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View Poll Results: How many 86 owners are planning on getting the Supra?
I'm definitely getting one 27 12.80%
I might get one if they offer a MT 83 39.34%
No, not me. 101 47.87%
Voters: 211. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-16-2019, 12:33 PM   #253
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Originally Posted by Dave-ROR View Post
And? We shall ignore that it's barely faster than a Civic just because they aren't in the same class? Toyota's premium sports car is just barely faster than a "supped up econobox". And you find that to be a good or acceptable thing? Seriously? If I were Toyota I wouldn't even release that time if it really does run a 7:40 or slower.

And older chassis sucked in comparison to modern chassis. Modern performance cars are much better performance cars than their older versions.
Wait, its a bad thing to be close to a Civic Type R on the ring?

How about the fact that this car is faster than its target competition a Porsche Cayman S 718, a car which in its most basic stripper configuration is $20k more? And even slightly equipped is $30k more???
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Old 01-16-2019, 12:49 PM   #254
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Originally Posted by tennisfreak View Post
Wait, its a bad thing to be close to a Civic Type R on the ring?

How about the fact that this car is faster than its target competition a Porsche Cayman S 718, a car which in its most basic stripper configuration is $20k more? And even slightly equipped is $30k more???
I'd buy the Porsche, because manual

The Supra might just be magical to drive.. but it's a Z4... so probably won't be.
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Old 01-16-2019, 12:53 PM   #255
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Originally Posted by Dave-ROR View Post
And? We shall ignore that it's barely faster than a Civic just because they aren't in the same class? Toyota's premium sports car is just barely faster than a "supped up econobox". And you find that to be a good or acceptable thing? Seriously? If I were Toyota I wouldn't even release that time if it really does run a 7:40 or slower.

And older chassis sucked in comparison to modern chassis. Modern performance cars are much better performance cars than their older versions.
The Supra was raced and was built to compete (the best it could) with the Skyline and other track focused cars, but it did it with reliability and brute strength. The performance you see from the MKIV is mostly drag and rolling highway races. I know the market is oober track focused these days, but Toyota never said it was their intention to design a track monster from their grand touring sports carójust a drive focused car. Do you think Aston Martin cares or their buyers care that the V12 Vantage S in 2014 ran a 7:52 or their 2017 V8 Vantage GT8 ran a 7:50?

The supped up Civic was faster than these new cars: 718 Cayman S (7:46), the Audi TTRS (7:48), Lotus Exige (7:48), BMW M2 Competition (7:52), etc, not to mention a whole host of other cars just five to ten years ago we would car supercars or hypercars like a Bugatti and a Zonda (7:44) or Audi R8, Ferraris, Lamborghinis, etc.

And what if the time they release is 7:38? Then will you sigh in relief?
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Old 01-16-2019, 12:55 PM   #256
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Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
The Supra was raced and was built to compete (the best it could) with the Skyline and other track focused cars, but it did it with reliability and brute strength. The performance you see from the MKIV is mostly drag and rolling highway races. I know the market is oober track focused these days, but Toyota never said it was their intention to design a track monster from their grand touring sports carójust a drive focused car. Do you think Aston Martin cares or their buyers care that the V12 Vantage S in 2014 ran a 7:52 or their 2017 V8 Vantage GT8 ran a 7:50?

The supped up Civic was faster than these new cars: 718 Cayman S (7:46), the Audi TTRS (7:48), Lotus Exige (7:48), BMW M2 Competition (7:52), etc, not to mention a whole host of other cars just five to ten years ago we would car supercars or hypercars like a Bugatti and a Zonda (7:44) or Audi R8, Ferraris, Lamborghinis, etc.

And what if the time they release is 7:38? Then will you sigh in relief?
Relief? No, but it'll better justify it's price tag.

I still have no interest in this car. For 35-40K.. maybe. Actually, I'd be far more interested just if it were a Toyota effort vs BMW. I refuse to ever touch another modern BMW.
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Old 01-16-2019, 01:15 PM   #257
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I'd buy the Porsche, because manual

The Supra might just be magical to drive.. but it's a Z4... so probably won't be.
See and I would skip the Porsche because its a 4 banger.

The ZF-8 is a great auto (in my current car) and when wanting manual mode I'm fine with paddle shifting.

Choosing a compromise I'd take the inline 6 and live with the auto over a 4 banger.
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Old 01-16-2019, 01:29 PM   #258
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Originally Posted by tennisfreak View Post
How about the fact that this car is faster than its target competition a Porsche Cayman S 718, a car which in its most basic stripper configuration is $20k more? And even slightly equipped is $30k more???
The Nurburing does not penalize a car for being heavy much. Look at the time that the "boat" 2018 ZL1 Camaro ($62K) put up last year. I am betting the Cayman will out perform the Supra on US tracks where testing will be done like VIR and Laguna Seca. The 350LB weight advantage of the Cayman will show up there.

You also are not going to buy a Supra under $50K anytime soon. The first 1500 will be $56K Release Models.

I am not in the market for either of these cars. I like the Supra more now that I have seen the released version. However, if I was going to pick one or the other, it would be the Cayman (even with the PDK).

Honestly though, if the Supra was an all Japanese made car then I would probably move it ahead of the German made Porsche. (Personal bias based on 48 years of experience owning cars from various countries!)
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Old 01-16-2019, 01:37 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by Rampage View Post
The Nurburing does not penalize a car for being heavy much. Look at the time that the "boat" 2018 ZL1 Camaro ($62K) put up last year. I am betting the Cayman will out perform the Supra on US tracks where testing will be done like VIR and Laguna Seca. The 350LB weight advantage of the Cayman will show up there.

You also are not going to buy a Supra under $50K anytime soon. The first 1500 will be $56K Release Models.

I am not in the market for either of these cars. I like the Supra more now that I have seen the released version. However, if I was going to pick one or the other, it would be the Cayman (even with the PDK).

Honestly though, if the Supra was an all Japanese made car then I would probably move it ahead of the German made Porsche. (Personal bias based on 48 years of experience owning cars from various countries!)
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...-2017-feature/

Idk about all that. Those things are seriously respectable, even on more technical tracks. Can't wait to see actual testing of the new supra.
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Old 01-16-2019, 01:45 PM   #260
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Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k View Post
Altogether I have to say that this new Supra makes me appreciate the BRZ/GT86 considerably more that I did previously.
Am I the only one that sees the irony in the fact that if so many people got the inline 6, 300+HP, better quality interior, more aggressively styled 86 they have whined about for 6 years it would have spec'd out almost exactly as the Supra does? That includes weight and price.
The big mistake that I see here is simply that Toyota named and marketed this car as a Supra successor. I have said all along that it may be a great car but it is so far removed from what was the Supra was that the name no longer applies.
Oh and it is BMW which I have always despised but that is a personal view and does not take away from the yet to be proven abilities of the car.
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:07 PM   #261
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Originally Posted by conehead View Post
Yay! The styling of Toyota with the reliability of BMW all wrapped in to one car, just like everyone was asking for!
The internet is full of weird fetishes. I'm sure someone licks their lips at that thought.
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:22 PM   #262
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Am I the only one that sees the irony in the fact that if so many people got the inline 6, 300+HP, better quality interior, more aggressively styled 86 they have whined about for 6 years it would have spec'd out almost exactly as the Supra does? That includes weight and price.
The big mistake that I see here is simply that Toyota named and marketed this car as a Supra successor. I have said all along that it may be a great car but it is so far removed from what was the Supra was that the name no longer applies.
Oh and it is BMW which I have always despised but that is a personal view and does not take away from the yet to be proven abilities of the car.
eh, to be fair 2JZ GT86 builds don't add nearly 700 lbs...then throw in the no manual it makes for a tough pill to swallow. I don't think this was what people had in mind when they were crying about the twins, at least it wasn't what I had envisioned..
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:29 PM   #263
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Originally Posted by tennisfreak View Post
See and I would skip the Porsche because its a 4 banger.

The ZF-8 is a great auto (in my current car) and when wanting manual mode I'm fine with paddle shifting.

Choosing a compromise I'd take the inline 6 and live with the auto over a 4 banger.
Instead I just took a V8 with a 6MT that passes any new Porsche south of a GT3.. for less than the new Supra costs.
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:30 PM   #264
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eh, to be fair 2JZ GT86 builds don't add nearly 700 lbs...then throw in the no manual it makes for a tough pill to swallow. I don't think this was what people had in mind when they were crying about the twins, at least it wasn't what I had envisioned..
2jZ builds also do not meet the crash test and reliability requirements that the manufacturer has to. Sure you can get away with putting an engine in but from the factory they would need to beef up pretty much everything to deal with the increased power. To them it is not just a matter of dropping in whatever engine they want and calling it a day. A factory made 86 with a 2JZ in it could very well gain 700 pounds.


A very quick look at weights (not verified ) shows the 2JZ at 700 pounds and the FA20 at 377. There is half you weight difference all at once.
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:32 PM   #265
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Originally Posted by Summerwolf View Post
https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...-2017-feature/

Idk about all that. Those things are seriously respectable, even on more technical tracks. Can't wait to see actual testing of the new supra.
He said ZL1, not ZL1 1LE (and based on the price, he meant the regular ZL1).

However, even the regular ZL1 is a serious piece of hardware at the track. The ZL1 1LE is far superior, but also a *terrible* street car.
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Old 01-16-2019, 02:33 PM   #266
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Am I the only one that sees the irony in the fact that if so many people got the inline 6, 300+HP, better quality interior, more aggressively styled 86 they have whined about for 6 years it would have spec'd out almost exactly as the Supra does? That includes weight and price.
The big mistake that I see here is simply that Toyota named and marketed this car as a Supra successor. I have said all along that it may be a great car but it is so far removed from what was the Supra was that the name no longer applies.
Oh and it is BMW which I have always despised but that is a personal view and does not take away from the yet to be proven abilities of the car.
haha at first I was like "He's forgetting it's a shitty BMW!" but then you added that part at the end.
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