Catted vs Catless Headers Power Gains differences

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Detroiter

I've always felt the same way when people bring up emissions on a sports car forum. It just doesn't really make any sense. I get the whole wanting to not pollute the environment and am actually somewhat of a "tree hugger" in that sense.

But I don't think people realize that if you combine every single sports car enthusiast on the planet and take into account that MAYBE half of them run a catless car the amount of emissions comparable to the rest of the world's cars, semi trucks, trains, freight ships, power plants, military equipment, ect... is so small that it would be hardly noticeable to change it to everyone running a full catted setup.

http://www.enfos.com/blog/2015/06/23...-million-cars/
There are plenty of articles about this and completely proves that sports cars are in no way the problem.

So i say to all the car enthusiasts out there, if your area does not do emissions testing, don't worry about running catless

There is a massive difference between sitting in traffic with 1,000 uncatted cars (up to the late 70s) and sitting in traffic where one of those 1,000 cars may have a cat or two removed. Anybody that drove through the pre emissions era will know what I mean.


The cumulative effect of all the lawnmowers running each summer is probably far greater than the effect of the total cars with bypassed emission control systems and the pre controls system vehicles still on the road.

[Detroiter]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

There is a massive difference between sitting in traffic with 1,000 uncatted cars (up to the late 70s) and sitting in traffic where one of those 1,000 cars may have a cat or two removed. Anybody that drove through the pre emissions era will know what I mean.


The cumulative effect of all the lawnmowers running each summer is probably far greater than the effect of the total cars with bypassed emission control systems and the pre controls system vehicles still on the road.

Don't get me wrong I definitely understand this and I feel like it goes towards my point. I would never condone that the mass public run there cars catless. It would lead to so much smog and pollution in densely populated areas. I was just meaning that since the percentage of population that are car enthusiasts that mod their cars is so low that it has no noticeable effect on pollution.

I'd be willing to bet that metro Detroit has one of the higher densities of catless sports cars in the US at least, most of them being V8's producing more emissions than our cars, and there hasn't been a time when I felt I could smell other cars non catalyst burnt exhaust unless they were driving directly in front of me.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Detroiter

Don't get me wrong I definitely understand this and I feel like it goes towards my point. I would never condone that the mass public run there cars catless. It would lead to so much smog and pollution in densely populated areas. I was just meaning that since the percentage of population that are car enthusiasts that mod their cars is so low that it has no noticeable effect on pollution.

I'd be willing to bet that metro Detroit has one of the higher densities of catless sports cars in the US at least, most of them being V8's producing more emissions than our cars, and there hasn't been a time when I felt I could smell other cars non catalyst burnt exhaust unless they were driving directly in front of me.

LOL I was agreeing with you. Detroit in 1976 was total hell to drive through. You got stuck in one of those underpasses and you almost choked to death. The percentage of cars without cats now is so low I doubt you would even get a whiff in the same situation today.

[Detroiter]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

LOL I was agreeing with you. Detroit in 1976 was total hell to drive through. You got stuck in one of those underpasses and you almost choked to death. The percentage of cars without cats now is so low I doubt you would even get a whiff in the same situation today.

Oh yeah after reading it again I get that now haha. I can only imagine how terrible it was. I would not want to drive here back then especially on a 90 degree 90% humidity summer day stuck in rush hour traffic it would be complete hell.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Detroiter

Oh yeah after reading it again I get that now haha. I can only imagine how terrible it was. I would not want to drive here back then especially on a 90 degree 90% humidity summer day stuck in rush hour traffic it would be complete hell.

It was interesting.

[Jyn]

I kept a HFC in my front pipe to help with my emissions. To me, the trade off in power + the highly reduced lifespan of a catted header meant that it's pretty wasteful to put the cat. converter in a header, but totally acceptable for one in the front pipe.

Idk, I've always taken a 'gray' viewpoint on issues rather than a 'black' or 'white' vantage.

[Jyn]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

Same reason a topic on HID install goes into the ethical ramifications of doing an HID install.

I don't believe so. If you're putting HIDs in a reflective housing and not at least attempting to aim them properly, there's inherent danger to fellow motorists. Whereas when my 4Runner's bulb went out, putting HIDs in the OEM projector headlights and ensuring they align with DOT's specifications for headlight beam pattern is acceptable.

Unless I completely missed the ethical discussion you're referring to

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Jyn

I can't believe I'm reading concerns about "modifying your exhaust system is illegal" on a forum dedicated to a sports car in a section about modifying components of your car... I'm so confused.

Of course it is illegal. It is not related with CO2 or consumption. It is related with poison materials that are not filtered.


Yes times have evolved and we are in better position than the '70s. Does this give us an excuse and pretend that it is OK for a few car enthusiasts to do whatever they want? Same can be said for street racing or other illegal activities. And besides, how much can you gain by removing a cat? 3-5hp? I would never take the risk for such a low gain.

[StraightOuttaCanadaEh]

for me it's just the nasty ass smell and being polite to the people in cars behind me

[Summerwolf]

Originally Posted by Jyn

I don't believe so. If you're putting HIDs in a reflective housing and not at least attempting to aim them properly, there's inherent danger to fellow motorists. Whereas when my 4Runner's bulb went out, putting HIDs in the OEM projector headlights and ensuring they align with DOT's specifications for headlight beam pattern is acceptable.

Unless I completely missed the ethical discussion you're referring to

You did. You could argue there is inherent danger to fellow motorists by taking out the cats as well.


Besides, your halogen projector lights are not the same as HID projectors and you're inherently endangering motorists anyways....the only way to truly do HIDs correctly is a hacked up headlight with true HID retrofit projectors....... see the discussion. It never ends. Its a freaking rabbit hole.


So is the catalytic convertor topic.

[Jyn]

Originally Posted by StraightOuttaCanadaEh

for me it's just the nasty ass smell and being polite to the people in cars behind me

The smell is minimal with a good HFC in the front pipe. Diesels produce more shit/smell than my car (then again, I'm in Texas).

[Jyn]

Originally Posted by Summerwolf

You did. You could argue there is inherent danger to fellow motorists by taking out the cats as well.


Besides, your halogen projector lights are not the same as HID projectors and you're inherently endangering motorists anyways....the only way to truly do HIDs correctly is a hacked up headlight with true HID retrofit projectors....... see the discussion. It never ends. Its a freaking rabbit hole.


So is the catalytic convertor topic.

You are right that it's "not the same," however, it meets the DOT's specifications.

There's multiple ways to solve a mathematical equation, but so long as the combination of variables gives the correct solution, is that not what matters? Same principle with the HIDs.

As for the HFC, totally agree that only having 1 HFC in front pipe < 2 HFC < 2 OEM cat. converters. It just becomes someone's preference in where they draw the line with respect to their own personal preference. I'm simply stating a case for my position, but I don't mean to say mine is the end-all-be-all.

[22R]

All I know is I love the smell of my fire breathing smoke belching 245 Horsepower Mercury XR6 2 stroke outboard in the AM. No cat on dat !

[Somerandom18]

Go E85. The smell is nice and sweet.

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