thus no reason to be on this forum).

[tripjammer]

Going uphill in the mountains near Las Vegas, the car struggled to ascend in 5th and 6th gear; I rode out 4th gear at 65 mph just to maintain speed. Passing on the highway takes careful timing and patience to pick the right spot because the FR-S doesn't jump away at higher speeds once the accelerator is mashed.

Damn!

[brewksy]

I own a redline. It served me very well and has a lot of potential!

It also has a terrible interior, shoddy build quality, and the worst steering feel I've ever felt in a vehicle. There's no doubt its fast - with the stage 2 upgrade from GM it is incredibly quick and has an immediate power response due to the supercharger. But it's also fat - and feels like it no matter how much power you add to it.

So it beat some cars around a track? Big deal. You will not enjoy driving it as much as a lighter (slower) car.

[SUB-FT86]

I have a feeling when and if Subaru puts a 2.0T/1.6T boxer in this car it will be the best sports car for the money. I am opposed to turbo's but this car would be crazy with it. You can have sharp handling with brisk everyday acceleration(Have your cake and eat it too). And I believe it can be done with prices closer to a 3.8 R-Spec Genesis coupe(29k)

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by SuqMadiq

Main reason I wont be buying one. I get that its great for handling, but you do need some power to accelerate out of the corners and when you're ascending hills. Even if the engine maintains its peak torque for most of the curve, it doesn't have a lot to start with.

I understand turbos don't feel as pure as a naturally aspirated engine, but I would sure as hell prefer the engine the later Cobalt SS's had. Turbo 4cyl with about 260hp/260tq and an optional GM mod to bump it up to 300hp/300tq.

This car has a lot going for it, but it seriously lacks balls.

Like Switch stated. Go buy Cobalt SS. Cobalt SS is a great car, it's damn fast for sure. I've driven 600hp GT-R (R32) to 90hp Cappuccino. I can tell you one thing, FR-S got some balls. It'll give you bigger balls to master this car than any other current car in this price range... hell even in $60k price range it still won't have bigger balls than this car.

Again, if you want high up hp with turbo, go for it.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

Going uphill in the mountains near Las Vegas, the car struggled to ascend in 5th and 6th gear; I rode out 4th gear at 65 mph just to maintain speed. Passing on the highway takes careful timing and patience to pick the right spot because the FR-S doesn't jump away at higher speeds once the accelerator is mashed.

Damn!

What? Which Up hill? Cuz I drove 90% of 65MPH, I was in 6th gear. Other 10%, I was checking the tq drop in 3k~4.5k RPM

[ahausheer]

Laps times don't matter to much when it comes to road cars. Ferrari Enzo himself owned a few original minis because he had fun in them. As a gay man said to a straight guy, ''Im not gay either its just about having fun''.


EDIT: not gay, despite my pink avatar, not that there's anything wrong with that.

[Sport-Tech]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

Going uphill in the mountains near Las Vegas, the car struggled to ascend in 5th and 6th gear; I rode out 4th gear at 65 mph just to maintain speed. Passing on the highway takes careful timing and patience to pick the right spot because the FR-S doesn't jump away at higher speeds once the accelerator is mashed.

Damn!

Don't forget he's down about 30 hp from sea level power here. No problem for me at 250 ft.