FR-S vs. 370z, end all be all of discussions

[crazyyankeefan]

Well, personally I think it's fun to discuss all cars here. For all those aspects in discussion here, you can certainly talk about weight issue within the relatively similar sizes of cars.

[aliciafrs6spd]

I agree that they are two very different cars and agree with your point.

I actually wanted a Z for a long time, but realized that I still had to save more money and probably go with an 09. I sold my acura tsx 07 and couldn't justify getting a car that is only 2 years newer which is why I ended up with the FRS.

Newer car vs. an 2009 Z to stay around the same budget

Z has more options and is a hell of a lot faster, but it starts at a much higher cost. If you want to stay in the same budget you have to get an older one and hope that someone didn't beat the piss out of it

I am happy with my FRS purchase and may try a Z next depending on where my budget is in a few years.

[unknown_370]

Originally Posted by mattles

I believe most people in the auto industry tend to rank new sports cars in the following:

1. FRS
2. Mustang
3. Miata
4. Camaro
5. 370z

Based on cost/performance/reliability. The problem is my eyes is that 370z costs too much. Sure its numbers suggest its a great car, but the driving feel, reliability, and safety are all sorely lacking compared to other cars in this segment. The Mustang has better power/speed than the 370z, whereas the FRS/BRZ has better turn-in/handling/balance, the miata is obviously lighter, more fun to drive, and the camaro has more interior space, more power, and better looks. There isnt really one thing that stands out to me about the 370z other than that sexy exhaust note.

I really don't like commenting on these kinds of threads. Main reason is because people throw in extremely biased or extensively narrow outlooks in order to justify there purchase or lack thereof. The post shows a classic case of thee...

You claim that reviewers are choosing the FR-S/BRZ lineup over all other sports cars???? If you are basing this off the car mags??? Then en all I have to say is you don't understand much about cars. For the year 2012, the 13 toyobaru's will get all positive reviews. That's just the way it is for all sports cars of a mainstream brand. The car mags responsibility now is to keep the HYPE UP and get as much owner and customer feedabck as possible to there mags and the companies based on what they write... there honest feelings won't show till year one of the long term test which is usually 3 years.

Now you say the Z doesn't stand out in this crowd???
The Z is a 332hp v6 that gets about 270rear wheel hp and under the right weather conditions and new tires can accelerate to 60 in 4.5 eseconds and the quarter in 13. Going as fast as 426 hp camaro in a straight line with almost half the displacemnt doesn't stand out. Looks are subjective and the Z has 90% less cars on the road by volume. The Z will stand out way more in a parking lot. That's a fact. Being behind the mustang by .02 seconds to 60 and .04 on the quarter is remarkable for a car lacking 2 cylinders, 90hp and gobs of torque.
The Z gets 1.01g of grip outgripping every car you mention and is extremely stable at 155mph with little to no tramilining. From what I can feel@ 155mph, the Z would do fine at its 168mph ungovorned top speed. The Z weighs 3269 with sport pkg 3283 with oil cooler and sport (12 models). The lightest of all the muscle cars and the most grip @ the highest speeds. (75mph range). There's a lot of fiction going around about the Z's saftey and lack of ability as a sports car. Most of it is hype or it comes from guys who do a lot of racing and low cost DIY maintenence on things that need to be handled by better qualified folks than the average DIY guy. I am on my second Z. Was hit broadside @ 70mph. Walked waway without a scratch... 3 months later, had another Z.

If you are shopping for a sports car??? A real sports car, to do sporty things in? How do you factor in the seat count as a comparison? As far as the hatch? 7 sqft is a lot of room for a hatch. If you need to carry passengers and own a sports car? You compromised yourself. Its not the fault of nissan. Besides that's what the G37 was built for.


I know there are many that want to compare the FR-S and Z. But its two different cars with two different visions. The FR-S was designed for the japanese local to have fun drifing on a downhill in one of japans mountainous perfectures. Not trying to drag race a Z. People comment and you comment, the Z is not as balanced as a FR-S... I won't comment because I have yet to drive both. But having driven the miata and understanding that concept. The Z is flat out offering a different driving experience. Its the median car. It can handle 90% of a miata's capability while doing 93% of a mustangs quarter mile and still offering the latest in high quality interiors and state of the art features.
The Z IS NOT EXPENSIVE. But when you're on a budget? You buy what you can get. The FR-S makes a great argument @ 25k. My dliemma looking for a car in that price would be...
Buy an FRS and get a turbo kit? Or buy a genesis 2.0T and weight reduction? It would be a toss up cuz the gencoupe is heavy (3380lbs) but comes with 4 piston brembos all around, great interior features. Aweome seats and torsen LSD. All this added to a FRS wouuld easily add 200lbs. Then you go for the turbo? That's another 200lbs. So you would get all that done for 300hp and 3160lbs. Considering the extremely low amount of NA torque? That boost won't help much over 115mph. Not without some seriously expensive mods.

In other words... everything is a trade off. You can pay now or later. I think the FRS and BRZ are awesome. And depending on how much you want to mechanically alter? It can be a fast car too...

But don't lose sight of what another car is simply because you can't afford it at the moment.

All these cars on this list are good sports cars and no one on this list will be a ferrari sooo... it is what it is.

[Kunzite]

FTR, the GT 86 seats are very nice, and it has a Torsen LSD.

[KeepGuessing]

Threads like this always make me laugh, due to there being 1 "unknown 370" and a objective look on the situation for every 60 "*Insert random pro of this car in comparison to another car which is aimed at a different demographic as if it was some nail in the coffin*"

With a huge sprinkling of Google-expert know-how on a subject they haven't discussed with anyone or dealt with issues involving said subject outside of a forum.

1: This cars small and fun to drive...It comes with a huge helping of cons. Most of you are either going to be blind to them because this car is gods gift to you and your Bro's, or going to deflect/spin them trying to dispute their relative importance based solely on a hypothetical buyer and his/her specific needs stating them as your own.

2: This car makes sense to people who find a Scion TC just too "sensible" but not fun enough, or people who want a Miata but don't want the stimga associated with it and a bit MORE practicality....That's really about it, everyone else isn't going to be making this their Excalibur of the asphault. It'll be their enjoyable car and not much more because that's about all this was intended to be. If you're NOT one of those people you're looking into the wrong car, get off the bandwagon stop blabbering because it really takes away from all the well thought out and informative posts here.

3. I'm hoping this car pulls the wool back from AT-LEAST a few peoples eyes as to the "credibility" of a journalists review on a vehicle. Because frankly Chris Harris or any other guy with a MacBook and magazine column are giving you about 1/10th of the story that is "This car". In the RATIONAL world, owning a car for 24 hours gives you as much right/credibility to give opinions on this car as a tourist passing through has to describe/understand and most of all "Rank" your Town/City/State..

For instance...
12 people driving this car around a race course 3 times telling you how much better this car "feels in the corner" and how much more "crisp the response is" Is hair spray to a flame...

It doesn't tell you that from an engineering standpoint a majority of the suspension components were engineered without enough finite element analysis resulting in a low safety factor. One example of such "poor engineering" was the front lower control arms. The car was designed with weight saving paramount, this resulting in very thin stamped parts in the suspension. Which is why when the member was installing LCA's he could deform the part using his own strength, which means installing poly or heaven forbid delrin bushings you are (not might..You ARE) going to tear your control arm unless it's replaced with a solid more rigid unit. I can promise you it's not going to be limited to LCA's chances are a plethora of problems will arise underneath the car if stiff bushings are installed throughout without reinforcement.

It doesn't let you know that the dealer will shaft you in xx-xxx miles because the maintenance at that point calls for the engine to be lifted for service..

It doesn't tell you that you could have one of the cars that shutters when it idles and makes a noise etc etc.

All of those "variables" that are factors of a consumer product and NOT "binned" model making the rounds for testing.

I am personally still not sold on this car, but I have been developing a growing fondess with it every time i drive around my pals, but there is going to be a ceiling/wall in this car that's going to be hit very soon into tuning and very costly to break through, and the last thing I want to do with a new car is replace it's engine....

The Z is "comparatively" boring but it's NOT a boring car...I don't see how people can compare this cars heads up because that's dumb but the dealership price spikes are bringing costs dangerously close...But really the Z is as awesome as this car hands down...you pick either you won't be the "loser" it's just 2 diff sides to the same coin.

[was385]

Through about six weeks of ownership, I've noticed that the 370z owners are the only ones who fairly consistently (I'd say about 40% of the time), feel the need to rev their engine, try to race, or talk their own cars up to me. Mustang, GTi, Genesis Coupe, etc. I've had almost no issues with. Has anyone else noticed this? It's like they have a huge inferiority complex or maybe I've just come across the worst of that ownership group.

[industrial]

Originally Posted by was385

Through about six weeks of ownership, I've noticed that the 370z owners are the only ones who fairly consistently (I'd say about 40% of the time), feel the need to rev their engine, try to race, or talk their own cars up to me. Mustang, GTi, Genesis Coupe, etc. I've had almost no issues with. Has anyone else noticed this? It's like they have a huge inferiority complex or maybe I've just come across the worst of that ownership group.

Well the Mustang and GTI are pretty much in a completely different category than the brz/370z/genesis coupe. The 370 guys I've ran across have been the most jerkiest types around here too. It was the same in my STI too. They act like they are driving a Ferrari or something.

[KeepGuessing]

Let me explain why this is..

1...Mustang owners have better things to do. They don't care if they have a v6 or a v8 mustang they know their car is faster they don't feel the need to waste the gas it's pointless to them

2...370z owners are in possession of a 300HP Car that everyone seems to treat like it's making 110...They're probably frustrated with all the "omg look it's a FRS" credit this car is getting for doing absolutely nothing. They don't seem to grasp that the masses are dumb and they need to try trying to appeal to them or cater to them. They're somewhat miffed by the idea that 90% of the people who talk negative about their car have never driven/ridden in a Z made anytime past the year 2000 and have little to no understanding of vehicle dynamics past a coupe episodes of Best MOTORing and a 2 year subscription to Import Tuner Magazine, yet will throw out phrases like "Sloppy feel" and "No Driver Feedback" because they read it in a few articles comparing the two..So they want to race you to show the owner of these cars that they bought a car that has a huge focus on handling capability when 99.9% of the time when these cars ARE compared it's going to be on a straight flat road with no corners and no influence other than power production....

3. GTi owners are too busy buying clothes for their cat brewing espresso and making their way to Vermont or some other New England state in order to marry their life partner to race

4.. Gen Coupe owners either don't care, or they do care and they're pissed that you can't hear them revving due to the turbocharger muffling HIS exhaust sound while your intake accessory amplifies your own engine note in the cabin......

People these days tend to want to drive around a car that offer them theoretical performance and circumstantial feel vs sheer pleasure...

The Real world is filling with Benchmark racers...even in real life...

[industrial]

Originally Posted by KeepGuessing

The Real world is filling with Benchmark racers...even in real life...

Man throwing down the iron Fist like a Russian ninja rouge. The consequences will never be the same.

[crazyyankeefan]

Originally Posted by KeepGuessing

Let me explain why this is..

1...Mustang owners have better things to do. They don't care if they have a v6 or a v8 mustang they know their car is faster they don't feel the need to waste the gas it's pointless to them

2...370z owners are in possession of a 300HP Car that everyone seems to treat like it's making 110...They're probably frustrated with all the "omg look it's a FRS" credit this car is getting for doing absolutely nothing. They don't seem to grasp that the masses are dumb and they need to try trying to appeal to them or cater to them. They're somewhat miffed by the idea that 90% of the people who talk negative about their car have never driven/ridden in a Z made anytime past the year 2000 and have little to no understanding of vehicle dynamics past a coupe episodes of Best MOTORing and a 2 year subscription to Import Tuner Magazine, yet will throw out phrases like "Sloppy feel" and "No Driver Feedback" because they read it in a few articles comparing the two..So they want to race you to show the owner of these cars that they bought a car that has a huge focus on handling capability when 99.9% of the time when these cars ARE compared it's going to be on a straight flat road with no corners and no influence other than power production....

3. GTi owners are too busy buying clothes for their cat brewing espresso and making their way to Vermont or some other New England state in order to marry their life partner to race

4.. Gen Coupe owners either don't care, or they do care and they're pissed that you can't hear them revving due to the turbocharger muffling HIS exhaust sound while your intake accessory amplifies your own engine note in the cabin......

People these days tend to want to drive around a car that offer them theoretical performance and circumstantial feel vs sheer pleasure...

The Real world is filling with Benchmark racers...even in real life...

Very interesting perspective. Ironically, I kinda agree with you here even though I currently own a Z.

I actually have never found the need to race anybody driving a Mustang, Camaro or Gen coupe. I have been taunted on the road many times by cars ranging from another Z, a 'Stang, even a M3 couple times, but I just go on as my own usual driving business while they blasted away from me at the traffic light. What's the point anyway?

Once a moded Pontiac G6 was taunting me at a red light, and he smoked me and cut in front of me on my lane when the light turned green. The next thing happend was he got pulled over by a cop after 2 blocks. This is what I call idiot. With the mod he had, I could've still easily smoked him w/ my stock 370Z if i wanted to, but why do so?

I spotted a white FR-S for the first time here around my city, and I have no problem saying that it's a hot-looking car. If it could've came out a yr earlier when I had to shop for my new ride, I would've got it in a heart beat, which could've also saved me from my ridiculous car payment on the Z......

Btw, the V6 Mustang is actually quite slow. The Z is actually faster than the V6 'Stang. Usually the Z is compared with the V8 version of 'Stang and Camaro.

[was385]

And let's qualify this, it's not the stock z owners that are doing it. It's the guys with fake carbon fiber wrapped hoods, goofy aftermarket spoilers, and the rest of the Jersey-Shore looking ricers I see around these parts. There just seem to be way too many of those unfortunately. So I don't get the feeling it's that they feel a need to disprove the doubters, I think they just all have a fantasy about being in the fast and the furious 15 or whatever they're up to.

[industrial]

Originally Posted by was385

And let's qualify this, it's not the stock z owners that are doing it. It's the guys with fake carbon fiber wrapped hoods, goofy aftermarket spoilers, and the rest of the Jersey-Shore looking ricers I see around these parts. There just seem to be way too many of those unfortunately. So I don't get the feeling it's that they feel a need to disprove the doubters, I think they just all have a fantasy about being in the fast and the furious 15 or whatever they're up to.

Brilliant idea! Fast and the furious: jersey shore

They need to make this. It would be such a glorious trainwreck.

[KeepGuessing]

Originally Posted by justaquestion

Omg this x192839821487324872384

Been trying to say this since day 1. Once reviews started coming out for the FR-S/BRZ, 90% of the people on this forums vocabulary changed. Too funny.

3-4 years ago..Anyone remember discussing how important "#.## CoG" is?

granted we knew a car shouldn't be lifted and on super swampers, i can't remember anyone saying "holy crap this new porsche/ferrari/viper CG is sooo low man it's gonna be awesome thank god!" but throw "record low Center of gravity" infront of a AE86 marketing coat-tailer durring drift popularity month and whammy

[phm14]

I'm not reading this whole thread, but I have test driven a 370Z. I owned two 280Zs back in the day and loved the car, so I really wanted to like the 370. While it felt solid and fast, I wouldn't call it a "pure" sports car. Although it didn't seem like it weighed 3800lbs., road feel was very muted. Early on, there were cases of the cars overheating and going into "limp" mode on track. I'd guess that's been fixed by now, but 3800 lbs is too heavy for serious track work. That kind of weight is very hard on tires and brakes. The 86 has a laundry list of advantages in my book: track performance, mpg, weight, cargo/seating capacity, visibility, tire/brake consumption, insurance cost, cockpit, styling, price etc. Can't find any crash test ratings on the 370 to compare to the 5 star rating of the 86, so you can probably add that as well.

Edit: Forgot the super low CG of the 86 (doh!). Thanks for correcting me on the weight ZDan(3300lbs.+ on the Z). I was thinking of the G37, which I was also looking at (and test drove) at the time.
http://www.infinitiusa.com/g_coupe/specs-options